OT: Massacre at Colorado theater

[SLY]

i'm fine with owning guns. i think its ridiculous for someone to say you cant own a 10 round handgun (or shotgun or rifle) to protect yourself, or hell, go to the range and shoot it.

my beef is with anything that can control an entire room. things like grenades, RPG's, assault rifles, even semi-automatic guns with more than 15-20 rounds.

if someone breaks in to your house, you don't need an assault rifle to take them down.

I'm with you up to the rifle part. I also believe those are all illegal anyway. I know someone who keeps a couple AR's in their home. I see nothing wrong with that.

 

[jerseyjigroe]

 

[higgyfan4]

:focus:

 

[jerseyjigroe]

:focus:

It's insensitive to use emoticons with guns in them. I think we should ban them.

 

[dash]

Pretty good article (and don't get misled by the HTML title)

Why we feel like America is going to hell

 

[NorthCoastSteelersFan]

Pretty good article (and don't get misled by the HTML title)

Why we feel like America is going to hell

Yes...a good article, sir. Worth a rep.

 

[Comeds]

Well...thread pissed all over.....

 

[elocomotive]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with owning an array of firearms. It is our right as Americans and free citizens to do so. The day the government restricts my right to a firearm is truly the day I am no longer an American.

So if there is ANY kind of restriction you won't be an American? Weren't we just talking about the idiocy of absolute positions?

The Constitution allows for the ownership of guns to serve in a militia. The ONLY thing we know about that for SURE is that it is unclear what that means and what the framer intended. Reasonable interpretation says that the framers meant it to allow the states to keep armed, organized militia to defend themselves from the tyranny of the gov't in the same way. Another interpretation says that individuals can form militias of sorts and fall under that definition. I'm fine with either of those, but neither of those definitions comes with a "no restrictions ever" clause. That is nowhere in the Constitution nor has the Supreme Court supported it as an absolute, unrestricted right. Which frankly, almost no rights are, because were rights to be interpreted absolutely, they would almost certainly trample other rights in the process.

If that's your opinion, so be it. Just understand that everything thrown under the blanket of FREEDOM doesn't magically make your position a reasonable one or a more American one. It's an absolute position. Absolute positions don't create solutions.

Out of curiosity, what country will you be moving to? Most countries as nice as ours are more socially liberal and have larger Welfare states.

 

[BOSSMANPC]

Pretty good article (and don't get misled by the HTML title)

Why we feel like America is going to hell

There was an expert talking about this same topic on TV and it was very interesting. We pay more attention to what happens here than elsewhere. He mentioned the same incidents that this article did and honestly I had forgotten about most of them.

Good post dash and a rep sir.

Edit: Must spread !!

 

[jerseyjigroe]

Pretty good article (and don't get misled by the HTML title)

Why we feel like America is going to hell

Isn't funny how a Canadian journalist can write a more reasonable article than most of the US media?

 

[elocomotive]

Pretty good article (and don't get misled by the HTML title)

Why we feel like America is going to hell

Good article. Basically echoed what Boss, Comeds, myself and many others said in that other thread where we talked about the media.

 

[mattola]

Well...thread pissed all over.....

yep

Gun Control
Politics
Religion

will do that to almost any thread.

Its sad that we revert to shoving our beliefs into a thread that was turning into a little bit of a memorial for the victims. I was going to start posting a little on the ones that survived but some feel its more important to bury the topic under how many weapons and supplies they stockpile or how its not right to have guns, or how to control a room with a semi automatic rifle. I guess its more important to get your point across on yay or nay for gun control.

oh well.

 

[Nasty_Magician]

yep

Gun Control
Politics
Religion

will do that to almost any thread.

Its sad that we revert to shoving our beliefs into a thread that was turning into a little bit of a memorial for the victims. I was going to start posting a little on the ones that survived but some feel its more important to bury the topic under how many weapons and supplies they stockpile or how its not right to have guns, or how to control a room with a semi automatic rifle. I guess its more important to get your point across on yay or nay for gun control.

oh well.

Pretty much.

 

[mattola]

Pretty good article (and don't get misled by the HTML title)

Why we feel like America is going to hell

nice article dash.

one thing I want to point out again is that many are calling to kill this guy to make him feel pain for along time before death. I really believe you have to use him and break him mentally to find out the deep secrets in his brain. everything the press have shown so far is a guy who was extremely intelligent and had a bright bright future. that happens where people snap. this is the most extreme. this needs to be studied and broken down. it really does

 

[Comeds]

yep

Gun Control
Politics
Religion

will do that to almost any thread.

Its sad that we revert to shoving our beliefs into a thread that was turning into a little bit of a memorial for the victims. I was going to start posting a little on the ones that survived but some feel its more important to bury the topic under how many weapons and supplies they stockpile or how its not right to have guns, or how to control a room with a semi automatic rifle. I guess its more important to get your point across on yay or nay for gun control.

oh well.

Well it also looks like its pretty important to mock and belittle people who may disagree, even slightly, with ones own views. Unless, people actually think doing that is actually getting their own point across.

 

[mattola]

Well it also looks like its pretty important to mock and belittle people who may disagree, even slightly, with ones own views. Unless, people actually think doing that is actually getting their own point across.

was I doing that? certainly not intended if so

 

[Comeds]

was I doing that? certainly not intended if so

No, not at all.

 

[elocomotive]

yep

Gun Control
Politics
Religion

will do that to almost any thread.

Its sad that we revert to shoving our beliefs into a thread that was turning into a little bit of a memorial for the victims. I was going to start posting a little on the ones that survived but some feel its more important to bury the topic under how many weapons and supplies they stockpile or how its not right to have guns, or how to control a room with a semi automatic rifle. I guess its more important to get your point across on yay or nay for gun control.

oh well.

I don't see a more pertinent time to talk about gun control than in the wake of something like this. What we are discussing is directly related to what happened.

You are doing your memorial thing. Good for you. I don't care any more about any of those people than I do a guy who fell off his roof in Minneapolis or a woman that died of a stroke in Atlanta. I don't know them. I feel bad for their misfortune, but I won't dwell on it. A friend of mine died in his mid-30s last year b/c he fell off a boat, hit his head on the way down, and drowned. Great guy - very kind, humble, great athlete, super smart. All around one of the best people I've met in life. Gone in 5 seconds b/c he slipped. Hearing about it tore me up for days and a year later I still think about him and am sad from time-to-time. I have enough personal tragedy and challenges to dwell on the fate of people I never knew. It's horrible what happened to them, but I'd rather talk about what we can do about it and the issues than dwell on the victims. That's just me. And while I might not agree with some of the posts in here, I think they are all relevant, topical, and interesting. I don't think we should chastise people for them like we're doing insensitive gun-related puns or something.

 

[elocomotive]

You are doing your memorial thing. Good for you. I don't care any more about any of those people...

Just to clarify. I realized that without body language, inflection, etc. the "good for you" above might come off as sarcastic. It is not intended to be at all. It's not something I'm into personally, but a lot of people seem to really like and appreciate it, it's clear you are putting some thought and effort into it, and I meant "good for you" as sincerely as possible.

Just stop trying to take away my freedom of speech, Mattola... or so help me I will move to Canada!!

 

[SLY]

So if there is ANY kind of restriction you won't be an American? Weren't we just talking about the idiocy of absolute positions?

The Constitution allows for the ownership of guns to serve in a militia. The ONLY thing we know about that for SURE is that it is unclear what that means and what the framer intended. Reasonable interpretation says that the framers meant it to allow the states to keep armed, organized militia to defend themselves from the tyranny of the gov't in the same way. Another interpretation says that individuals can form militias of sorts and fall under that definition. I'm fine with either of those, but neither of those definitions comes with a "no restrictions ever" clause. That is nowhere in the Constitution nor has the Supreme Court supported it as an absolute, unrestricted right. Which frankly, almost no rights are, because were rights to be interpreted absolutely, they would almost certainly trample other rights in the process.

If that's your opinion, so be it. Just understand that everything thrown under the blanket of FREEDOM doesn't magically make your position a reasonable one or a more American one. It's an absolute position. Absolute positions don't create solutions.

Out of curiosity, what country will you be moving to? Most countries as nice as ours are more socially liberal and have larger Welfare states.

I already stated I misused "restriction", I meant have my right to bear arms completely taken away.