Offensive Guard

[blstoker]

Everyone seems to be looking at the more sexy positions of need, and the offensive line seems to be forgotten. Oh, I know that everyone is talking about how we need to improve that line, but it's just kind've one of those things that people say and then move on to the more entertaining stuff. So, here are the options that could be available to Seattle:

Free Agent
Mike Iupati - San Francisco is nearly $3 million over the cap, and I don't think Iupati will be cheap. He was paid over $4 million last year and he should be looking to get a solid contract this time around. He is a 3 time pro bowler and an All Pro in 2012. I have always liked Iupati, and I think he would be a huge upgrade at the LG spot, and would give us a solid left side of the line. He's also only 27 years old.

James Carpenter - He actually made great strides last year, and though he's not perfect he easily had the best year of his career. Problem is, was that all because it's a contract year, or has he turned a corner? I wouldn't mind seeing him come back, but I would hope it's more of a he's improved and will continue to do so thing, instead of a playing for his career thing.

Rob Sims - Not sure if this is exactly how we want to go. Never really had an issue with him when he was a Seahawk, but he wasn't Hutch and he was part of those lines that seemed to start a trend of really bad lines for us. He'll be 32 next year.

Draft:
I really don't know much about these players individually, at least not yet, and so I'll just list who'll be around during the first 3 rounds:

A.J. Cann, South Carolina
Laken Tomlinson, Duke
Tre Jackson, Florida State
Arie Kouandjio, Alabama
Josue Matias, Florida State
John Miller, Louisville
Ali Marpet, Hobart

Personally, picking up Iupati in the free agent market will allow for other needs to be targeted in the draft, especially since none of the guards are projected to go in the first. If we did have to bring in someone from outside to fill in as a starter, I would say I'd rather spend the money on Iupati than on any of the WR free agents out there.

 

[WizardHawk]

I hate pinning your hopes for any O line off the draft. Maybe I'm off, but it always feels like there are more busts from expected to shine linemen than most other positions. Taking one of the already known quantities there would for sure by my vote.

 

[blstoker]

I hate pinning your hopes for any O line off the draft. Maybe I'm off, but it always feels like there are more busts from expected to shine linemen than most other positions. Taking one of the already known quantities there would for sure by my vote.

Only Patrick Lewis (4 G, 3 GS) and Stephen Schilling (3 G, 2 GS) were linemen that played for the Hawks this year that weren't drafted or signed as UDFA, and they were brought in only due to desperation. Every other offensive lineman has been a Seahawk man since entering the league, with Unger being the only one not from the PC/JS regime. Complaints have abounded about how bad the line has been since before PC, so maybe it's time to bring in a hired gun, sign Iupati and have a starting line that looks like this:

LT Okung
LG Iupati
C Unger
RG Sweezy
RT Britt

 

[WizardHawk]

Will one piece alone do enough to upgrade them substantially from a decent run blocking and terrible pass blocking line?

I mean I love any upgrade on the line, just wondering how much of an impact one of five can make.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Only Patrick Lewis (4 G, 3 GS) and Stephen Schilling (3 G, 2 GS) were linemen that played for the Hawks this year that weren't drafted or signed as UDFA, and they were brought in only due to desperation. Every other offensive lineman has been a Seahawk man since entering the league, with Unger being the only one not from the PC/JS regime. Complaints have abounded about how bad the line has been since before PC, so maybe it's time to bring in a hired gun, sign Iupati and have a starting line that looks like this:

LT Okung
LG Iupati
C Unger
RG Sweezy
RT Britt

Iupati fits the Cable mold. Great run blocker, lousy pass blocker. I'm fine with bring in a FA OL, but let it be someone who's a good pass blocker, please!

 

[SonnyCID]

Will one piece alone do enough to upgrade them substantially from a decent run blocking and terrible pass blocking line?

I mean I love any upgrade on the line, just wondering how much of an impact one of five can make.

A substantial one if it's someone who can start 16 games.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Will one piece alone do enough to upgrade them substantially from a decent run blocking and terrible pass blocking line?

I mean I love any upgrade on the line, just wondering how much of an impact one of five can make.

Every little improvement helps. Good health would do wonders, but I think I'm asking for to much. OL for the Seahawks are cursed with injuries and have been even before the PC era.

 

[Southieinnc]

Will one piece alone do enough to upgrade them substantially from a decent run blocking and terrible pass blocking line?

I mean I love any upgrade on the line, just wondering how much of an impact one of five can make.

A third down back-up for passing situations could be pretty cheap.

You have a good O-line core. Getting stronger by numbers rather than stud players would be a cap-friendly way to improve.
You could also get lucky in the draft - in later rounds. Example Stork for the Patriots. He will anchor at center for a long time.....

 

[Sharkonabicycle]

I don't get why we just don't re-sign James Carpenter. He stayed the most healthy he has all season with 13 games started and his girlfriend (I believe) really had him in GREAT shape. He showed up in the best shape he has in his career. Granted it's a contract year, but he's not going to be commanding a ton of money and he's familiar with the O-Line.

A lot of O-Line is continuity playing together and Iupati would be a completely new face. It's more important to keep the same cast together so they can continue to cover each others' weaknesses and build the relationship required for good O-Lines.

Carpenter will also probably be cheaper than Iupati. Regardless, Carpenter improved a lot this year and part of our offensive woes was teams just stacking against the run because Doug Baldwin and Luke Willson was the best TE/WR threat on the team. Willson is probably a #3 on most teams until he learns to catch/run routes/improves blocking and Baldwin is a slot on most teams, MAYBE #2 on some.

 

[blstoker]

I don't get why we just don't re-sign James Carpenter. He stayed the most healthy he has all season with 13 games started and his girlfriend (I believe) really had him in GREAT shape. He showed up in the best shape he has in his career. Granted it's a contract year, but he's not going to be commanding a ton of money and he's familiar with the O-Line.

A lot of O-Line is continuity playing together and Iupati would be a completely new face. It's more important to keep the same cast together so they can continue to cover each others' weaknesses and build the relationship required for good O-Lines.

Carpenter will also probably be cheaper than Iupati. Regardless, Carpenter improved a lot this year and part of our offensive woes was teams just stacking against the run because Doug Baldwin and Luke Willson was the best TE/WR threat on the team. Willson is probably a #3 on most teams until he learns to catch/run routes/improves blocking and Baldwin is a slot on most teams, MAYBE #2 on some.

Continuity is a good thing, but so is upgrading the talent. Last season, when all 5 starting linemen started, the Seahawks averaged 5.2 ypc, 160 ypg and 1.1 tdpg while giving up 2.7 sacks per game (7 games including playoffs). But, even when missing starters, the Hawks averaged 5.2 ypc, 174 ypg and 1.3 tdpg while allowing 2.8 sacks per game.

I don't mind bringing Carpenter back, but it has to be for better reasons than continuity. Iupati may not be an option, but you gotta improve the line and right now Carpenter's spot is the easiest to do because he's the only one not under contract.

 

[Uhsplit]

Iupati will probably cost more than we are willing to spend and he runs hot/cold.
I would hope for a high draft pick if Carp is being replaced.

 

[blstoker]

Iupati will probably cost more than we are willing to spend and he runs hot/cold.
I would hope for a high draft pick if Carp is being replaced.

No one worth the high draft pick for guards this year. I guess you could draft a tackle high and then either move that tackle or Britt into the guard position, but that's just a gamble that it'll work.

 

[Cave_Johnson]

I would love to see Iupati on this team, but his price is going to be too big. I don't think a major free agent signing is going to happen on the O-line. Probably going to have to build through the draft.

 

[Southieinnc]

No one worth the high draft pick for guards this year. I guess you could draft a tackle high and then either move that tackle or Britt into the guard position, but that's just a gamble that it'll work.

Agreed. There will be guards available late in the draft that will develop into better guards than the early picks.....

 

[Uhsplit]

From an ESPN article.

Three players the Seahawks could target in the draft:

A.J. Cann, guard, South Carolina: Seahawks offensive coach Tom Cable loves a player like Cann, who is a drive blocker that stays engaged with an opponent and will pancake him into the turf if need be. And he rarely gets out-muscled inside, holding defensive tackles at bay when they try to rush the passer. Cann was a four-year starter for the Gamecocks and viewed as a very disciplined player who was rarely penalized, definitely the type of guy the Seahawks could use up front.

Tre' Jackson, guard, Florida State: A mountain of a man at 6-4, 325. He is known for an aggressive mindset and can hold his ground in pass protection when he's bull rushed. Like Carpenter, Jackson is a guy who can eat his way out of shape in a hurry if he isn't careful. He relies on his brute strength and needs to improve on his technique.

La'el Collins, tackle, LSU: A bit iffy that he would fall to them at the end of the first round, but if he's there, the Seahawks should forget about trading down and grab him. Collins is a brawler at 6-5, 320, a guy who plays mean and angry. He loves to intimidate opponents. He's an excellent pass blocker and technically sound, but some question whether he has the foot quickness to play left tackle in the NFL. The point is he can play and probably start immediately somewhere up front, so don't pass him up if he's there at No. 31.

 

[blstoker]

I'll take a look at each of those Uh, and post a couple vids or more about each.

A.J. Cann, guard, South Carolina:

cbssports.com:
STRENGTHS: Proportionate frame with adequate bulk. Flexible lower body and quickly gets into position. Natural bender. Comfortable sitting in his stance. Naturally powerful with brute strength to be a people mover. Generates power through his hips and midsection. Delivers pop at the point of attack with strong grip to latch and control. Strong finisher and flashes tenacity to bury his man. Uses his length to keep space between him and his target. Alert. Always scanning with good instincts. Stout, resetting his feet well even after initially rocked backward. Reliable and coachable with consistent winning attitude. Named a permanent team captain as a junior. Four-year starter in the SEC (51 career starts).

WEAKNESSES: Cann is best suited to a power-scheme as he does not possess ideal initial agility or straight-line speed for a zone-blocking scheme. Can better improve his momentum on the move to properly win angles and break down in motion. No spring off the snap - lumbers to a rolling start. Lacks quickness to recover when he's beaten initially. Not controlled in space, lunging and overextending from the waist. Will overrun open-field targets and needs to improve timing to be more consistent in this area. Not forceful with his hands. Lacks a consistent mean streak. Unproven at all positions except left guard.

Compares To: Ben Grubbs, Saints -- Much like Grubbs, Cann doesn't have one elite trait that he uses to dominate defenders, but he has the steady consistency across the board to be a long-term starter.

nfl.com:
STRENGTHS
Comes off the ball with low pad level and plays with good knee bend. Has a thick frame and maintains a wide base. Rarely bull-rushed. Pins defender effectively when down-blocking. Displays natural upper-body strength and powerful hands. Snatches and stays engaged. Consistent inside-hand placement upon strike. Generates push as a drive blocker. Good recognition against twists and keeps head on a swivel in pass pro. Fluid mover in screen game and can make blocks on the move laterally. Disciplined leader who is rarely penalized.
WEAKNESSES
Must improve at gathering himself and engaging target on second level. Catch-and-push pass protector who needs to flash a more authoritative punch rather than lean. Gets weight too far out in front, causing him to lose balance in pass pro. Outside hand can get a little wide. Comes out of stance a tick slow at times and can struggle when asked to change direction against spin moves.
SOURCES TELL US
"I see him as a left guard only prospect who overcomes lack of height with athleticism. I like the kid and the player." -- SEC East offensive coach
BOTTOM LINE
Consistent four-year starter for the Gamecocks. He has technique issues that need to be coached up in pass protection, but he also has the talent to improve in that area. Powerful drive-blocker who uses leverage to fire out and generate instant movement in tight spaces. He is best-suited to a power scheme. Cann has the plug-and-play traits that could make him an instant starter.

 

[blstoker]

Tre' Jackson, guard, Florida State:

cbssports.com:
STRENGTHS: Looks the part with a massive frame, thick legs, a big bubble and wide hips. Surprisingly quick, especially given his size, coming off the ball. Good burst to get to linebackers at the second level and the agility to turn and seal defensive linemen in the running game. Uses his mass and leg drive to easily plow opponents off the ball when he keeps his pad level low. Durable.

WEAKNESSES: Relies on mass and strength to occupy blockers. Stops his feet on contact. Strong enough to latch and control collegiate-level opponents but if he doesn't shuffle laterally or allows opponents to get into his chest, he can be beaten with quickness or power. Has the short-area quickness to get to the second level but doesn't have great balance or change-of-direction agility to adjust to moving targets.

nfl.com:
STRENGTHS
Leverage and strength to stand and steer defenders in confined spaces. Stays flat-footed and balanced at point of impact in pass pro. Deliberate, controlled climb to second level. Power to jolt in his hands. Shows recovery ability when beaten in run game. In short pull, can find target, engage and seal. Aggressive play demeanor. Can take a stand when being bull-rushed.
WEAKNESSES
Fleshy midsection with excess weight potentially affecting foot quickness. Loses feet sliding to pick up rushers. Will duck head into block on contact. Limited effectiveness in space. Inconsistent performer this season. Too reliant upon size over skill and failed to show improvement this season. Struggles to get feet into winning position when blocking laterally.
SOURCES TELL US
"Honestly, I liked him much better last year. I definitely had him ahead of (teammate Josue) Matias) coming into the season, but not anymore." -- NFC Director of Scouting
NFL COMPARISON
Justin Blalock
BOTTOM LINE
Three-year starter on a line full of wide-bodies, Jackson entered the 2014 season as one of the top-rated guard prospects, but failed to distinguish himself. Has the talent to be a dependable, quality NFL starter, but he needs to work on weight and conditioning in order to improve his feet and reach his potential.

 

[blstoker]

La'el Collins, tackle, LSU:

cbssports.com:
STRENGTHS: Collins sports a thick, powerful frame that makes him about as difficult to move as a chest freezer. His frame belies his quick feet, an attribute that when combined with his long arms, impressive strength and aggression make him a devastating run blocker. Collins is often the quickest of LSU's offensive linemen off the snap and he routinely drives his assignment off the line of scrimmage with pure power, creating easy running lanes for LSU's backs. He's surprisingly quick to the second level and has good body control to adjust to moving targets. As a pass blocker, Collins shows good initial quickness in his kick-slide and uses his long reach to maintain the arc. When he gets his hands on opponents and remains square, it is generally lights out for the defender. Collins showed his willingness to potentially convert inside, impressing on a few snaps at left guard at the Senior Bowl.

WEAKNESSES: He does not possess elite balance and can be challenged by speed-rushers. He'll over-compensate occasionally and leave the inside open for counters. Collins' aggression is admirable but also leads to mistakes. Rather than patiently waiting for defenders to come to him, Collins will occasionally lunge, making himself top-heavy and prone to slipping down the body of his opponent. This can lead to his hands getting too low or slipping onto the side and/or back of defenders, which invites them to swim over the top of him to disengage.

PLAYER COMPARISON: James Carpenter, Seattle: Collins is a better athlete than Carpenter and therefore may be likelier to remain outside than Alabama's former tackle, who has since become a mauling run blocker at left guard with the Seahawks.

nfl.com:
STRENGTHS
Thick through chest and displays upper-body strength. Has strong hands and will snatch and control less active defenders. He takes defenders for a ride once he's engaged on the move. Loves to mash and intimidate opponents. Mean player. Can center pass rushers and end their attempt in pass pro. Utilizes length in pass protection and is acclimated to a pro-style offense. Able to run-block and pass-set laterally. Well-schooled and technically proficient. If he gets beat on a play, he comes back even harder on the next snap. Finisher. Can come in and play guard or tackle.
WEAKNESSES
Fails to consistently bring hips and feet with him through contact in the running game, causing him to fall forward and lose balance. Hands will start too low in pass pro at times and has to work hard to redirect. Change of direction is slow for a tackle. Relies on lunging rather than foot movement to counter inside moves. Plays high out of stance and loses leverage battle on short-yardage confrontations. Will have to move to right tackle or inside.
NFL COMPARISON
Maurkice Pouncey
BOTTOM LINE
Lumbering brawler who has had a level of success in hyper-competitive SEC West. Lacks athleticism to be a consistent left tackle and will have to move to right tackle or bump inside to guard. Collins plays with a mean streak that is evident in every game and could come in and start right away in a power running game as a guard.

 

[blstoker]

Now, if the mock drafts can be believed (and can they ever really be?) then La'el Collins won't be an option. In 10 mocks I looked at, not one had him going lower than 25th, and all but 2 had him going between #9 and #15.

Only 2 of those mocks had A.J. Cann going in the first round, #28 and #32, and of those who took more than 1st round picks, he fell as low as the 3rd round (#65). So, he's a first or second (if lucky) pick.

Tre Jackson was similar to Cann, except he wasn't taken in the first by anybody, but he's most likely gone before we pick in the third. So, 1st or second only.

 

[Uhsplit]

Nice job stoker.