Ongoing NHL thread - Part III

[dash]

Hockey SportsHoopla is kind of amusing with this many people rooting for their teams to lose to get good draft picks. I don't think this many teams represented prominently on the Hoop have had rough seasons in a single year as this one.

I'm not rooting for the Flames to lose because a high draft pick guarantees absolutely nothing. The Flames nabbed Sean Monahan as the 6th overall pick in 2013 and he has gone on to become the highest goal scorer of his draft class. Sam Bennett was selected 4th overall in 2014 and he looks like he's going to be a fine NHL player. Obviously, Connor McDavid looks like he's going to be a very special player (a Sidney Crosby / Alex Ovechkin type of superstar), but who knows about Auston Matthews? Losses will come because the Flames just aren't a very good team right now, but there are guys playing for contracts/positions for next season and you can see the effort is still at a high level.

 

[dash]

Just to follow-up, I don't want people to misconstrue my post above like rooting for your team to lose means you're a bad fan or anything like that. Personally, I think the system currently in place for determining entry draft position is broken and should just be a random draw of the 14 teams that don't make the playoffs. In a salary cap league where teams are restricted to how much they can spend on players, there's no need to provide additional incentive for teams to finish as low as they can. Eventually, the bad teams will become contenders and if they don't, well then get rid of your coaches and management.

 

[dash]

It's Edmonton vs. Winnipeg in the 2016 Heritage Classic on October 23rd at Investors Group Field in Winnipeg.

NHL confirms Winnipeg will host 2016 Heritage Classic

 

[Center Ice]

It's Edmonton vs. Winnipeg in the 2016 Heritage Classic on October 23rd at Investors Group Field in Winnipeg.

NHL confirms Winnipeg will host 2016 Heritage Classic

Clash of the Titans.

 

[dash]

Clash of the Titans. View attachment 95063

Smart scheduling on behalf of the league, the Oilers are still playing meaningful games in October.

 

[esls79]

Who will the captain be for each team?

 

[dash]

Will the Coyotes allow Hawerchuk to play in the alumni game?

 

[tducey]

Yes that's right, Hawerchuk is a former Jet but is not a former Thrasher which is what this Jets team currently is, could be interesting.

 

[Blitzville]

Karlsson is great and I dont hold his teams lack of success against him. Team success means absolutely zero when determining individual awards or individual greatness in my mind. If you took Kane off Chicago and put him in Buffalo he wouldnt be leading a Cup contender hed be missing the playoffs, but hed be just as good of a hockey player. If Karlsson got traded to Washington he wouldnt all of a sudden be a better player just because hes on a better team. So that's nonsense.

BUT Karlsson is just not as good as Doughty, no way. If i take any Dman in the league im taking Doughty and then im taking Keith. Points is not the top indicator of great defense. Karlsson is a negative defensively (although has improved some) and also has complete free will to rush and do what he wants with the puck. Doughty plays in a tighter system. Does that mean hed score equal to Karlsson with free range? No but the gap would be closer. Fact is i want a shut down guy that can move the puck and thats Doughty. Karlsson is a great puck mover, great skater, but gets beat often, takes really bad risks too often (watch last seasons playoff series vs Mtl and count all the giveaways and bad risks with the puck) and is just too loose overall.

People need to look beyond the point totals and evaluate the true level of play.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

Karlsson is great and I dont hold his teams lack of success against him. Team success means absolutely zero when determining individual awards or individual greatness in my mind. If you took Kane off Chicago and put him in Buffalo he wouldnt be leading a Cup contender hed be missing the playoffs, but hed be just as good of a hockey player. If Karlsson got traded to Washington he wouldnt all of a sudden be a better player just because hes on a better team. So that's nonsense.

BUT Karlsson is just not as good as Doughty, no way. If i take any Dman in the league im taking Doughty and then im taking Keith. Points is not the top indicator of great defense. Karlsson is a negative defensively (although has improved some) and also has complete free will to rush and do what he wants with the puck. Doughty plays in a tighter system. Does that mean hed score equal to Karlsson with free range? No but the gap would be closer. Fact is i want a shut down guy that can move the puck and thats Doughty. Karlsson is a great puck mover, great skater, but gets beat often, takes really bad risks too often (watch last seasons playoff series vs Mtl and count all the giveaways and bad risks with the puck) and is just too loose overall.

People need to look beyond the point totals and evaluate the true level of play.

I don't have time to point out the stats that favour Karlsson over players like Doughty (tomorrow I will), but consider the following; how bad would Ottawa be with Doughty instead of Karlsson? I'd argue they'd be worse since their offense revolves around EK.

Would LA be much worse without Doughty but with Karlsson? Tough to say but if LA has a weakness it is generating offense, not preventing goals. I'd be terrified of an LA team with Karlsson in the fold.

I'm biased but I've watched a tonne of games this year (mostly west coast after the little on goes to bed), and I haven't seen a player who means more to his team than Karlsson.

 

[Dacks]

Like many player comparisons, I think it really depends on what type of team you have. If you already have a balanced Stanley Cup contender with lots of scoring options - sure, maybe Doughty is more appealing. But I would start a franchine around Karlsson over Doughty any day of the week.

 

[dash]

Ouch, knee ligaments can only take so much pressure...Davidson of the Oilers feels the pain of Big Buff.

 

[forty_three]

Hockey SportsHoopla is kind of amusing with this many people rooting for their teams to lose to get good draft picks. I don't think this many teams represented prominently on the Hoop have had rough seasons in a single year as this one.

Not everyone can get the league to rig a draft for them :P

I'm not rooting for the Flames to lose because a high draft pick guarantees absolutely nothing. The Flames nabbed Sean Monahan as the 6th overall pick in 2013 and he has gone on to become the highest goal scorer of his draft class. Sam Bennett was selected 4th overall in 2014 and he looks like he's going to be a fine NHL player. Obviously, Connor McDavid looks like he's going to be a very special player (a Sidney Crosby / Alex Ovechkin type of superstar), but who knows about Auston Matthews? Losses will come because the Flames just aren't a very good team right now, but there are guys playing for contracts/positions for next season and you can see the effort is still at a high level.

I know he's already a damn site better than pretty much any forward on my team.


The Jackets have painted themselves into a corner and the best chance they have to get the player they need to fill their biggest hole is at the draft. They have no real meaningful cap space, and few truly tradeable contracts. They have decent depth at D, some promising forwards in the AHL and two goalies who can probably hold them in games. They just need a true #1 center. This draft is our only real hope. And drafting first overall. Because there really aren't any projected stud centers elsewhere on the list, at least not guys like we need.

I can't take another season with Brandon Dubinsky as my #1C.

 

[dash]

Kris Russell named third star in the Dallas win over Ottawa yesterday, 1 assist, lone defenseman on the Stars powerplay and over 24 minutes TOI. Not sure what his advanced stats looked like yesterday.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Losses will come because the Flames just don't have a half-decent goalie right now.

Fixed because this is pretty much the only thing wrong with this season's Flames and I'm starting to think it was done on purpose by Lord Irk and his minion.

 

[dash]

Fixed because this is pretty much the only thing wrong with this season's Flames and I'm starting to think it was done on purpose by Lord Irk and his minion.

lol - Yeah, I can see that, let's see, the Flames finally make it back to the playoffs and win a round (first time doing that since 2004) and build up an incredible amount of good will in the community, let's just be terrible the next season on the small chance we can land Auston Matthews.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

lol - Yeah, I can see that, let's see, the Flames finally make it back to the playoffs and win a round (first time doing that since 2004) and build up an incredible amount of good will in the community, let's just be terrible the next season on the small chance we can land Auston Matthews.

View attachment 95299

Burke logic dictates two first rounders from a rebuilding team for a moderately-consistent scoring winger makes sense.

Wouldn't put it past him at all.

 

[dash]

Burke logic dictates two first rounders from a rebuilding team for a moderately-consistent scoring winger makes sense.

Wouldn't put it past him at all.

Weren't you the one who said that Toronto was his trial run at re-building, I'm sure that old dog won't repeat the same mistakes in Calgary.

/Besides, he's not the GM.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Weren't you the one who said that Toronto was his trial run at re-building, I'm sure that old dog won't repeat the same mistakes in Calgary.

/Besides, he's not the GM.

Well, they did just take a team that made the second round last year and have them competing with the last team he destroyed for the top draft pick lol.

/He's still the boss and I don't think Treliving (or any GM, for that matter) operates with the autonomy you seem to believe they do. If Treliving went to Burke last summer and said "we need an upgrade in net" and Burke downed his highball of Wild Turkey and said "nope", that's the end of the convo.

 

[dash]

Well, they did just take a team that made the second round last year and have them competing with the last team he destroyed for the top draft pick lol.

/He's still the boss and I don't think Treliving (or any GM, for that matter) operates with the autonomy you seem to believe they do. If Treliving went to Burke last summer and said "we need an upgrade in net" and Burke downed his highball of Wild Turkey and said "nope", that's the end of the convo.

I don't know, if Burkie was really in charge and really making the personnel decisions, I think Hudler and Russell are still members of the Calgary Flames, they part with their first rounder for Mikael Boedker, and James Reimer would be the newest Flames goalie (I guess there's still a chance of that happening this summer).

/There's no change your loathing of the man has clouded your judgment is there BBB?