PFF Says Mahomes Is 6th Best QB In The NFL

[dtgold88]

We should all take a moment and laugh at PFF

Maybe, but to be fair they look at every player and every play and have no agenda.

 

[flyerhawk]

PFF tends to grade difficulty of a pass pretty harshly. A 10 yard pass into extremely tight coverage gets more love from them than a 50 yard bomb to a wide open receiver. Mahomes seems to be throwing to wide open receivers all the time which PFF isn't impressed with.

Their grades are useful but, like all subjective measurements, should not be treated as gospel.

 

[UK Cowboy]

Ridiculous list. Can’t believe Dak is above Wentz.

He's been above him in the standing nearly the whole damn time time they've been in the league

 

[PhillyGreen]

What a stupid fucking list. Mahomes should #1 overall. Brady is the GOAT but that does not give you permanent status as the #1 QB.

Mahomes is better than Wentz and as an Eagles homer I have to admit that. The evidence is clear. Wentz is still elite IMO but Mahomes is better. Same statement applies for Deshaun Watson.

Dak the #2 QB in the NFL is comic relief IMO. They use Dak's performance against trash teams to rank him so high but don't use the same method for Mahomes who has put up better numbers against better teams.

 

[PhillyGreen]

PFF tends to grade difficulty of a pass pretty harshly. A 10 yard pass into extremely tight coverage gets more love from them than a 50 yard bomb to a wide open receiver. Mahomes seems to be throwing to wide open receivers all the time which PFF isn't impressed with.

Their grades are useful but, like all subjective measurements, should not be treated as gospel.

I can see your point on this and even agree with it. What is PFF's excuse for Dak?

 

[flyerhawk]

I can see your point on this and even agree with it. What is PFF's excuse for Dak?

Good question. I guess they are just ignoring who these guys have played so far.

 

[sonnyblack65]

What a stupid fucking list. Mahomes should #1 overall. Brady is the GOAT but that does not give you permanent status as the #1 QB.

Mahomes is better than Wentz and as an Eagles homer I have to admit that. The evidence is clear. Wentz is still elite IMO but Mahomes is better. Same statement applies for Deshaun Watson.

Dak the #2 QB in the NFL is comic relief IMO. They use Dak's performance against trash teams to rank him so high but don't use the same method for Mahomes who has put up better numbers against better teams.

I concur Mahomes was the best QB last year, and has not changed so far this year. He throws 50 yards passes at ease, strongest arm in the game

 

[Iggloo]

Maybe Mahomes throws to wide open guys 50 yards downfield because he has a cannon for an arm and can get the ball to guys on the run unlike most QBs? The TD to Mecole Hardman against the Ravens, everyone was like "blown coverage" and yes that seemed true. But he threw a laser to the receiver before Earl Thomas could recover, that is why it went for a TD. With most QBs that is probably a long gain resulting in a tackle right after the catch, because the WR has to slow down.

 

[Pattersonca65]

Don't disagree, I think it's stupid as well, especially when you compare the teams Wentz and Mahomes played, but I am not looking at the blood and guts of their methodology so... I can't do much but give stank-eye to PFF.

Just to be clear though, are these grades adjusted for schedule or on projections or not? I am assuming no, otherwise there's no way this makes sense at all.

I don't think they are adjusted for projections. This ranking looks to be based on the first three games and it is going to change throughout the season. I am not sure about schedule.

 

[Ricky Roma]

One thing they mentioned in their analysis of Garoppolo was the 'turnover worthy' throws or whatever, and that he's been unlucky (tipped/dropped passes that result in ints) in that department. Really has been his career in SF, unfortunately. I know Mahomes had a couple of passes that could've been intercepted just against the Ravens alone - one was picked, but wiped out by an irrelevant penalty, and another went through the defenders hands and actually ended up being a completion for KC - so perhaps they are downgrading him for it.

 

[knowyourenemy]

PFF tends to grade difficulty of a pass pretty harshly. A 10 yard pass into extremely tight coverage gets more love from them than a 50 yard bomb to a wide open receiver. Mahomes seems to be throwing to wide open receivers all the time which PFF isn't impressed with.

Their grades are useful but, like all subjective measurements, should not be treated as gospel.

One problem with that view is that many times the quarterback himself has an impact on how difficult a throw is.

 

[flyerhawk]

One problem with that view is that many times the quarterback himself has an impact on how difficult a throw is.

Oh I agree. I often find their QB grades pretty baffling.

Not as baffling as their secondary grades which are pretty much useless.

 

[Mofo]

hard to argue with the GOAT. he has no business being behind prescott or watson tho. wtf? and wentz?

this list is all fucked up sans brady, wilson, and mahomes.

So... a thousand yards, 10 TDs and 0 INTs — in only 3 games, and that’s only good for 6th? LOL. He leads every category, except QB rushing, the last I checked.

I’m no Chiefs fan, but that’s messed up. I expect PFF did analysis of receiving a corps, offensive lines and offensive schemes and this is where KC makes up the deficit?

 

[jarntt]

What a stupid fucking list. Mahomes should #1 overall. Brady is the GOAT but that does not give you permanent status as the #1 QB.

Mahomes is better than Wentz and as an Eagles homer I have to admit that. The evidence is clear. Wentz is still elite IMO but Mahomes is better. Same statement applies for Deshaun Watson.

Dak the #2 QB in the NFL is comic relief IMO. They use Dak's performance against trash teams to rank him so high but don't use the same method for Mahomes who has put up better numbers against better teams.

After 5 pages are people still not getting that this is based on this year's stats and not a ranking of where they think the QBs should be ranked, but rather based on what the current year data shows them?

 

[jarntt]

I can see your point on this and even agree with it. What is PFF's excuse for Dak?

No excuse. He is playing lights out. If any QB put up the numbers for a career that Dak has for the first 3 games this year they would go down as the greatest QB in the history of the NFL by a HUGE margin. The fact that he isn't #1 is beyond amazing and just shows how many QBs so far this year have been incredible by any matrix. As far as Dak vs Brady vs Mahomes if you don't understand PFF you aren't going to comprehend the answer...

 

[jarntt]

Good question. I guess they are just ignoring who these guys have played so far.

Who you play comes into the equation, but not when analyzing your weekly data. It's on a play to play basis. In theory the Giants leaving guys wide open because their DBs stink wouldn't make Dak's stats according to PFF as impressive as if he put up the same numbers but guys were all in tight coverage. They don't look as much at how teams have done in other games because it isn't relevant to their grading system. The same holds true for Mahomes when his speedy WRs or coaches great game plan lead to Sammy Watkins being 20 yards open for a TD week 1. It's considered an "easy throw". Not sure iof that makes sense or not

 

[jarntt]

So... a thousand yards, 10 TDs and 0 INTs — in only 3 games, and that’s only good for 6th? LOL. He leads every category, except QB rushing, the last I checked.

I’m no Chiefs fan, but that’s messed up. I expect PFF did analysis of receiving a corps, offensive lines and offensive schemes and this is where KC makes up the deficit?

This is what you get when you use their stupid system over a short period of time. Yet that some people waive the data at you like facts when arguing player vs player. I suspect by year end Mahomes will be #1 if he plays anywhere near the way he is right now

 

[flyerhawk]

Who you play comes into the equation, but not when analyzing your weekly data. It's on a play to play basis. In theory the Giants leaving guys wide open because their DBs stink wouldn't make Dak's stats according to PFF as impressive as if he put up the same numbers but guys were all in tight coverage. They don't look as much at how teams have done in other games because it isn't relevant to their grading system. The same holds true for Mahomes when his speedy WRs or coaches great game plan lead to Sammy Watkins being 20 yards open for a TD week 1. It's considered an "easy throw". Not sure iof that makes sense or not

Yeah. The problem is just that how tough a pass is depends solely on the judgment of the reviewer and can vary dramatically.

IMO, the only PFF grades I find useful are the OL and DL grades because the lines are almost always in frame of the camera and they have people who are only watching the play of specific players and not the result of the play like most other people do.

The rest of their grades vary from completely useless to not particularly useful.

 

[PhillyGreen]

After 5 pages are people still not getting that this is based on this year's stats and not a ranking of where they think the QBs should be ranked, but rather based on what the current year data shows them?

I an accept that this is based on this years stats. PFF just got it all wrong. Maybe whoever typed out the list made a typo. Who knows...but in any case the rankings are baffling.

Mahomes Rankings:

Completion Percentage - 6th
Yards - 1st
YPA - 1st
TD's - 1st
INT - 1st
Rating - 1st

All of that equates to a simple fact that he should be on top of the list.

 

[jarntt]

Yeah. The problem is just that how tough a pass is depends solely on the judgment of the reviewer and can vary dramatically.

IMO, the only PFF grades I find useful are the OL and DL grades because the lines are almost always in frame of the camera and they have people who are only watching the play of specific players and not the result of the play like most other people do.

The rest of their grades vary from completely useless to not particularly useful.

Exactly. I think there is a correlation, but not necessarily a meaningful one at all times. Even OL and DL. The reviewer doesn't know if the DL's responsibility was one gap or two gap or if a DE crashed down on a certain play because the LB had containment responsibilities. Also, when one DE plays T Smith twice a year and another plays a lesser tackle, they will grade out lower because they will do worse in those two games against T Smith. Like if a CB follows the best WR for the other team all game. His job is just that much harder. It's still way too subjective for my taste.