Let's laugh at Robbie Cano

[obxyankeefan]

They can be pretty crazy in there... defiantly the most dysfunctional team board I've ever witnessed.

San Francisco has them beat. If you even look at something crossed eyed on the Giants or 49ers boards, they ban you from them.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Mariners have him for another 8.5 years. That's fucking brutal.

It's brutal if he doesn't improve.

His BABIP suggests that he will. I've posted about it to the point of getting sick of saying it. If his BABIP was what it was last year, he'd be hitting anywhere from .280 to .290. It's bad luck, and it's getting to his head which is leading to him striking out more, which also impacts his BA. In addition, despite the fact that Cano's average distance for fly balls he has hit, for some reason his HR/FB percentage has dropped from 9% last year to 2% this year. Another instance of bad luck.

Perhaps I'm delusional and morphing sabermetrics as a way of making an argument that this isn't permanent.

There is a good case to be made he won't ever hit 20 HRs again, but I would be surprised if he doesn't finish the season above .270 and rebound next year.

 

[Rock Strongo]

Oh I remember them, but on this site most of the Yankee and Red Sox fans went to Zig's site and I don't know what they debated last year. Also as a Yankees fan why am I going to debate weather the Sox or Mariners have the better 2B?

lol that was what i was going for


he leaves NY, now hes "not the best 2nd baseman in the game" according to the axe and wife beater gallery.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

I haven't done much digging into Cano's numbers, and haven't watched enough to get a real read on if it's a specific pitch beating him, but I would be shocked if he was this bad going forward. And here I thought it was bad enough with Omar Infante...

 

[obxyankeefan]

It's brutal if he doesn't improve.

His BABIP suggests that he will. I've posted about it to the point of getting sick of saying it. If his BABIP was what it was last year, he'd be hitting anywhere from .280 to .290. It's bad luck, and it's getting to his head which is leading to him striking out more, which also impacts his BA. In addition, despite the fact that Cano's average distance for fly balls he has hit, for some reason his HR/FB percentage has dropped from 9% last year to 2% this year. Another instance of bad luck.

Perhaps I'm delusional and morphing sabermetrics as a way of making an argument that this isn't permanent.

There is a good case to be made he won't ever hit 20 HRs again, but I would be surprised if he doesn't finish the season above .270 and rebound next year.

It is easier to rebound at 25 then 32, but look at his 2008 season. Cano rebounded nicely from that year.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

not to me, and i thought of it.

I understand that. I've seen this position from you a few times now. I guess that on a public forum such as this, being able to express thoughts is as important -- if not more so -- as having them.

 

[Rock Strongo]

I understand that. I've seen this position from you a few times now. I guess that on a public forum such as this, being able to express thoughts is as important -- if not more so -- as having them.

it was in english too. i also have an english degree from williams.

neat huh?

 

[TheDayMan]

You're talking about a franchise that hasn't been to the playoffs since 2001. We're bound to be a bit sensitive.

I don't know why, you'd think we'd be used to this kind of thing by now. There's something funny about the guys who talk about how they've been a fan since the beginning, or the 80s, or the 90s, or whatever (like they're the only ones and their opinions and feelings are more meaningful because of it) and then completely panic and go into stubborn child mode as soon as the team sucks. You'd think they could handle it a little better, considering they've been a fan all these years...

 

[seahawksfan234]

Good read. Is Robinson Cano Still a Viable Fantasy Option? | FanGraphs Fantasy Baseball

Interesting.

Hate to sound like I'm beating a dead horse, but Cano's BABIP on off-speed pitches is .185. That's a pretty big red flag, especially considering that it was .386 in 2012. It would be interesting to see what his BA would be if you adjusted for that. I think the bigger concern is his regression on breaking balls, not off-speed pitches. As you can see, Robbie has regressed on breaking balls despite having an identical BABIP. Yet with his regression on off-speed pitches, you can explain it by the astronomical drop in BABIP of .200 points.

Good read though, thanks for posting this.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

You're talking about a franchise that hasn't been to the playoffs since 2001. We're bound to be a bit sensitive.

I can understand that, but if you don't want discussion about what's wrong with Cano, maybe don't start threads about what's wrong with Cano.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I don't know why, you'd think we'd be used to this kind of thing by now. There's something funny about the guys who talk about how they've been a fan since the beginning, or the 80s, or the 90s, or whatever (like they're the only ones and their opinions and feelings are more meaningful because of it) and then completely panic and go into stubborn child mode as soon as the team sucks. You'd think they could handle it a little better, considering they've been a fan all these years...

I was kinda surprised they jumped on him like that. @SlinkyRedfoot didn't say anything that really deserved being jumped on. All he said was that we've got Cano for a long time. I'll be the first to jump on a troll, but I don't think Redfoot was trolling.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I can understand that, but if you don't want discussion about what's wrong with Cano, maybe don't start threads about what's wrong with Cano.

I think the poster misinterpreted your intentions. You brought up a valid point about Cano's regression hitting off-speed/breaking balls, but the comment you made at the end about us having him for another 8 and a half years probably set him off. Personally it wouldn't bother me, but I can see why that would rub someone the wrong way because that could cripple this franchise even more than it already is.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

it was in english too. i also have an english degree from williams.

neat huh?

That is neat. Regardless, you don't effectively express all your thoughts on here.

 

[seahawksfan234]

It is easier to rebound at 25 then 32, but look at his 2008 season. Cano rebounded nicely from that year.

I think when you look at his BABIP, it gives a nice case that his stats will improve. He's still hitting the ball hard, just been unlucky in where he has hit it.

He'll never hit 30 HRs again, but I would be surprised if he never hits at least .300 again.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I was kinda surprised they jumped on him like that. @SlinkyRedfoot didn't say anything that really deserved being jumped on. All he said was that we've got Cano for a long time. I'll be the first to jump on a troll, but I don't think Redfoot was trolling.

I wasn't. I have been told that if I go on a team's forum, I've gotta watch what I say.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I wasn't. I have been told that if I go on a team's forum, I've gotta watch what I say.

I figured you weren't, sometimes people can be touchy though when it's not a fan of the team offering criticism.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Interesting.

Hate to sound like I'm beating a dead horse, but Cano's BABIP on off-speed pitches is .185. That's a pretty big red flag, especially considering that it was .386 in 2012. It would be interesting to see what his BA would be if you adjusted for that. I think the bigger concern is his regression on breaking balls, not off-speed pitches. As you can see, Robbie has regressed on breaking balls despite having an identical BABIP. Yet with his regression on off-speed pitches, you can explain it by the astronomical drop in BABIP of .200 points.

Good read though, thanks for posting this.

Good insight. That's a damn reasonable argument.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I think the poster misinterpreted your intentions. You brought up a valid point about Cano's regression hitting off-speed/breaking balls, but the comment you made at the end about us having him for another 8 and a half years probably set him off. Personally it wouldn't bother me, but I can see why that would rub someone the wrong way because that could cripple this franchise even more than it already is.

That's fine, too. A little overly sensitive to be on the internet, in my opinion, but whatever. Then he goes into this "I think Cleveland sucks, The Cavs lost and the Browns suck" baby rant - none of which I give a fuck about.

 

[obxyankeefan]

I think when you look at his BABIP, it gives a nice case that his stats will improve. He's still hitting the ball hard, just been unlucky in where he has hit it.

He'll never hit 30 HRs again, but I would be surprised if he never hits at least .300 again.

This. I have stated a number of times in this thread and in the past, that I wish Cano all the best in Seattle. Safeco doesn't have the short porch in right that Yankee Stadium does, so his HR drop was easily foreseen, the BA drop this year is a surprise and hopefully is just a short-term blip.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Good insight. That's a damn reasonable argument.

There's a compelling argument that teams have been adjusting for him, but I would find it strange that these defensive adjustments would only impact his BABIP on off-speed pitches. It's nearly identical on fastballs and breaking balls, but incredibly lower on off-speed pitches. Would be interesting to look more into that.