Ongoing NHL thread - Part III

[forty_three]

I think if we take away all the Benning stuff from the draft, what with him breaking pretty much every rule written or otherwise in the GM handbook, Jarmo probably finishes last. Dealing for Clarkson is so far beyond inexplicable...

It can be recovered from. Somewhere someone gave him that contract and that guy is probably fine now...


I think even with Benning fumbling around, Jarmo is light years the worst. And the hell of it is he is leaps and bounds better than anyone else we've ever had.

He made some good moves. For example he got rid of Jared Boll only two years and 3m+ later than it would have cost him to just let him walk at the end of his last deal.

And he bought out a defenseman who was cheaper and had better possession numbers than Jack Johnson!

 

[forty_three]

Ranking the 30 NHL head coaches

Not sure if posted, but the Score's ranking of all the NHL coaches. 30th is good, right?

Kool Aid drinkers are losing their shit over this and the GM rankings. But it's dead on. One simple passage nails it:
His notoriously brash coaching style has yet to click for a roster in need of development.

Boo yah.

We'll never score a hat trick, and we'll wind up with Patrick!

 

[tducey]

LOL at Ottawa's being #28, should be higher than that. No fan of Torts or his style but he's not the worst coach in the league.

 

[dash]

So let me get this straight, Todd McClellan had several seasons behind the bench of a very talented San Jose Sharks team and could never get them to the Stanley Cup Finals, the season after he leaves, they make it to the Stanley Cup finals. Meanwhile, he joins the Oilers who have landed the next great talent in the NHL and there is zero improvement with the team and he earns a ranking of #15?!? Does this make any sense?

 

[esls79]

There are not 5 coaches in the NHL worse than Randy Carlyle. There may not be 5 coaches in the AHL worse than Randy Carlyle.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

So let me get this straight, Todd McClellan had several seasons behind the bench of a very talented San Jose Sharks team and could never get them to the Stanley Cup Finals, the season after he leaves, they make it to the Stanley Cup finals. Meanwhile, he joins the Oilers who have landed the next great talent in the NHL and there is zero improvement with the team and he earns a ranking of #15?!? Does this make any sense?

 

[jstewismybastardson]

analysis is thin ... Willie D ... it "comes down to wins and losses"

how about ... the guy makes the fewest in game adjustments of any coach in the league and gets outcoached on a regular basis ... i would have also accepted he is from Medicine Hat

 

[dash]

analysis is thin ... Willie D ... it "comes down to wins and losses"

how about ... the guy makes the fewest in game adjustments of any coach in the league and gets outcoached on a regular basis ... i would have also accepted he is from Medicine Hat

/Yes, he did coach the Tigers, but he's from Saskybush.

 

[DragonfromTO]

So let me get this straight, Todd McClellan had several seasons behind the bench of a very talented San Jose Sharks team and could never get them to the Stanley Cup Finals, the season after he leaves, they make it to the Stanley Cup finals. Meanwhile, he joins the Oilers who have landed the next great talent in the NHL and there is zero improvement with the team and he earns a ranking of #15?!? Does this make any sense?

Randy Carlyle won a Stanley Cup in just his second season after replacing Mike Babcock, whose Mighty Ducks had just 76 points in his final season there.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Randy Carlyle won a Stanley Cup in just his second season after replacing Mike Babcock, whose Mighty Ducks had just 76 points in his final season there.

That is a terrible comparison for so many reasons.

 

[DragonfromTO]

That is a terrible comparison for so many reasons.

It was meant to be hyperbolic, but it's a general point about process vs results (especially when looking at single seasons).

You can find plenty of isolated seasons where bad coaches had good W/L results (and vice versa).

 

[forty_three]

It was meant to be hyperbolic, but it's a general point about process vs results (especially when looking at single seasons).

You can find plenty of isolated seasons where bad coaches had good W/L results (and vice versa).

Wayne Gretzky
Luc Robitaille
Alexei Zhitnik

 

[dash]

Randy Carlyle won a Stanley Cup in just his second season after replacing Mike Babcock, whose Mighty Ducks had just 76 points in his final season there.

That was the year Pronger joined the Ducks after he soiled an Edmonton tv weather girl, correct?

/The above post is Poonerman approved.

 

[DragonfromTO]

That was the year Pronger joined the Ducks after he soiled an Edmonton tv weather girl, correct?

/The above post is Poonerman approved.

Yeah but if that kind of W/L difference was entirely attributable to Chris Pronger he'd have more Stanley Cup rings than Henri Richard, no?

 

[dash]

Yeah but if that kind of W/L difference was entirely attributable to Chris Pronger he'd have more Stanley Cup rings than Henri Richard, no?

Oh definitely, although he was a main reason why the Oilers made a run to the finals in the previous year, so it's hard to diminish his impact to the Ducks fortunes in their run to the Cup the following year.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Yeah but if that kind of W/L difference was entirely attributable to Chris Pronger he'd have more Stanley Cup rings than Henri Richard, no?

Randy's team had Pronger, Niederhosen, Perry, Getzlaf, Selanne etc. Babs' 03-04 team had Vinny Prospal and Ruslan Salei.

Neither the Oilers nor Sharks had anything resembling that kinda turnover between last season and the one before it and Todd's old team got much, much better while his new team played about as bad as they did the season before and by the end of the year were totally dysfunctional.

While nobody expected the Oilers to actually play well, people did expect a Babcock with the Leafs-like change in the team's attitude and conduct. The opposite happened - they're more fucked up than ever.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Oh definitely, although he was a main reason why the Oilers made a run to the finals in the previous year, so it's hard to diminish his impact to the Ducks fortunes in their run to the Cup the following year.

Every team Pronger played for enjoyed success save his first team (and his current team), and those teams all faceplanted into the ground after he left. Fuck, he left the Whalers so high and dry they shut down the mall and moved to Carolina!

Pronger was one of the few guys that had the effect of instantly turning your team into a contender.

 

[esls79]

For those of you keeping track out there, it's been almost 8 1/2 years since Pronger was last suspended.

 

[DragonfromTO]

Randy's team had Pronger, Niederhosen, Perry, Getzlaf, Selanne etc. Babs' 03-04 team had Vinny Prospal and Ruslan Salei.

Neither the Oilers nor Sharks had anything resembling that kinda turnover between last season and the one before it and Todd's old team got much, much better while his new team played about as bad as they did the season before and by the end of the year were totally dysfunctional.

While nobody expected the Oilers to actually play well, people did expect a Babcock with the Leafs-like change in the team's attitude and conduct. The opposite happened - they're more fucked up than ever.

Did they though? Remember what I said about looking at isolated seasons (or playoff series). The Sharks had a better overall W% under McLellan than they did last year under deBoer, no? And from the looks of it it seems like that remains the case if you use pretty much any chunk of his time in San Jose save isolating that last season.

If Nashville shows up for game 7 isn't the narrative about the Sharks right now pretty much the same rather than "they have improved so much"?

 

[DragonfromTO]

Every team Pronger played for enjoyed success save his first team (and his current team), and those teams all faceplanted into the ground after he left. Fuck, he left the Whalers so high and dry they shut down the mall and moved to Carolina!

Pronger was one of the few guys that had the effect of instantly turning your team into a contender.

That the guy they traded Pronger for was gone after just one year didn't help the Whalers either. And their W% actually improved that single year after they dealt Pronger.