Guys Im starting to get the feeling....

[j_y19]

Fair point. As you noted, while it shouldn't have to wait until the offseason, most FO personnel are under contract for the season thus not available until off season. Practically speaking, this is when these moves happen.
BTW, I'm neither an Allen hater or supporter. I'm just tired of seeing constant upheaval. We have got to, at some point, give these guys a chance to do their job. Its going to take more than 1 or 2 years to change this franchise. The same holds true for Gruden. He may not be the right guy, but he deserves the chance to at least implement his plan.

 

[skinsdad62]

Free agent signings weren't just "weren't great" they were horrible. This was a huge off season for Allen, he needed to hit a home run. Everyone knew OL and the secondary was crucial need areas and he did nothing to help there despite having cap space.

DJax fell into his lap, I give him no credit here. All they had to do was put in a decent offer as he wanted to play in the NFC East and Dallas and the Giants were set at WR.

Now let's examine the players they decided to sign, the guys they spent months studying and decided that they would be good additions to help improve the team:

Lauvao: The day after he signed I heard from Browns fans who said he was their worst offensive lineman and were stunned that the Redskins were interested let alone interested at that number. You know it's bad when a Browns fan is laughing at you. He sucks.

Grade: D- based on his cap hit along with his play

Hatcher: This was going to be the guy to give us the much needed inside pass rush. After a good first few games he has been in the Witness Protection Plan and is another in the long list of big name busts along the D line.

Grade: D+ (the + only because of the first few games) but it could be lower given expectations and cap space spent.

Ryan Clark: I get it, he was cheap, available and a stop gap. But good God we could have gotten this kind of play out of Madeiu Williams.

Grade: D-

Andre Roberts: Pre-seaon was fool's gold. He has had a ton of drops and totally ineffective as a punt returner although his play has finally improved at the WR spot.

Grade: C-

Tracy Porter: Um Tracy Porter has no grade point average.

Grade: zero point zero

Special Teams FAs such as Haywood, Sharpton, Akeem Jordan etc: Special teams once again were an embarrassment until the halfway point in the season. They have improved all the way up to average. Not nearly good enough

Grade: D+

Tress Way: Well what do you know, we finally found a punter. Would be nice if he ever learned how to down the ball inside the 20 but hey, he's the best we've had for a long time.

Grade: B


Clifton Geathers. Meh, he's a guy. No need to grade signings like this one.

Let's not forget the disastrous decision to franchise Rak, money that could have been used on other needs.

saying that DJAX dropped into his lap is pure BS he kept him at redskins park until he signed him

lavou was a bad move

hatcher has 5 sacks from the interior line position . he is a bit of an over pay but he rates higher then the grade you gave him
roberts i dont have a beef with his production . our return game was atrocious and he at least stablized it and 30 catches with the train wreck at qb isnt so bad probably a C

ryan clark was a cheap stop gap signing and a gamble . he didnt cost much so i dont bitch about that too much
way is a possible pro bowl punter

kearse has 3 sacks which you forgot in a back up role at least a c plus there

porter was an f

our special teams improved the teams from awful to average that certainly rates a good grade

i dont believe allen is some kind of savior at GM but he should get 3 years

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

saying that DJAX dropped into his lap is pure BS he kept him at redskins park until he signed him

lavou was a bad move

hatcher has 5 sacks from the interior line position . he is a bit of an over pay but he rates higher then the grade you gave him
roberts i dont have a beef with his production . our return game was atrocious and he at least stablized it and 30 catches with the train wreck at qb isnt so bad probably a C

ryan clark was a cheap stop gap signing and a gamble . he didnt cost much so i dont bitch about that too much
way is a possible pro bowl punter

kearse has 3 sacks which you forgot in a back up role at least a c plus there

porter was an f

our special teams improved the teams from awful to average that certainly rates a good grade

i dont believe allen is some kind of savior at GM but he should get 3 years

The point is Allen lucked out in even having Jackson on the market. The fact that he was available and wanted to play in the NFC meant all he had to do was signing him to a contract. I am evaluating his evaluating skills, that's what we are discussing here, not his ability to sign guys who fell from the heavens right into his lap.

Hatcher: Again his production was all early, he has made one impact play in a month. Again given the price and expectations he has turned into a big disappointment and a bad signing

Roberts also never came close to matching expectation either. He is an improvement over ARE but just barely. Too many fair catches with room to run, too many dropped passes, barely any big plays

Ryan Clark has been nothing short of horrible. I don't care how cheap he was, it was Allen's job to shore up the secondary and this is what he came up with.

Special Teams are better this year, but we sure weren't saying that in October. So it's a marginal improvement

Forgot about Kearse, good call

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

And haven't you previously preached patience with others?

My point was he should have never been put in this situation in the first place and is just another boneheaded move by Mr. Snyder. His draft record in both Tampa and Oakland is horrible, why would we expect that to change here?

 

[j_y19]

My point was he should have never been put in this situation in the first place and is just another boneheaded move by Mr. Snyder. His draft record in both Tampa and Oakland is horrible, why would we expect that to change here?

The only answer i can offer is we don't know who was really responsible for drafting in Tampa. or what the situation was there. And in Oakland, it was Al Davis, make no mistake about that. He called all the shots On what happened with his team.

So Allen is here, maybe he shouldn't be, but he is. He is responsible. Let's see what he can do.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

The only answer i can offer is we don't know who was really responsible for drafting in Tampa. or what the situation was there. And in Oakland, it was Al Davis, make no mistake about that. He called all the shots On what happened with his team.

So Allen is here, maybe he shouldn't be, but he is. He is responsible. Let's see what he can do.

I know you are not defending Allen but he was in charge of the draft in Tampa. So we have one bad grade and one incomplete, that is hardly a resume that would lead to a promotion that put him in charge of the draft here. But that's what Daniel Snyder does, the complete opposite of what he should do.

Here is a good rundown of his Tampa drafts. Obviously the Talib review needs updating, he was a very good pick, but Cadilac Williams need to be downgraded:

2004
1st Rnd(15th overall) WR Michael Clayton - BUST 1 Good season then sludge
3rd Rnd - Marquise Cooper LB - BUST
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 6 / # of NFL Starters: 0
2005
1st Rnd(5th Overall) RB Cadillac Williams - OK , Good player but was hurt all the time and was hurt often at Auburn - he should have seen that coming
2nd Rnd MLB Barrett Rudd - Average NFL Starter
3rd Rnd : TE Alex Smith - Marginal NFL Player
3rd Rnd : OT Chris Colmer - BUST
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 8 / # of NFL Starters: 0
2006
1st Rnd (23) OG Davin Joseph - Pro Bowler (his best pick of all time)
2nd Rnd OT Jeremy Trueblood - Slightly below average NFL Starter
3rd Rnd WR Maurice Stovall - BUST
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 7/ # of NFL Starters 0 {Bruce Gradkowski is a decent backup - rnd 6}
2007
1st Rnd (4) DE Gaines Adams - RIP, not dominant in his time here (And worse we had the chance to trade up to #2 for Calvin Johnson, but he was unwilling to part with the first of his 2nd round picks that year who was)
2nd Rnd OG Aaron Search - BUST (Good player but out of football for mental reasons well known coming into the draft)
2nd Rnd S Sabby Piscatelli - BUST
3rd Rnd LB Quick Black - Below Average LB
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 6 / # of NFL Starters : 1 FS Tannard Jackson(4th Rnd)
2008 [Thankfully his last after destroying what McKay built]
1st Rnd (15) Aqib Talib - Bust in the making (Character issues well know but we took him anyway and he's liable to be suspended even if he doesnt go to the pen)
2nd Rnd WR Dexter Jackson - Never Played an NFL down, cut in training camp
3rd Rnd OG Jeremy Zuttah - Good pick
# of Picks after Rnd 3: 4 / # of NFL Starters : 0 [Geno Hayes and Josh Johnson are decent backups]

Pretty Pathetic Record by Bruce Allen:
5 First Round Picks - 1 Pro Bowler , No Pro Bowlers in any other round
5 2nd Round Picks - 2 Starters, Barrett Rudd and Jeremy Trueblood, both are ho-hum
6 3rd Round Picks - 1 Good Player- Jeremy Zuttah
31 Picks after Rnd 3: 1 Starter




Bruce Allen - Worst GM In Football? - Bucs Nation

 

[j_y19]

I know you are not defending Allen but he was in charge of the draft in Tampa. So we have one bad grade and one incomplete, that is hardly a resume that would lead to a promotion that put him in charge of the draft here. But that's what Daniel Snyder does, the complete opposite of what he should do.

Here is a good rundown of his Tampa drafts. Obviously the Talib review needs updating, he was a very good pick, but Cadilac Williams need to be downgraded:

2004
1st Rnd(15th overall) WR Michael Clayton - BUST 1 Good season then sludge
3rd Rnd - Marquise Cooper LB - BUST
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 6 / # of NFL Starters: 0
2005
1st Rnd(5th Overall) RB Cadillac Williams - OK , Good player but was hurt all the time and was hurt often at Auburn - he should have seen that coming
2nd Rnd MLB Barrett Rudd - Average NFL Starter
3rd Rnd : TE Alex Smith - Marginal NFL Player
3rd Rnd : OT Chris Colmer - BUST
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 8 / # of NFL Starters: 0
2006
1st Rnd (23) OG Davin Joseph - Pro Bowler (his best pick of all time)
2nd Rnd OT Jeremy Trueblood - Slightly below average NFL Starter
3rd Rnd WR Maurice Stovall - BUST
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 7/ # of NFL Starters 0 {Bruce Gradkowski is a decent backup - rnd 6}
2007
1st Rnd (4) DE Gaines Adams - RIP, not dominant in his time here (And worse we had the chance to trade up to #2 for Calvin Johnson, but he was unwilling to part with the first of his 2nd round picks that year who was)
2nd Rnd OG Aaron Search - BUST (Good player but out of football for mental reasons well known coming into the draft)
2nd Rnd S Sabby Piscatelli - BUST
3rd Rnd LB Quick Black - Below Average LB
# of Pics after Rnd 3: 6 / # of NFL Starters : 1 FS Tannard Jackson(4th Rnd)
2008 [Thankfully his last after destroying what McKay built]
1st Rnd (15) Aqib Talib - Bust in the making (Character issues well know but we took him anyway and he's liable to be suspended even if he doesnt go to the pen)
2nd Rnd WR Dexter Jackson - Never Played an NFL down, cut in training camp
3rd Rnd OG Jeremy Zuttah - Good pick
# of Picks after Rnd 3: 4 / # of NFL Starters : 0 [Geno Hayes and Josh Johnson are decent backups]

Pretty Pathetic Record by Bruce Allen:
5 First Round Picks - 1 Pro Bowler , No Pro Bowlers in any other round
5 2nd Round Picks - 2 Starters, Barrett Rudd and Jeremy Trueblood, both are ho-hum
6 3rd Round Picks - 1 Good Player- Jeremy Zuttah
31 Picks after Rnd 3: 1 Starter




Bruce Allen - Worst GM In Football? - Bucs Nation

You're right, I'm not defending the poor drafts in Tampa or Oakland. I guess my real point is he is here. We have no one else and, honestly, probably couldn't land anyone that has a better record. His draft this year was not poor, but I would say average to maybe slightly above but we need a few years to really let it play out. Lets give him another year (because we really do not have a choice) and see if he has learned anything from his prior mistakes. We will know a lot more soon after the season ends if he makes any significant changes in the scouting dept. If he doesn't then there is no reason to expect any change in the results.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

I have heard people say that nobody good will come here but when has Snyder not gotten his man? As for this draft way too early to tell. Breeland and Murphy appear to be players but hard to imagine them being more than solid starters. Moses and Long are going through the process. As I've been saying why can't we get any updates on Long's progress? We had heard for years how the coaches really liked Kennan Robinson and we finally saw why. We are not hearing any such reviews about Long and the fact that he can't push the starters, who we all know totally suck, is a bit concerning. But again too early to tell.

 

[j_y19]

I disagree with the comment that Dan always gets his man. Do you really think that Zorn or even Gruden (maybe he was Allen's first choice, but I seriously don't think Dan's) was his first choice? And after the Shanahan debacle, no HC worth his salt is coming here. And why could we not ever get experienced, proven FO personnel to come here?

 

[skinsdad62]

i also forgot colt mccoy was picked up as well he certainly was key in 2 of 3 wins