Mel Kipers big board

[SteelersPride]

Still don't think Braxton is a top 50 pick. Lots of #2, #3 wrs that aren't projects

its an upside pick

 

[NinerSickness]

its an upside pick

It's a dumb pick if it's in the top 50. There's not really anything all that special about Braxton Miller. He got exposed in the senior bowl.

 

[cdumler7]

its an upside pick

When I read those words I cringe. To me if I am drafting I am using the 1st 3 rounds to pick guys that have shown great skills already on the field and show potential for some more growth. I use the later rounds to find athletes that I hope my coaching staff can mold into a good football player. '

I think Miller has some talent for sure I just think he might not show it for 2 years. You might get 1 year of great production before he hits FA. I need more than that if I am drafting him in the 2nd round.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

I tend to agree that he is probably a RT. Honestly, Stanley and maybe even Tunsil will be RTs from the start with Tunsil having the best shot at LT status.

OTs....so risky to develop but so important.

I'm convinced coaching is a big factor, followed by intellect, and health/continuity of the group...it's great if you have a J. Thomas, but you can win if you don't.

Top 10...it is risky on most positions, but I think you and I, (actually you said it and I agreed) said on the risk...you can always move them to LT or in some cases G.

 

[cdumler7]

I'm convinced coaching is a big factor, followed by intellect, and health/continuity of the group...it's great if you have a J. Thomas, but you can win if you don't.

Top 10...it is risky on most positions, but I think you and I, (actually you said it and I agreed) said on the risk...you can always move them to LT or in some cases G.

To me even coaching though is limited these days. I was listening to a guy the other day that was getting a ton of offers to be the OL coach in the NFL and he said he called one of his old coaches up that was still coaching in the league and he was told don't do it. He said you are so limited in today's NFL of what you can do that it isn't even worth your time. They will never even get close to what you are wanting because of the limitations the NFL has put on practice. Between how badly the college level coaches especially OL players and the lack of contact practices it is no wonder that we just saw some of the worst OL player in NFL history this past season.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

To me even coaching though is limited these days. I was listening to a guy the other day that was getting a ton of offers to be the OL coach in the NFL and he said he called one of his old coaches up that was still coaching in the league and he was told don't do it. He said you are so limited in today's NFL of what you can do that it isn't even worth your time. They will never even get close to what you are wanting because of the limitations the NFL has put on practice. Between how badly the college level coaches especially OL players and the lack of contact practices it is no wonder that we just saw some of the worst OL player in NFL history this past season.

You need athletes, no doubt...my experience on this was PIT OL pre and post Munchak...Pouncey was a top 15 pick and panned out...Gilbert, 2nd, Decastro 1st...and LT, LG were UDFA...it was one of the worst pass protecting OLs...now, post Munchak, one of the better two-way OLs in the game.

Some guys that were HOFs can't communicate what they know to others verbally...he seems to be able to do it.

 

[SteelersPride]

When I read those words I cringe. To me if I am drafting I am using the 1st 3 rounds to pick guys that have shown great skills already on the field and show potential for some more growth. I use the later rounds to find athletes that I hope my coaching staff can mold into a good football player. '

I think Miller has some talent for sure I just think he might not show it for 2 years. You might get 1 year of great production before he hits FA. I need more than that if I am drafting him in the 2nd round.

i agree but once again, tavon austin, tedd ginn, they were the same things

 

[shopson67]

i agree but once again, tavon austin, tedd ginn, they were the same things

They had production at the college level (elite production even). Braxton has very limited production as a WR, did not run a full route tree, only ran a 4.5 40, etc. He is a guess at this point without a lot to back it up.

 

[Clayton]

i agree but once again, tavon austin, tedd ginn, they were the same things

Tavon Austin is a twitch player. Braxton Miller is a likely...slot receiver or developmental balanced receiver.

1.5 10 yd split on Austin and 1.61 for Miller. Not the same level of speed. Miller might have more explosiveness for real football plays but Austin is probably twice the player in the open field.

 

[iowajerms]

Attached .pdf files of ESPN Insider articles

McShay's latest big board
Kiper's latest big board
Top prospect for every position - by Kiper

 

[NinerSickness]

Attached .pdf files of ESPN Insider articles

McShay's latest big board
Kiper's latest big board
Top prospect for every position - by Kiper

CRAP! I was hoping nobody would notice how good Darron Lee is.

 

[iowajerms]

This is Top 10. Attached is .pdf of full article

ESPN Insider - Kiper: NFL Mock Draft 3.0 ... with free agency in mind

Free agency doesn't change draft evaluations, only the occasional need. And I don't think it shifts needs dramatically, because it's the rare team that will tell you it was able to truly fix problems on the free-agency market. In the draft, you want core players you expect to be with the organization for years to come. You don't see these guys as fixes to immediate problems. Teams use rookies, but they don't want to have to depend on them. Free agents, on the other hand, simply aren't expected to be around for a long time.

With free agency the hot topic during the next week, here's an updated mock, and a note on how free agency could change the pick.

A player with an asterisk next to his name has a year of eligibility remaining. Two asterisks implies two years.

1. Tennessee Titans
*Laremy Tunsil, OT, Ole Miss

The top left tackle in the draft goes to a team where offensive line help is a must. I'm certain the Titans will continue to shop this pick, but it could be difficult to get a good offer.

Free-agency effect: As usual, free agency isn't exactly flush with offensive tackle help. The Titans can shop elsewhere knowing they have a tackle option here. While it's not a free-agency move, the addition of DeMarco Murray is another reminder the O-line should be a priority.

2. Cleveland Browns
Carson Wentz, QB, North Dakota State

I wouldn't rule out Cleveland taking a non-quarterback here and then getting one with the No. 32 pick, but Wentz would make sense here as a super physical talent whom new coach Hue Jackson can develop.

Free-agency effect: Is there a QB in free agency clearly better than a healthy Josh McCown, one they want to pay big dollars for? Right now, I doubt the Browns make a splash there.

3. San Diego Chargers
*Ronnie Stanley, OT, Notre Dame

The offensive line has been a major problem area going on a few years, and Stanley can be plugged in immediately. The Chargers need D-line help as well, but the draft is much deeper at that position.

Free-agency effect: If the Chargers find O-line help in free agency, it could shift the thinking here if they have players graded similarly.

4. Dallas Cowboys
DeForest Buckner, DE, Oregon

A good combination of clear need and a really good player available. Buckner brings versatility and the ability to disrupt the pocket.

Free-agency effect: There are some decent pass-rushers in free agency, but the Cowboys don't have the cap space to win bidding wars.

5. Jacksonville Jaguars
*Jalen Ramsey, DB, Florida State

If there's a debate among evaluators on Ramsey, it's whether he'll end up at cornerback or safety. I think a little patience with him at cornerback will go a long way. He has star potential. Jacksonville should be thrilled if he's available here.

Free-agency effect: The Jags have the money to get multiple players in free agency, and should target the secondary. But when it comes to the draft, I think they should be taking the best player available, period.

6. Baltimore Ravens
*Joey Bosa, DE, Ohio State

The Ravens need help in the secondary and on the O-line, but it's hard to pass on a talent as complete as Bosa at this spot. A great pass-rusher does as much for a secondary as a good corner.

Free-agency effect: With Kelechi Osemele headed elsewhere via free agency, the offensive line could be in play here, but the value is a question if Stanley is off the board.

7. San Francisco 49ers
*Jared Goff, QB, California

Even if Colin Kaepernick remains at quarterback, I don't know if Goff would be out of the equation here. I think he could develop into something special for coach Chip Kelly and would provide insurance for Kap.

Free-agency effect: While a rebuilding team needs to be thinking "best player available" here, the 49ers have a lot of money to spend -- and needs all over -- so I do think priorities could shift.

8. Miami Dolphins
*Myles Jack, LB, UCLA

A top-five player on my board, I think Jack could benefit any team in the league, thanks to his skill set at linebacker and special ability to cover from that position.

Free-agency effect: The Dolphins could be in the market for a pass-rusher if Olivier Vernon is too expensive, and that could push a guy like Shaq Lawson up the board.

9. Tampa Bay Buccaneers
*Vernon Hargreaves, CB, Florida

No change here from the previous mock. Hargreaves is highly regarded throughout the league and certainly could be drafted before this point.

Free-agency effect: The Bucs could get secondary help in free agency, but Hargreaves at this point would be hard to pass up, too.

10. New York Giants
*Shaq Lawson, DE, Clemson

Even if Jason Pierre-Paul were to return, the Giants would be wise to add pass-rushing talent, and Lawson is a good fit here. Like JPP, he's also underrated as a complete defensive end in that he's good against the run.

Free-agency effect: The Giants do have some shopping to do, and if they add pass-rush help, perhaps this pick becomes a cornerback such as Hargreaves, if available.

 

[HammerDown]