Jets to interview Quinn and Cable

[Screamin12th]

Didn't edit the last post fast enough, so this'll have to go here.

Besides, mobile QBs do tend to get sacked a lot. Randall Cunningham had 40 or more sacks 7 times and led the league in times sacked 5 times. Vick was sacked over 40 twice, including his only year with 16 games. Kaepernick has averaged 45 a year the last 2 seasons. RGIII has been sacked nearly 3 times a game for his career. Sacks just seem to be something you get with mobile guys.

not true you just see more mobile QB behind poor lines, The Statues got killed. lol
Also i was going with Matt's 29 sacks against him to Russell's 42. Sure 29 is only 13 less than 42 but what do you believe a statue back there would have had? i think 60 easy. Still Russell avoids pressure and there was a stat last season that showed he would start scrambling at around 1.4 seconds. All i can say is this Line under Cable has NOT improved.

Sack totals went 50( before mobile Wilson )-33-44-42, i would take that 33 over and over again as it was his best season coaching the line (2012). This team has averaged 42.5 sacks per season against with Cable (4 seasons) and and averaged 37 the 4 seasons before Cable got here. The Hire was to make the line BETTER not worse but that has not worked. Also you really going to use Marshawns Average when he came over after 4 games into the season? he was learning a whole new Offense and blocking scheme in front of him.

People Cable had the Zone Scheme Carroll wanted to install it was that reason alone that he hired him. Funny thing is Just last week Carroll was asked about what he though about Cable and he said nothing about his ability to coach he said he loves his desire and passion for the game. Yeah ? what about his coaching Carroll?

Ok we got the zone scheme in now give the control to someone that will elevate these players to play on a higher level. We have seen that they can do it every now and again.

 

[RegentDenali]

Now that Marrone opted out in Buffalo there's rumblings that he could be high on the Jets list. I kinda figured Quinn would be the Jets guy but if Marrone goes there I think that enhances the chances greatly that Quinn stays. Even though he interviewed with the Niners I dont see a match there. I think if they go with an outside hire it will be offensive guy.

Marrone and the Cards DC are likely candidates before Quinn. I think Quinn is still in play for the Falcons job. Still have to worry about them.

 

[blstoker]

Sack totals went 50( before mobile Wilson )-33-44-42, i would take that 33 over and over again as it was his best season coaching the line (2012). This team has averaged 42.5 sacks per season against with Cable (4 seasons) and and averaged 37 the 4 seasons before Cable got here. The Hire was to make the line BETTER not worse but that has not worked. Also you really going to use Marshawns Average when he came over after 4 games into the season? he was learning a whole new Offense and blocking scheme in front of him.

Russell Wilson holds the ball longer than any other QB in the NFL, including Big Ben. Yes, his elusiveness helps him not take sacks, but had Hasselbeck held the ball for nearly 3 seconds every pass he would have been close to 70 sacks, and I doubt that is an exaggeration (also, 2010 WRs weren't any better than this years, and were probably worse). I'm not saying the line is great (or even that Cable is great) but that the line this year isn't as bad as 2010, at least this line can do one thing well - 2010 couldn't even do that.

I would love to know how quickly each line gave up pressure and exactly how quickly the QBs got rid of the ball, unfortunately they don't keep those stats (at least where I can find them).

 

[Screamin12th]

Russell Wilson holds the ball longer than any other QB in the NFL, including Big Ben. Yes, his elusiveness helps him not take sacks, but had Hasselbeck held the ball for nearly 3 seconds every pass he would have been close to 70 sacks, and I doubt that is an exaggeration (also, 2010 WRs weren't any better than this years, and were probably worse). I'm not saying the line is great (or even that Cable is great) but that the line this year isn't as bad as 2010, at least this line can do one thing well - 2010 couldn't even do that.

I would love to know how quickly each line gave up pressure and exactly how quickly the QBs got rid of the ball, unfortunately they don't keep those stats (at least where I can find them).

yes because he runs around so much, when he is sacked it's normally before he even has a chance to run around.

Stats do not lie and the Blocking has REGRESSED under Cable not got better so please stop trying to defend Cable. lol

as far as timing Stats that was something Sando use to give us ... use to before he went pay per view lol

 

[blstoker]

Stats do not lie and the Blocking has REGRESSED under Cable not got better so please stop trying to defend Cable. lol

It's not Cable, but the current players I'm defending.

Right, stats:

Passes = attempts + sacks (wish I knew which QB runs were scrambles, so I could add those as well).
2010 - 579 passes, 35 sacks 5.8 yards per play, 6.0 % sacks, 385 rushes, 3.7 yards per rush
2011 - 559 passes, 50 sacks 5.6 yards per play, 8.9 % sacks, 444 rushes, 4.0 yards per rush
2012 - 438 passes, 33 sacks 6.9 yards per play, 7.5 % sacks, 536 rushes, 4.8 yards per rush
2013 - 464 passes, 44 sacks 7.0 yards per play, 9.5 % sacks, 509 rushes, 4.3 yards per rush
2014 - 496 passes, 42 sacks 6.6 yards per play, 8.5 % sacks, 525 rushes, 5.3 yards per rush

4 years with Cable (averages)
489.25 passes, 42.25 sacks 6.4 yards per play, 8.6 % sacks, 503.5 rushes, 4.6 yards per rush

4 years before Cable (averages)
591.25 passes, 37.0 sacks, 5.7 yards per play, 6.3 % sacks, 406.75 rushes, 3.9 yards per rush

2010 - 2014

LT - Russell Okung vs. Russell Okung
LG - Ben Hamilton vs. James Carpenter
C - Chris Spencer vs. Max Unger
RG - Stacy Andrews vs. JR Sweezy
RT - Sean Locklear vs. Justin Britt

I'd take the 2014 line (younger, more potential) but at worst it's a wash.

 

[Screamin12th]

8.6% to 6.3% is not a wash. He brought Cable in to make the line better not more of the same or a wash like you said and it's not even a wash. It's worse.

 

[blstoker]

8.6% to 6.3% is not a wash. He brought Cable in to make the line better not more of the same or a wash like you said and it's not even a wash. It's worse.

No, they brought him in so they could run the ball, not pass it. He's done that job very well. Even if you consider 6.3% sacks to be protecting well, they couldn't open a running lane to save their lives. So, yeah, it's a wash, at best.


The thing I have been trying to get across, and obviously failing, is that Hasselbeck was the reason Hasselbeck wasn't getting sacked. He got rid of the ball. It's hard to sack a QB who doesn't have the ball, so he threw it. It kept us from losing yards a lot, but he was also picked 17 times (4% of his passes his last three seasons), and could've been worse had Mike Williams not turned into a pleasant surprise coming away with hotly contested balls in 2010.

I was happy for Hass when he left, cause he wouldn't have to play behind the line we had, cause he was gonna get killed. The 2010 line for the Seahawks was one of the worst I've ever seen. This line hasn't been great, but they've done what matters most to this offense, they've opened holes, and they open them pretty consistently. Yes, they do allow guys into the backfield, but there isn't a line ever that didn't do that. Hell, Shaun Alexander was hit in the backfield 1 in 5 attempts in 2005, arguably the best line the Seahawks have ever had.

Yes, if they would bring the sack percentage down to 6.3%, that would be awesome (31 would have been the number this year instead of 42), but how many of those 42 were him trying to make something out of a play he should have thrown away already - he had at least 1 of those against St. Louis (and I've only seen 6 games and I could swear I remember at least a half dozen more, I just can't find any video on it right now).

 

[blstoker]

Pressure after 2 seconds. Unless there's a quick pass, nothing much he could do.


3 seconds of good protect, he leaves the pocket without pressure, creating pressure from right side, huge lose ensues.


About 3.5 seconds before pressured (partially due to play design), decides not to throw it, sacked.

These are just the few sacks of Wilson I could find on youtube, and as you can see I even posted the one that shows the line not giving him enough time. Russell makes things happen when he's back there, but sometimes it doesn't work out. It makes his line look bad when you look at the stats (just like he makes them look good on the sacks when he avoids a rush).

A Cable line will never be the best at pass protection, but that isn't what this team is paying him for. His teams when he's offensive line coach average 2300 rushing yards a season, several didn't make it to 3000 yards passing and all but 2 had 40 or more sacks (39 by Oakland the year he interimed).

 

[jakedog56]

First off, I am not defending Cable or the OL players persay but I want to point out that the highest praise given to the OL is this thread so far is that they are an "adaquate" run blocking squad. But this is certainly not giving them their due. This OL is a very good to excellent run blocking unit. Unfortunately their pass blocking is just as bad or worse than their run blocking is good.

The Seahawks consistently face 8 man fronts but we still manage to pound out league leading rushing numbers. I know that part of this is because of Wilson's and Lynch's excellent efforts on the ground but I don't want to discount the contributions of the OL to the running game.

As far as the injuries go, I feel that Unger is by far our best OL player and there is a noticable drop off when he is out. When you have a C that is good at making the OL shifts it makes all of the difference. We had this previously with Tobeck and even Bush, but we sucked pretty bad when we had Chris Spencer as our C. It is too bad that Unger misses so much time with injuries (same for Okung).

What we have to remember is that because of the salary cap rules, it is impossible to top units across the board. The Seahawks have concentrated on keeping the D shored up and letting the O be a little more patchwork. They tried to upgrade at WR by spending a ton (Harvin. Have fun being a Jet and losing A LOT! Moron!). They spent top dollar at TE on Zack Miller (like him but he is not worth top dollar even when he is healthy. Good blocking TE though.) We gave a big contract to Lynch (rightfully so). But at no point have they invested top dollar money on the OL with the exception of Okung (who, as mentioned, is oft-injured).

Okung's cap number actually goes down from $11.2 million to $7.2 million next year, as does Unger's (from $6.2 million to $5.6 million). Carpenter is a FA. Sweezy and Britt are under contract for $785,000 and $694,000 respectively. So we essentially have 4 starters locked up next year for about $14 million. That is not a lot of money when you compare it to the other units. For example the DL has $25.3 on 4 players (Avril, Mebane, Bennett, and McDonald). And look at the money that the LOB is getting! Plus Russell Wilson's and Bobby Wagner's huge raises are coming up.

You can't spend big money on all areas. The Seahawks have made a concious decision to spend their money on areas other than the OL (and WR now that Harvin is gone). That is why we have below average units in those areas. Yet we still keep on winning! I am not ready to can coaches based on this.

You can have the best jockey in the world but if you stick him on a lame horse he is not going to finish in the money. We are still in the money, so something must be going according to plan.

 

[boogiewithstu2007]

Russell Wilson holds the ball longer than any other QB in the NFL, including Big Ben. Yes, his elusiveness helps him not take sacks, but had Hasselbeck held the ball for nearly 3 seconds every pass he would have been close to 70 sacks, and I doubt that is an exaggeration (also, 2010 WRs weren't any better than this years, and were probably worse). I'm not saying the line is great (or even that Cable is great) but that the line this year isn't as bad as 2010, at least this line can do one thing well - 2010 couldn't even do that.

I would love to know how quickly each line gave up pressure and exactly how quickly the QBs got rid of the ball, unfortunately they don't keep those stats (at least where I can find them).

West coast offense is quick hitters, and Matt didn't need to hang onto the ball nearly as long... Like you said Russ holds onto the ball way longer, totally agree... Also it's hard to totally bag on our line when we do run the ball effectively.. We lead the league in rushing between Russ and Lynch, our O-line deserves some credit there...

 

[JMR]

West coast offense is quick hitters, and Matt didn't need to hang onto the ball nearly as long... Like you said Russ holds onto the ball way longer, totally agree... Also it's hard to totally bag on our line when we do run the ball effectively.. We lead the league in rushing between Russ and Lynch, our O-line deserves some credit there...

Yes, #1 rushing O in the league. But RW is a big part of that stat, and he's generally not running through holes created by the line. He's leading the NFL in ypc by going one way when the D thinks he's handing it to Lynch going another way or he's scrambling and then taking off. Lynch gets met behind the line quite a bit. He makes incredible effort after contact to turn losses into marginal gains. The line is "ok" for the most part at run blocking. They are well below average in pass-pro. Overall, certainly nothing better than an average to slightly below average line.

My hope is that with Unger coming back and not facing DLs in the playoffs as nasty as the Rams or 49ers, these guys will rally and we'll see a spike in performance. But whenever we go up against defenses in our division, I get nervous about the kind of shots RW is going to take and the kind of beating Lynch is going to endure just to get a 3 yard gain.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Higher draft picks don't always mean high talent though ... Some guys just don't pan out at the NFL level ... Our line while obviously not great overall, has been solid in the running game since Cable got here ... Also the young guys seem to plug in and do well even when we've been down 3 starters at times ... I've had more frustration with Bevelle honestly ....

Agree plus higher draft choices that do excel cost quite a bit more after their initial contract. Sounds great to draft high, get great players but with a salary cap you need to retool every couple years. Give me some good pass protectors that can run block and build around them. Avoid the best lineman they cost you too much down the road requiring sacrafices at other positions.

 

[SeattleCoug]

Per Shefter, Quinn has interviews lined up with the Jets and Bears today and Falcons and Bills tomorrow. Also I think he has already interviewed with San Fran.
Bevell is also interviewing with the Bills