Norris trophy finalists

[dash]

Letang, Subban and Suter named finalists for the Norris Trophy.

I think PK takes it and then Kyle Turris jumps him as he's walking off the stage.

 

[mattola]

PK will get it and Montreal will say.. hmmm maybe we should have paid him a touch more......

but anyway I heard last night no awards show this year they will announce the winners during each game of the stanley cup finals? thats different? the awards show is pure shite every year but to announce them during your biggest 2 weeks is folly. Why take ANYTHING away from the Final. Fools

 

[jstewismybastardson]

but anyway I heard last night no awards show this year they will announce the winners during each game of the stanley cup finals? thats different? the awards show is pure shite every year but to announce them during your biggest 2 weeks is folly. Why take ANYTHING away from the Final. Fools

I used to think this way too but I think its a good change ... worth a shot i guess ... lets face it overall casual fan interest dies as each round passes and the playoffs head towards the final 2 teams (as opposed to the nba where it grows)

these additional stories during the playoffs are meant to keep the casual fan in it ... just like the announcements they have been making this (and last) week about the outdoor games that will be happening next season

 

[dash]

The only good thing about the awards show are dem good lookin' women and now they're taking that away? Damn you Bettman, damn you to hell.

 

[mattola]

I used to think this way too but I think its a good change ... worth a shot i guess ... lets face it overall casual fan interest dies as each round passes and the playoffs head towards the final 2 teams (as opposed to the nba where it grows)

these additional stories during the playoffs are meant to keep the casual fan in it ... just like the announcements they have been making this (and last) week about the outdoor games that will be happening next season

that makes sense. I feel for the winners.


and the winner is..... Alex Ovechkin for MVP



where is he


UFA, Russia......


um.... send in the russian bears

 

[dash]

that makes sense. I feel for the winners.


and the winner is..... Alex Ovechkin for MVP



where is he


UFA, Russia......


um.... send in the russian bears (we'll surprise Bryz)

Fixed

 

[jstewismybastardson]

meh ... i never really wanted to watch each of the the winners awkwardly walk up the stage and read from the same boring script anyways

"Id like to thank my teammates and all the fans ... you guys were the best" ... wash ... rinse ... repeat

 

[Nasty_Magician]

No Lidstrom on that list? What gives?

 

[dash]

No Lidstrom on that list? What gives?

Just no longer a positive influence on his team.

 

[DChero]

No Lidstrom on that list? What gives?

Beat me to it!

I think Suter actually deserves it the most. I think that Letang is the superior player, but he doesn't have as much of a lead to miss as much time as he did and still win.

 

[jstewismybastardson]

to be fair (retired), Lidstrom had as many goals as Keith Ballard this year

 

[jstewismybastardson]

the "advanced stats guys" are coming out and poking semi truck sized holes in Suters season

 

[dash]

It would have been pretty funny to see Brodin nominated for the Norris after getting snubbed as a finalist for the Calder...

 

[jstewismybastardson]

It would have been pretty funny to see Brodin nominated for the Norris after getting snubbed as a finalist for the Calder...

Corey Pronman ‏@coreypronman 42m Per adv stats it seems like Brodin played better than Suter. Think one would need to track touches, zone exits etc. to get a better answer

Thomas Drance ‏@ThomasDrance 49m Only one Norris nominee's club was a worse possession team with him on the ice than off of it. #Suter

 

[esls79]

Corey Pronman ‏@coreypronman 42m Per adv stats it seems like Brodin played better than Suter. Think one would need to track touches, zone exits etc. to get a better answer

Thomas Drance ‏@ThomasDrance 49m Only one Norris nominee's club was a worse possession team with him on the ice than off of it. #Suter

Isn't a d-man supposed to play d first? That implies playing without the puck and trying to shut the other team down. Now the argument is being used that Suter's team had less possession when he was on the ice therefore he isn't a worthy candidate?

These advanced stats have a long way to go in hockey, I'm afraid.

 

[dash]

These advanced stats have a long way to go in hockey, I'm afraid.

Weren't you working on some kind of advanced stats prototype (along the lines of VORP) a few years ago?

 

[esls79]

Weren't you working on some kind of advanced stats prototype (along the lines of VORP) a few years ago?

Yeah, but it became abundantly clear for other than goalies, there were too many moving parts to accurately reflect all of them in a stat. These advanced team stats tend to work ok, but all they really show are regressions to the mean over time - it doesn't take a statistician to tell me if a team dominates in puck possession and shots on goal, they will usually have good results barring a hot goalie - hence the goalie can have these VORP like stats, but not the skaters.

Stats in baseball are, for the most part, cut and dried - there is very little interpretation or subjective matter involved aside from defensive metrics. But that is becaue each pitch or batted ball in play is an independant event - no such events short of a penalty shot in hockey exist. These advanced hockey stats cannot take all the "specifics" of a hockey play and boil it down to a single stat - too many moving parts to do so. They may be getting better, but still nowhere as reliable as baseball stats are.

 

[pixburgher66]

An arguement for Tanger (he won't win even though he had a better season than PK at least), is his PIMs. He only had EIGHT this year in his 35 games. Prettttty good. If he played about 40 games this would be his. Pretty sure it's Suter though.

Basic stats:
Subban- 11G-27A-38P +12 w/ 57PIMs (league leading in PIMs?!)
Suter- 4G-28A-32P +2 w/ 24PIMs
Letang- 5G-33A-38P +16 w/ 8PIMs

Those PIMs speak a lot to a guys ability defensively. Letang has improved so much on the defensive side of the puck in the past 2 years. He's able to regroup quickly and get back on a guy making a break...and NOT have to take a penalty. Two seasons ago he had 101PIMs in a full year. He's the perfect version of the "new" Norris, but doesn't put to shame the old one either. I want him to win it now...while Karlsson is sadly out of the race; although I'm convinced those two will be battling it out for a few of these.

 

[dash]

I also think PK having an engine running way too hot contributes to his penalty minute total...

 

[DChero]

An arguement for Tanger (he won't win even though he had a better season than PK at least), is his PIMs. He only had EIGHT this year in his 35 games. Prettttty good. If he played about 40 games this would be his. Pretty sure it's Suter though.

Basic stats:
Subban- 11G-27A-38P +12 w/ 57PIMs (league leading in PIMs?!)
Suter- 4G-28A-32P +2 w/ 24PIMs
Letang- 5G-33A-38P +16 w/ 8PIMs

Those PIMs speak a lot to a guys ability defensively. Letang has improved so much on the defensive side of the puck in the past 2 years. He's able to regroup quickly and get back on a guy making a break...and NOT have to take a penalty. Two seasons ago he had 101PIMs in a full year. He's the perfect version of the "new" Norris, but doesn't put to shame the old one either. I want him to win it now...while Karlsson is sadly out of the race; although I'm convinced those two will be battling it out for a few of these.

I like your argument. /Accepted

I honestly believe that Letang is a better defender than Subban. This also seems to show that he's better offensively. If it's down to them, Subban shouldn't finish on top.

I feel like Suter wins it because of the "value to his team" argument. It can be argued that he made his rookie partner look amazing. He's also not too shabby offensively.