Manning chooses Broncos

[Flyingiguana]

with a full offseason and upgrades at wr i can't really see how smith doesn't improve. vernon had an off year last season, that's good for a few tds right there. still a huge hole at RG, but even we have the pieces for a much better line if davis slides inside and we start boone. wildcard being kilgore, but hard to make a call on him.

the biggest question is can smith play for 4 quarters like he does when we're trailing late in games?

 

[imac_21]

You are either a hater or ignorant.

He was very good last year. Admit that fact and we can debate how likely it is he repeats that vs. a better or worse year and is the investment worth it.

And this offense was was never gonna be new hottness in 2011. But you are Miss-identifying the main reason for the severe pull back. The preseason pass protection was horrible. QBs were getting sacked 13% of the time.

I'm sorry, but Smith was not "very good" last year.

 

[dredinis21]

Such BS. If only you make half the excuses for Crabtree, Staley, and the other offensive players that you consistently bring down as you do for Alex. You're the absolute inverse of Cazic. He used to prop up everyone else on offense to make Alex look worse than he is, while now you're discrediting everyone on offense to make Alex look better than he is. You've even thrown the coaching staff, including our coach of the year, under the bus to prop up Smith as a QB.

I've never seen such blind and unwarranted loyalty towards a player, and especially a QB, that has been largely disappointing for the majority of his career. It's excuse, after excuse, after excuse with you. At what point does Alex become the primary denominator for the ineptitude of this offense? Alex is not gonna be surrounded by a star studded cast at every offensive unit. That's NEVER gonna happen. While I don't think we had an amazing supporting cast last year, we had much better players than our 26th ranked offense indicated.

There's no question that the situation Alex has been thrown into wasn't ideal. But the main job of a legitimate starting QB is to make everyone else around him better. Offensive players are usually only as good, or as mediocre, or as bad as their QB is. An OL isn't gonna play their best if the QB isn't efficient at adjusting blitzing schemes at the LOS or at maneuvering within the pocket. RBs aren't gonna play their best if opposing defenses don't respect the passing game and consistently stack the box. WRs aren't gonna play their best if the QB isn't seeing the entire field and isn't taking chances with the football.

I'm not an Alex hater. In fact, I think most here remember that I used to defend him up and down ESPN's board his first three years in the league against guys like PlasmaHero and Cazic who were too quick to judge Alex as an NFL QB. But after 7 years if you can't tell what Alex is or isn't capable of, then you need to start looking at yourself.

I was wrong last year about Smith. I thought he'd completely implode in Harbaugh's quick timing and play-action based offense. He didn't. He emerged as a marginal starting QB and a decent game manager that doesn't turn the ball over. He did, however, display the same inefficiencies that he did years prior. An inability to create on his own or ad-lib when a play breaks down, an inability to throw WRs open and take chances with the ball, an inability to make pre-snap reads and calls on the LOS, and an in-ability to consistently place the ball where it needs to be. In 7 years that hasn't changed, and I'm not being a hate, I'm just being realistic.

Even Harbaugh in his short time as the 49ers HC saw Alex's limitations. We saw less timing patterns in SF than was did in Palo Alto. We saw less play-action in SF than saw in Palo Alto. Harbaugh essentially created a fishnet offense designed to limit Alex as much as possible and to ride the running game and defense to the playoffs. Taking Tim Tebow out of the equation, Alex Smith was dead last in the league in attempts last season. And I doubt it's because Harbaugh, who's a former QB, doesn't like throwing ball.

Even under Harbaugh Alex actually averaged LESS yards per game and LESS TDs per game than he did under Singletary. Is that the improvement everyone is talking about? Cam Newton, coming from a spread offense and 1 year of legitimate college ball, made more plays in one season than Alex has in the last three years in the NFL.

Why the hell should we bring Alex back? So we can eek our way through games hoping that we don't make any mistakes again? Bullseye is on our back now, and that's NOT gonna work again. At some point we're gonna need our QB to make plays, and Alex has not shown he can consistently do that in 7+ years he's been in a 49ers uniform.

Honestly, I don't even know why I'm wasting my time with this. You're just gonna come back with the same BS excuses like you usually do. Blaming the OL, the WRs, the coaches, the lockout, anything other than Alex himself. If it makes me a hater to point all of this out to you and the other extreme pro Alex posters, then I'm a motherfuckin' hater.

I would rep the FUCK out of this if it would allow me to. I agree with every motherfuckin' thing that was said in this post.

 

[imac_21]

I would rep the FUCK out of this if it would allow me to. I agree with every motherfuckin' thing that was said in this post.

Dammit. Now you're going to make me go back and read it.

 

[ViperVisor]

I'm sorry, but Smith was not "very good" last year.

But he was. If you want to argue that is was an anomaly like Rich Aurilia that is fine but denying what is plain to see is not acceptable.

 

[dredinis21]

But he was. If you want to argue that is was an anomaly like Rich Aurilia that is fine but denying what is plain to see is not acceptable.

You are WRONG. What about last year was good aside from his low INT numbers, which coupled with his low completion and attempt numbers don't make that number as impressive? Was he solid? Yes. Good? Not quite. Great? Hell to the naw.

 

[clyde_carbon]

with a full offseason and upgrades at wr i can't really see how smith doesn't improve. vernon had an off year last season, that's good for a few tds right there. still a huge hole at RG, but even we have the pieces for a much better line if davis slides inside and we start boone. wildcard being kilgore, but hard to make a call on him.

the biggest question is can smith play for 4 quarters like he does when we're trailing late in games?

Oh really? It didn't seem like he was off in the playoffs.

 

[clyde_carbon]

We went over this before. It is obvious to most people.
3rd in the voting for the A.P. Comeback Player of the Year Award.
They gave him votes cause he was very good. Ryan Grant came back and was just OK.

LOL.

 

[ViperVisor]

You are WRONG. What about last year was good aside from his low INT numbers, which coupled with his low completion and attempt numbers don't make that number as impressive? Was he solid? Yes. Good? Not quite. Great? Hell to the naw.

Who said Great? He was just below below Great.

Reg+Post season

He completed 60% of his passes.
3639 Yards
22 TDs
5 INTs
+ a little bit of rushing

Very Good. Not Great. But no doubt Very Good.

 

[dredinis21]

You can say VD was off, but everything else was ON. The gameplan was on. The OL was better then it has ever been in the Smith era. The running game was the best it has been since Norv was around. Yet you single out one guy, who arguably (not very well I might add) had an off year. That's a load of shit and I am dumber for having read that so thank you for that.

 

[Flyingiguana]

Oh really? It didn't seem like he was off in the playoffs.

u mean to tell me vernon didn't have an off year? look at his numbers against the prior 2 seasons. early in the season he was blocking a lot until miller started. then he had a good number of drops.

i'm expecting a big season next year from vernon. i wouldn't rule out gronk's record getting broken either. having some actual talent at wr will help move the coverage away from vernon.

 

[Flyingiguana]

Who said Great? He was just below below Great.

Reg+Post season

He completed 60% of his passes.
3639 Yards
22 TDs
5 INTs
+ a little bit of rushing

Very Good. Not Great. But no doubt Very Good.

add in 7 of the 14 wins were late game comebacks. he didn't have great stats, but he was clutch when needed more often than not.

 

[ViperVisor]

add in 7 of the 14 wins were late game comebacks. he didn't have great stats, but he was clutch when needed more often than not.

That is a little boost of context to the stats that were not unduly padded in a few 4th Qs of garbage games.

 

[imac_21]

But he was. If you want to argue that is was an anomaly like Rich Aurilia that is fine but denying what is plain to see is not acceptable.

No he wasn't. He was very good in ONE category. He was below average in multiple categories.

I'm not going to have this conversation again though. If what Smith did is your standard for very good in 2011 you either ignore every stat that isn't turnovers, or your standards are way too low.

 

[imac_21]

Who said Great? He was just below below Great.

Reg+Post season

He completed 60% of his passes.
3639 Yards
22 TDs
5 INTs
+ a little bit of rushing

Very Good. Not Great. But no doubt Very Good.

Factoring in his 2 playoff games he's still 12th in the league in yards and 11th in TDs compared to every other QBs regular season.

Shouldn't very good qualify as top 10 in those categories when you include two extra games?

 

[jayviabay]

Who said Great? He was just below below Great.

Reg+Post season

He completed 60% of his passes.
3639 Yards (3100 15gms)
22 TDs
5 INTs
+ a little bit of rushing

Very Good. Not Great. But no doubt Very Good.

Tavaris Jackson did the same thing so do you also think he is very good???

 

[ViperVisor]

Factoring in his 2 playoff games he's still 12th in the league in yards and 11th in TDs compared to every other QBs regular season.

Shouldn't very good qualify as top 10 in those categories when you include two extra games?

Not when that brings you to 15th in attempts.

And it was very good in one category.

It was THE category and it was the 5th best All-Time.

And Below Average in 1 Category, TD%. Not Multiple.

 

[ViperVisor]

Tavaris Jackson did the same thing so do you also think he is very good???

Do you think I am stupid???

Tavaris had 80% of the TDs Smith had in the reg season while INTs were 260% of Smith.

 

[jayviabay]

Do you think I am stupid???

Tavaris had 80% of the TDs Smith had in the reg season while INTs were 260% of Smith.

it was a simple question based on some of the stats you mentioned. if i thought you were stupid, i would of said "i think you are stupid"... very simple. thats cute how you put it in percentages to make it sound better than it is. yes Jackson thru 14tds to Smiths 17 and 8 more ints. He still did more than half of the things you listed equal to smith. So i guess Smith gets a biased pass right?

basically you are telling me if Jackson played in one more regular season game and thru a few tds and turned the ball over 8 less times during the course of the season, there would be no doubt he is very good?

 

[imac_21]

Not when that brings you to 15th in attempts.

And it was very good in one category.

It was THE category and it was the 5th best All-Time.

And Below Average in 1 Category, TD%. Not Multiple.

It's not THE category. Preventing turnovers is important, but if you don't score, you don't win.

Would you prefer a QB throw 3 TDs and 3 INTs and put up 21 points, or throw 0 TDs and 0 INTs and put up 0 points?

You might not win with 21, but you definitely won't win with 0.

Why do you think he was so low in attempts? Why do you think every QB in the league with 16 starts threw more passes than Smith (as well as some with less than 16 starts)?

Is it because of our super conservative offensive approach, our record setting run game, or our limited QB?

Which would you choose?