Nats Acquire Doug Fister From Tigers

[Cobiemonster]

unless the two pitchers end up good middle relievers in the majors, then it doesn't win for the Tigers...but they could have easily got more for Doug Fister than what they got....other deals don't matter...this is a bad deal for not getting Fister's value...it happens.

Fister should have pulled 1 high prospect at min...not two middle relievers.

They can buy every FA on the market, it still doesn't change that it was a bad deal.

Agreed - nothing can justify that trade, a bad deal is a bad deal no matter what

 

[jalopy]

...but they could have easily got more for Doug Fister than what they got....other deals don't matter...this is a bad deal for not getting Fister's value...it happens.

You must have heard offers that DD didn't. The only other offer they were considering is Howie Kendrick but deemed it more important to let Miggy move back to 1B.

 

[navamind]

Tigers had six quality starters and needed to deal one. The market is what the market is. I like Fister a lot but the trade helps the Tigers. I do agree that there isn't a high ceiling on the players the Tigers received.

So deal Porcello.

 

[jalopy]

So deal Porcello.

It takes two......

 

[jalopy]

As I have said many times. If you judging this from the Tigers side you need to wait until the dust settles and evaluate the offseason as a whole. If you are looking at it strictly form the Nats side, I like the deal.

 

[da55bums]

You must have heard offers that DD didn't. The only other offer they were considering is Howie Kendrick but deemed it more important to let Miggy move back to 1B.

DD must not have heard the deals that would have been offered for Fister...just shipped him to the first NL team he could...please tell me say the Dodgers, Red Sox or Yankees wouldn't have offered more...just to name a few.

 

[jdwills126]

This deal hinges on the fact Smily is as good a starter as he was a reliever. Thats a big if as he seldom had to face a batter 2 or 3 times in a game.

Maybe DD knew Fister would want a 7 year deal at 100 million plus? Or that Fister was unlikely to continue his very good stats?

Maybe the Tigers scouting on Ray indicated he had mad upside that the Nats didn't.

It could still end up a good deal but today right now it's a bad deal.

 

[jalopy]

DD must not have heard the deals that would have been offered for Fister...just shipped him to the first NL team he could...please tell me say the Dodgers, Red Sox or Yankees wouldn't have offered more...just to name a few.

It was well known that Fister, Porcello and Scherzer were all available. If those teams would have offered more they should have picked up the phone. I hate losing Fister but love the direction this team is going. Porcello will be much improved simply because of the defense behind him.
I had a good conversation with my son's hitting instructor a few days ago about the Tigers and he thinks the defense will have a huge impact on Scherzer and JV, allowing them to pitch less agressively to the bottom of orders. Hopefully that keeps their pitch count down and keeps them in the game longer.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

He had a 3.9 BB/9 in 2013 between A and AA. It was 4.2 in 2012. 3.8 in 2011. That's not exactly cutting down on walks.

In 2012 -- he had 105 IP, gave up 122 hits, 49 walks and 86 strikeouts.

In 2013 -- he had 142 IP, gave up 116 hits, 60 walks and 160 strikeouts.

I only know what I've read on the guy -- they said they made an adjustment to his delivery and it added a couple mph to his fastball (which they say is mid 90's now) and his walk rate went down.

While it still needs work -- Detroit had success with Scherzer, who is another guy who struggled with his delivery and I think he is doing alright today. It was less than 3 years ago, when Detroit had to send Max Scherzer down to Triple A, because he couldn't find the plate or repeat his delivery. So this is something they have dealt with.

Maybe Detroit feels they can fix whatever problem he is having?

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

I love how everyone continues to say -- Detroit could have got this or Detroit could have got that. It was well known Detroit had starting pitching to trade. Dombrowski said he has been in talks with the Nationals since the end of the season. It isn't as if this trade went down over night. He said he talk to them for over a month. He also said they talked about the possibility of trading Scherzer too with the Nats.

If there was a better deal on the table -- I'm sure Dombrowski would have taken it, with the exception of making a deal within the division.

 

[Ronnie]

I love how everyone continues to say -- Detroit could have got this or Detroit could have got that. It was well known Detroit had starting pitching to trade. Dombrowski said he has been in talks with the Nationals since the end of the season. It isn't as if this trade went down over night. He said he talk to them for over a month. He also said they talked about the possibility of trading Scherzer too with the Nats.

If there was a better deal on the table -- I'm sure Dombrowski would have taken it, with the exception of making a deal within the division.

Agree!! It's a common problem with fans to over-rate their own players. That being said, if the Fister deal IS so one sided, there must be reasons why DD made the deal. Unless you want to flat out declare that Dombrowski is an idiot....then the reasons for the trade are not to be found in looking only at the names of the players involved!

 

[StanMarsh51]

I love how everyone continues to say -- Detroit could have got this or Detroit could have got that. It was well known Detroit had starting pitching to trade. Dombrowski said he has been in talks with the Nationals since the end of the season. It isn't as if this trade went down over night. He said he talk to them for over a month. He also said they talked about the possibility of trading Scherzer too with the Nats.

If there was a better deal on the table -- I'm sure Dombrowski would have taken it, with the exception of making a deal within the division.

Sure if there was a better deal he would've likely taken it, but the question probably is whether he waited long enough to get the best deal possible, considering it's only early December and some teams don't have their rotations sorted out to accurately assess their needs.

Just as a possible scenario, what if the Yankees end up not being able to re-sign Kuroda? One would think they could become desperate for rotation help if that happened (considering Pettitte also retired) and possibly make better offers. Other teams may have similar situations.

 

[jalopy]

Sure if there was a better deal he would've likely taken it, but the question probably is whether he waited long enough to get the best deal possible, considering it's only early December and some teams don't have their rotations sorted out to accurately assess their needs.

Just as a possible scenario, what if the Yankees end up not being able to re-sign Kuroda? One would think they could become desperate for rotation help if that happened (considering Pettitte also retired) and possibly make better offers. Other teams may have similar situations.

I agree that time might have sweetened the offers, especially if Tanaka is taken off the table. However, I think DD would have been hesitant to trade with another American League contender on this deal. In addition, knowing how much the team has to spend on free agents is time sensitive.

I think in a straight up talent evaluation, the Nats got the better of this deal but not by as much as people believe. It is also important to note that the Tigers traded an asset they have in abundance (SP) and received assets in areas of need (RP,IF,youth, and $$$$)

 

[jdwills126]

I love how everyone continues to say -- Detroit could have got this or Detroit could have got that. It was well known Detroit had starting pitching to trade. Dombrowski said he has been in talks with the Nationals since the end of the season. It isn't as if this trade went down over night. He said he talk to them for over a month. He also said they talked about the possibility of trading Scherzer too with the Nats.

If there was a better deal on the table -- I'm sure Dombrowski would have taken it, with the exception of making a deal within the division.

OK but why deal then. Your not saving a boatload of money? The general consensus is this is one sided it's not a deal that had to be made. The Prince Fielder deal yes but this one not so much you are dealing from strength.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

OK but why deal then. Your not saving a boatload of money? The general consensus is this is one sided it's not a deal that had to be made. The Prince Fielder deal yes but this one not so much you are dealing from strength.

How are they not saving money? Fister was going to get 7 million this year and he'd get another raise next year. Smyly will join the rotation in his spot making close to the league minimum. Krol will move to bullpen making close to league minimum and Lombardozzi will take Santiago's spot making close to the league minimum.

Dombrowski has already stated the key to the trade was getting Robbie Ray. So the scouts must see something they really like. Will he pan out? We don't know, but I do like Detroit's track record when it comes to making trades.

If Detroit waited another year -- Fister wouldn't have the two years of team control and they may received less for him. I'm thinking we will find out quickly what Detroit's plans are with the money they have saved. They signed Nathan, but with Ellsbury off the table after NY once again grossly overpaid a FA -- I'm hoping Detroit gets in on Choo, as I'd love to see him at the top of the order.

 

[navamind]

The Tigers can do no wrong.

Ftfy.

 

[jdwills126]

Shin-Soo Choo Is Tigers' Top Target: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com


At least we see who is on the Tigers wish list. Goes with the new look direction Ausmus and Dave D is angling for.

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

Nationals gearing up for another let down season?

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Originally Posted by TrustMeIamRight View Post
The Tigers can do no wrong.
Ftfy.

I don't think that at all. I'm definitely not thrilled with losing Fister. I loved watching games when he pitched, because he didn't mess around and just threw strikes.

I'm just saying -- with Dombrowski's track record in trades for Detroit -- he deserves the benefit of the doubt. He has made a couple bad deals, like trading Jurrjens for Renteria or trading for Washburn and Huff at the deadline a few years ago.

Detroit's roster though is built thru trades made by Dombrowski. All of these players were on the team last year, were brought in by trades made by Dombrowski:

Miguel Cabrera
Omar Infante
Jhonny Peralta
Anibal Sanchez
Max Scherzer
Jose Iglesias
Austin Jackson
Doug Fister
Phil Coke

With the deals he made -- Detroit would have been relying on the "prospects" he traded away to come up and fill valuable roles for the team. Out of everyone he traded away -- Granderson is the only guy who produced and he has struggled lately. All the prospects -- the best of the bunch is Cameron Maybin and he hasn't been anything but average at best.

That is the only reason I'm not getting upset about the deal right now. If Krol and Ray turn out to be terrible -- It was a brutal trade by Detroit. They filled 4 needs though by trading Fister -- they added a lefty to the bullpen, they got a utility player to replace Santiago and they got a top pitching prospect to work with in the minors, and gave themselves more flexibility with the team payroll.

On the surface -- it looks like the Nats robbed the Tigers in the deal. If Dombrowski goes out and signs Choo and another bullpen arm with the money they are saving from trading Fielder and Fister -- I like the move. If they lose out on Choo, we just have to wait and see what they do to fix the needs on the team.

I have mad respect for the BoSox for not getting into a bidding war for Ellsbury -- the contract he received is ridiculous and unfortunately, it makes Choo that much more valuable because of what Ellsbury was paid. I hope the Tigers take a page from the BoSox and don't get in a bidding war over Choo, as they are in win/now mode and end up hurting themselves down the line.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Dombrowski answered questions regarding the Fister deal. Basically he said -- Detroit had 15 minor league pitchers they wanted as the centerpiece of the deal. He said Detroit contacted each team, and the Nationals were the team who willing to put the best package together.

It still seems odd to read that other teams contacted Detroit, like the Blue Jays, and Dombrowski just told them they didn't have players Detroit wanted.

Something seems really strange, unless the Detroit scouts see something in Robbie Ray that other don't see. I don't know??? Dombrowski said Ray is knocking on the door of joining the MLB and will be one of the first called up if they need a spot start or a lefty out of the bullpen.

After doing more reading -- i am starting to wonder if Detroit actually made it known that Fister was available, as "unnamed GM's" are quoted as saying they had no idea he was on the block. I really can't stand articles with 'unnamed' sources, as it means nothing if you won't put your name to it. Still has me thinking twice about the deal now.