I have a question for all of the BPA thinkers.

[j_y19]

Shark, Keim just cam out with an analysis on Schreff that summarizes my thinking on the guy. I'd be interested in your opinion.

Again, who determines what a reach is though?? Mel Kiper?? Seriously most of these mocks DO take into account team need and high light factor when they start saying well this team will take this guy and he is worth this pick. Or as I asked before, do you really deep down believe Jamies Winston is the best player in the 2015 draft?? And yes there might be a OT at 37 who has a first round grade, but I dont believe that guy will be as good as Scherff. Otherwise that guy would be considered the best O-lineman in this draft. Hell Morgan Moses had a 2nd round grade going into last years draft.. but from what we see now, we should have waited to see if he was there in the 7th.

Well, since it's my opinion (for what ever that is worth) I determine if he is a reach. Keim just came out with an analysis on Schreff that summarizes my thoughts. I just don't beleive we can miss on this pick. We need to take someone that has the fewest questions possible and in my mind, he has some big ones.

Washington Redskins Blog - ESPN

 

[j_y19]

Shark, Keim just cam out with an analysis on Schreff that summarizes my thinking on the guy. I'd be interested in your opinion.


Well, since it's my opinion (for what ever that is worth) I determine if he is a reach. Keim just came out with an analysis on Schreff that summarizes my thoughts. I just don't beleive we can miss on this pick. We need to take someone that has the fewest questions possible and in my mind, he has some big ones.

Washington Redskins Blog - ESPN

Actually, at the end of the day, McLoughan determines if he is a reach. My opinion doesn't mean squat.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

Actually, at the end of the day, McLoughan determines if he is a reach.

Yep.

 

[Sharkinva]

And I got a dollar that says if we do in fact take him at five, there will be at least five posters calling it a reach even if SMGM comes on and says in fact they had Scherff rate as the best player not only at his position, but in the draft.

 

[j_y19]

And I got a dollar that says if we do in fact take him at five, there will be at least five posters calling it a reach even if SMGM comes on and says in fact they had Scherff rate as the best player not only at his position, but in the draft.

You will only need 4 more

 

[Sharkinva]

You will only need 4 more

And when we take another pass rusher, or WR or some other Skill position... you wont fault me for voicing the opinion that we took sexy over substance as we have been doing for years.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

And I got a dollar that says if we do in fact take him at five, there will be at least five posters calling it a reach even if SMGM comes on and says in fact they had Scherff rate as the best player not only at his position, but in the draft.

Be honest now Shark, hard to EVER have a pick where there aren't dissenters.

So I'll give you your dollar now

Value is subjective (need and BPA is always debated) and no one ever really knows how the story of players will unfold until time passes. And even that pre-supposes NO injuries and a bit of luck along the way.

That's why you have to have smart talent evaluators to better the odds. Cue GMSM.

We haven't had that for a long time. We will have to see how this unfolds.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

And when we take another pass rusher, or WR or some other Skill position... you wont fault me for voicing the opinion that we took sexy over substance as we have been doing for years.

I'll look forward to your meltdown

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Got to disagree. IN the past few days alone I have seen people question whether we should even consider using the first round pick on an O-lineman that isnt a LT. I have also seen many throw out the FACT that we should be able to find starting O-lineman in the 2nd and 3rd round.

O-line is generally the one position that most people consider as a last resort for a first round pick, especially a top five first round pick unless we are talking about a LT.

LOL Not wanting to use the 5th overall pick on a non-LT OL is hardly the same as fans thinking OL are "just a bunch of fat guys pushing each other around" as you had claimed.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Got to disagree. IN the past few days alone I have seen people question whether we should even consider using the first round pick on an O-lineman that isnt a LT. I have also seen many throw out the FACT that we should be able to find starting O-lineman in the 2nd and 3rd round.

I posted the figures a few weeks ago. It IS a fact that you can find starting OL in the 2nd and 3rd round, the vast majority of starting OL were in fact drafted after the first round.

Why don't you get this?

 

[redskinsfan]

So again I will ask you, what makes a guy worthy of the 8th pick, but a complete waste of space at #5?? Aside from the fact that a pass rusher at 5 is alot more sexy than fixing the right side of the line which we all (you included) have said is basically garbage??

So let me ask you honestly... what stands a better chance of fixing this team long term.. .taking an O-lineman a few slots higher than you think he is worth. Or taking another pass rusher and taking O-line talent a round or two later?? We know we will likely get a starter taking Scherff at #5. Where as we HOPE we dont get stuck drafting another Morgan Moses if we wait until the 2nd round or later.

Like I've said umpteen times, taking an o-linemen is our best play here. If we take Scherff, he'll unquestionably be an improvement, even if we put him at RT. My point's always been, however, about value. Scherff's value has been around #10 to #12. Jumping from that part of the draft to #5 would normally fetch a first rounder next year or a second rounder this year.

Let's put this in another perspective. Assume that our most pressing need this year is safety. We all know that the best safety is Landon Collins but also know that his value is around the mid-part of the first round. If we're stuck with our #5 pick, do we take him? No.

The issue with Scherff always has been his intrinsic value to us and his objective value to the NFL. As just noted, there's a considerable difference between the two. Does his intrinsic value really outweigh the objective value we're losing? That's the question.

My answer is no. But the solution here is to trade down. McCloughan has got to make it work.

 

[Sharkinva]

I posted the figures a few weeks ago. It IS a fact that you can find starting OL in the 2nd and 3rd round, the vast majority of starting OL were in fact drafted after the first round.

Why don't you get this?

How many of those were day one starters which is in fact what we need here. I wish we were in a situation where we HAD a capable O-line and could afford to draft a guy in the 3rd or later who could be a backup for two years and eventually a starter.

News flash bubba.... OUR STARTERS suck. So drafting backups for two years down the road might not be the best course of action.

 

[Sharkinva]

Like I've said umpteen times, taking an o-linemen is our best play here. If we take Scherff, he'll unquestionably be an improvement, even if we put him at RT. My point's always been, however, about value. Scherff's value has been around #10 to #12. Jumping from that part of the draft to #5 would normally fetch a first rounder next year or a second rounder this year.

Let's put this in another perspective. Assume that our most pressing need this year is safety. We all know that the best safety is Landon Collins but also know that his value is around the mid-part of the first round. If we're stuck with our #5 pick, do we take him? No.

The issue with Scherff always has been his intrinsic value to us and his objective value to the NFL. As just noted, there's a considerable difference between the two. Does his intrinsic value really outweigh the objective value we're losing? That's the question.

My answer is no. But the solution here is to trade down. McCloughan has got to make it work.

I have seen him mocked any where from 5-12 with the average pick recently being 8 or 9. And have you never heard the saying a bird in hand beats two in the bush?? A solid right tackle OR Right guard right now is worth more than a potential other player from the trade down or another pass rusher.

Say he is there at 5 which we expect, we trade down to 12 and the Giants take him at 9, yes I know we could simply draft Peat in this case... unless of course some one like the Rams takes him at 11. Some times you got to live by the Ricky Bobby moto... if you aint first your last. I would rather take the best OT/OG in the draft than fart around and end up with the 4th best guy because we got cute or greedy.

 

[Thumper]

And when we take another pass rusher, or WR or some other Skill position... you wont fault me for voicing the opinion that we took sexy over substance as we have been doing for years.

I just looked at consensus drafts. They show 2 pass rushers and a QB for Redskins pick 1.

1. Randy Gregory.
2. Dante Fowler, Jr.
3. Marcus Mariota

Just pass rushers are kind of key- unless you like Tony Romo to have more time to pick us apart.

 

[Sharkinva]

I just looked at consensus drafts. They show 2 pass rushers and a QB for Redskins pick 1.

1. Randy Gregory.
2. Dante Fowler, Jr.
3. Marcus Mariota

Just pass rushers are kind of key- unless you like Tony Romo to have more time to pick us apart.

Of course they do Thumper. Most of these mocks are a combination of team need and Who the socalled hot names. No one in the top five is in desperate need of a LT thus no O-lineman are mocked in the top five. And conventional thinking would never mock a RT as a top five pick.

And let me ask you.. if we are getting to the QB and yet our offense STILL cant score points because our QB is always on his butt, exactly how does that benefit the team aside from us learning a cool new sack dance?? Just wondering.

 

[Thumper]

Because I do not accept the false premise, imo, that only an OL pick at 5 saves the OL.

Who is the most reliable QB on the roster, Colt McCoy? I think they take MM at 5 if so lucky, and don't reach for some OL. Nor rely on the kindness of enemies to make swell trades to help us.

 

[Sharkinva]

Also got to ask Thumper.. .does it matter that Romo was able to pick us apart because Dallas FINALLY invested heavily in their o-line.

Did you realize Romo had his best year EVER last year behind that line, despite throwing 100 less passes. His YPC was up almost 1.5 yards per attempt, he set a career number in completion percentage. And their team sack numbers given up have consistently gone down over the past few years since they got younger and more talented on the line.

 

[Sharkinva]

Because I do not accept the false premise, imo, that only an OL pick at 5 saves the OL.

Who is the most reliable QB on the roster, Colt McCoy? I think they take MM at 5 if so lucky, and don't reach for some OL. Nor rely on the kindness of enemies to make swell trades to help us.

Dude.. if we do take Mariota at five and go into the season with Compton and Chester, he will be broken by week eight. Taking yet another rookie QB with this line is doing the same old things with new faces.

 

[Thumper]

A #5 pick should be a Very Special player. Not just, well, that year we were short at a certain position so we got a serviceable journeyman type guy who played guard for a few seasons.

Also, I hate it when people act like all OLs are 100 reliable- they bust 50-50 like any other position or always get hurt. And I don't think they need the 40 speed that everybody makes such a big deal about. Can they block? That interests me more than their hand size or arm length or 40 speed.

 

[Sharkinva]

A #5 pick should be a Very Special player. Not just, well, that year we were short at a certain position so we got a serviceable journeyman type guy who played guard for a few seasons.

Also, I hate it when people act like all OLs are 100 reliable- they bust 50-50 like any other position or always get hurt. And I don't think they need the 40 speed that everybody makes such a big deal about. Can they block? That interests me more than their hand size or arm length or 40 speed.

So basically you are in the we got to get an impact player at #5 instead of getting a player that will have the most impact for this team. A lot of that going around.