Detroit Tigers Ongoing 2013 Thread

[Cleaves2000]

Thats why they got out from under Prince's contract it was a King's ransom for a guy that does not look to produce to equal that contract he had. i get you liked Prince but it's the same argument and the Tigers have not yet paid Miggy or Scherzer a huge extended deal. That is just our conjecture at this point.

Jalopy I get what your saying but it relies on a lot of things coming together in Detroit's favor…


Smily pitches as well as a starter as he did as a reliever.

Krol is the lefty stopper that Smyly was.

Castellanos is as good as advertised, Cleaves was tight about Tiger prospects it such an Iffy proposition. I get bonus points for using Iffy in a clever trolling way!

Kinsler can be a decent hitter in Tiger Stadium were he has had issues.

Scherzer, Sanchez, and Verlander all produce.

A lot of what ifs going on.

I do like your idea of Cespedes and the Tanaka in the long run the contracts are probably a wash but Dave D gets blood flow from power pitchers and from what I have read Tanaka is not.

It's early and Dave D may have work left to do so it is still up in the air.

Great post.....i liked fielder but by trading him i would like them to still get back pieces.....maybe if fister didnt get traded for peanuts i wouldnt feel this way....the fister trade for prospects is something a team like the cubs or astros do, not a team who has played in 3 straight ALCS.

But i agree with everything you say....tigers went from a favorite to having alot of what ifs......and people complain about contracts given to older players or big players like fielder....but is it really going to be smart to throw miggy 25-30 million for the latter years of his career? I love miggy, but everyones crying about money to pay him.....what if in 2-3 yrs he regresses big time? Or what if max goes back to bad max? Like you said....alot of what ifs



And i am a huge DD backer......just not liking this year so far....

 

[Cleaves2000]

Neither is going to happen. Rondon is going to be the setup man with Krol a situational lefty. Undoubtedly, DD will get some more arms for the BP but it won't be a sexy name. Choo is just getting too expensive.

So you feel comfortable with rondon as a set up man the year after we counted on him to be the closer and he failed miserably? Would of rather let him have one more year of being the 7th inning guy....and kroll? His numbers arent too great....hes young....thats what he has going for him.....just dont see a WS contender having kroll and rondon as the major pieces in the pen.

As for too expensive? We got rid of fielder, fister.....didnt resign omar or peralta....can give don kelly a million....and our only signing is nathan? Wheres all this money going? Too the future for max and miggy? Sorry, i wanna win now before the window closes. Id rather had won the WS next year and not been able to sign miggy in the future

 

[Cleaves2000]

Jalopy I get what your saying but it relies on a lot of things coming together in Detroit's favor…


Smily pitches as well as a starter as he did as a reliever. Why wouldn't he?

Krol is the lefty stopper that Smyly was. Krol isn't likely to be used in long relief. More likely is he will be a situational guy. 1 or 2 batters.

Castellanos is as good as advertised, Cleaves was tight about Tiger prospects it such an Iffy proposition. I get bonus points for using Iffy in a clever trolling way! Understood but you downgrade him because of other players. He is a legit MLB hitter. Struggling for him this year will be .260 w/ 20 HR's.

Kinsler can be a decent hitter in Tiger Stadium were he has had issues. His power numbers are going to dip but his BA should be higher.

Scherzer, Sanchez, and Verlander all produce. I think you mean stay healthy. If so they win a minimum of 50 games

A lot of what ifs going on.

I do like your idea of Cespedes and the Tanaka in the long run the contracts are probably a wash but Dave D gets blood flow from power pitchers and from what I have read Tanaka is not. Agreed

It's early and Dave D may have work left to do so it is still up in the air. Agreed

If castellanos hits 20 HR's id do back flips.....no way he hits 20 HR's next year....13 maybe....what makes him a legit MLB hitter? He didnt look too great when he got AB's. Sorry i have no faith in "prospects"

If kroll faces 1 or 2 batters....we gave up a starter in fister for a guy to face one guy a game? If thats true, expect to see alot of phil coke and AL AL next year

Kinslers numbers havent been great for awhile....i heard he upper cut swings alot and pops up...according to the ranger fans....cant see his avg raising in detroit....texas is a hitters park.

 

[Ronnie]

I did some quick calculations for those of you unhappy with Detroit's lineup. Considering yearly salaries for 2014 and Arbitration numbers taken from MLBTradeRumors.

If Detroit had kept Fielder, and Fister, resigned Infante, signed Choo and Nathan as FA, and added two or three decent relief pitchers.....the team salary would exceed $200mil.

The lineup I used:

Choo LF
Hunter RF
Miggy 3B
Fielder 1B
VMart DH
Jackson CF
Avila C
Infante 2B
Iglesius SS

Starting pitchers: Verlander, Scherzer, Sanchez, Fister, Porcello
Bullpen: Nathan, Smyly, Rondon, AlAl, (added three relief pitchers whose salary totaled $10mil)
Bench: Dirks, Kelly, Pena, Utility Infielder (as base salary)

 

[Cleaves2000]

I did some quick calculations for those of you unhappy with Detroit's lineup. Considering yearly salaries for 2014 and Arbitration numbers taken from MLBTradeRumors.

If Detroit had kept Fielder, and Fister, resigned Infante, signed Choo and Nathan as FA, and added two or three decent relief pitchers.....the team salary would exceed $200mil.

The lineup I used:

Choo LF
Hunter RF
Miggy 3B
Fielder 1B
VMart DH
Jackson CF
Avila C
Infante 2B
Iglesius SS

Starting pitchers: Verlander, Scherzer, Sanchez, Fister, Porcello
Bullpen: Nathan, Smyly, Rondon, AlAl, (added three relief pitchers whose salary totaled $10mil)
Bench: Dirks, Kelly, Pena, Utility Infielder (as base salary)

Yeah but nobody said sign choo if they kept fielder....they traded fielder....traded fister....let omar and peralta walk.....most likely benoit is gone too....now they should sign choo.....also pena is no longer with detroit...so he couldnt be on the bench.


As much as you talk tigers payroll iffy, you should put your resume in and try and become mr ilitchs accountant. Seems you worry about his money more than he does.

 

[Ronnie]

Yeah but nobody said sign choo if they kept fielder....they traded fielder....traded fister....let omar and peralta walk.....most likely benoit is gone too....now they should sign choo.....also pena is no longer with detroit...so he couldnt be on the bench.


As much as you talk tigers payroll iffy, you should put your resume in and try and become mr ilitchs accountant. Seems you worry about his money more than he does.

These are the arbitration salaries Detroit faces......

• Max Scherzer - $13.6MM
• Rick Porcello - $7.7MM
• Doug Fister - $6.9MM
• Austin Jackson - $5.3MM
• Alex Avila - $3.7MM
• Phil Coke - $2.1MM
• Andy Dirks - $1.7MM
• Don Kelly - $900K
• Al Alburquerque - $700

If you want to play GM....you should do it correctly. DD has to worry about the 'bottom line' and make sure that the Tigers are a viable product in the coming years. I think Detroit over extended themselves the last couple of years....now they are in the process of correcting that while still keeping an above average team on the field. Tigers are looking at a team salary of over $150mil for 2014. Without signing another player - that will probably be in the top 5 in MLB. Not bad for a mid to small market team in a city with major money problems.

 

[Cleaves2000]

These are the arbitration salaries Detroit faces......

• Max Scherzer - $13.6MM
• Rick Porcello - $7.7MM
• Doug Fister - $6.9MM
• Austin Jackson - $5.3MM
• Alex Avila - $3.7MM
• Phil Coke - $2.1MM
• Andy Dirks - $1.7MM
• Don Kelly - $900K
• Al Alburquerque - $700

If you want to play GM....you should do it correctly. DD has to worry about the 'bottom line' and make sure that the Tigers are a viable product in the coming years. I think Detroit over extended themselves the last couple of years....now they are in the process of correcting that while still keeping an above average team on the field. Tigers are looking at a team salary of over $150mil for 2014. Without signing another player - that will probably be in the top 5 in MLB. Not bad for a mid to small market team in a city with major money problems.

What does it matter that the city is having issues....they drew 3 million fans last year....you start tearing the team apart and start losing.....then fans wont come...

Coke, dirks, kelly, al al and even avila are all replaceable....and at cheaper options....coke 2.1 million is a rip off....and they wont face arb for fister.....hes gone.....

Im still not seeing the money issues......we cleared fielder somewhat, fister, peralta, benoit, and infante off the books......and signed nathan......what am i missing? What if texas didnt make the trade? The tigers were prepared to spend this year....but now since they got rid of fielder and fister.....they should be lower than expected.....but hell you seem to know the tigers financial issues more than DD. im hoping DD was throwing up smoke screens saying dirks was gonna start....

 

[Cleaves2000]

These are the arbitration salaries Detroit faces......

• Max Scherzer - $13.6MM
• Rick Porcello - $7.7MM
• Doug Fister - $6.9MM
• Austin Jackson - $5.3MM
• Alex Avila - $3.7MM
• Phil Coke - $2.1MM
• Andy Dirks - $1.7MM
• Don Kelly - $900K
• Al Alburquerque - $700

If you want to play GM....you should do it correctly. DD has to worry about the 'bottom line' and make sure that the Tigers are a viable product in the coming years. I think Detroit over extended themselves the last couple of years....now they are in the process of correcting that while still keeping an above average team on the field. Tigers are looking at a team salary of over $150mil for 2014. Without signing another player - that will probably be in the top 5 in MLB. Not bad for a mid to small market team in a city with major money problems.

Thought don kelly signed for a million....

 

[Cleaves2000]

Not to mention next year hunter and vmart will be off the books.....

 

[Ronnie]

Not to mention next year hunter and vmart will be off the books.....

And next year they are one year closer to looking at $300 million contract for Cabrera. Plus Verlander's $28mil and (maybe) Scherzer's $20-25million salary.

As much as the casual fan wishes it were so, the Tigers are not playing fantasy baseball. If you want to have three or four $20+million a year players, you have to cut corners elsewhere. Detroit has not been able to fill holes with young position players from their own system - so we have to trade for guys like Krol and Lombardozi to fill spots.

 

[Ronnie]

Thought don kelly signed for a million....

The arbitration figures are projections of what those players will get in arbitration. (Provided by MLBTradeRumors.). Kelly signed for slightly more than projected.

Counting those and the salaries of guys under contract (Verlander, Cabrera, Sanchez, etc) CBSsports stated that Detroit's total salary for 2014 is around $150 million - right now. That is a little higher than last years, but the Tigers did have increased revenue through TV money. They could use most of that and stretch their team salary to $170mil. And that is the question! How close to that figure will the Tigers get? The next few weeks will tell, I guess. Does DD just go out and sign Choo or Beltran...or does he make another trade to create some financial space like he did in the Fister trade?

 

[burfboy]

Yea but how will this effect the price of Pizza?

 

[Ronnie]

cleaves...here is the 25 man roster you want. I may be off slightly, but I used the projected arbitration salaries and contracts owed. You may want to keep Jackson as leadoff batter and forget about Choo. That would keep your salary to an amount that Detroit does not have to pay ''taxes'' to MLB.



Choo $18mil
Hunter $14
Miggy $22
Fielder $25
VMart $13
Jackson $5.3
Avila $3.7
Infante $8
Iglesious $2.1


Verlander $20
Scherzer $13.7
Sanchez $15
Fister $6.9
Porcello $7.7
Smyly $0.5
Nathan $10
AlAl $0.7
Gregerson $5
A better lefty than Coke $3
Rondon $0.5
Some righty arm $1


Bench...you traded Dirks for Gregerson. So let's say Worth, Castellanos, a cheap catcher, and Kelly for around $3mil maybe less.



Your team costs you........$200.7 million

 

[jalopy]

Your team costs you........$200.7 million

Taking your assumptions into account, the Tigers current team (w/ Choo) would cost about $25MM less than your total. I think it is safe to say Choo isn't coming. Beltran is only slightly more likely. My guess is DD has about $10MM more to fill out the roster with a couple of BP arms and another OF.

 

[Ronnie]

Taking your assumptions into account, the Tigers current team (w/ Choo) would cost about $25MM less than your total. I think it is safe to say Choo isn't coming. Beltran is only slightly more likely. My guess is DD has about $10MM more to fill out the roster with a couple of BP arms and another OF.

Remember....I was trying to create the team that cleaves seems interested in having. But true....I have my doubts that Detroit even reaches $160mil in salary....unless they make another cost cutting trade before hand. If you are looking at a current total of over $150mil in salaries (including arbitration 'guesses'), then about another $10mil, to be spent, seems about right. I have no problem with that total. Kudos to Illitch for putting the Tiger's salary total right up there with NY, LA's and Phillies (and Seattle's????)

 

[jalopy]

Remember....I was trying to create the team that cleaves seems interested in having. But true....I have my doubts that Detroit even reaches $160mil in salary....unless they make another cost cutting trade before hand. If you are looking at a current total of over $150mil in salaries (including arbitration 'guesses'), then about another $10mil, to be spent, seems about right. I have no problem with that total. Kudos to Illitch for putting the Tiger's salary total right up there with NY, LA's and Phillies (and Seattle's????)

I think in retrospect, the Tigers would like to take back the decision to sign Sanchez. It may turn out that his signing causes Max to go elsewhere. If Max continues to improve, it will be a horrible decision.

The Tigers have a two-year window to win the WS. After that, they are likely looking at a rebuilding.

 

[jdwills126]

Detroit will need to trade for a LF if they want to do it on the cheap. Unless they look at retreads like Kubal, Sizmore, or Davis. Choo will want more years than the Tigers are willing to go IMO. I thought Grandy a possibility due to a 3 or 4 year deal range.

 

[burfboy]

there is way more than a 2 year window for this team.....Dirks is not a piece of crap.....what the fuck is up with the Mariners?

 

[MI Nightmare]

there is way more than a 2 year window for this team.....Dirks is not a piece of crap.....what the fuck is up with the Mariners?

That's really not like the Seattle, recently. If I recall correctly (though I could be mistaken) they did match Griffey's offer, but he wanted the Cincy deal --- not so sure about A-Rod. I think that monster Texas $$$ was more than even the Yankees were willing to pay, at the time.

Maybe they'll be willing to hand over another pitcher or prospect in the near future...

 

[Cleaves2000]

cleaves...here is the 25 man roster you want. I may be off slightly, but I used the projected arbitration salaries and contracts owed. You may want to keep Jackson as leadoff batter and forget about Choo. That would keep your salary to an amount that Detroit does not have to pay ''taxes'' to MLB.



Choo $18mil
Hunter $14
Miggy $22
Fielder $25
VMart $13
Jackson $5.3
Avila $3.7
Infante $8
Iglesious $2.1


Verlander $20
Scherzer $13.7
Sanchez $15
Fister $6.9
Porcello $7.7
Smyly $0.5
Nathan $10
AlAl $0.7
Gregerson $5
A better lefty than Coke $3
Rondon $0.5
Some righty arm $1


Bench...you traded Dirks for Gregerson. So let's say Worth, Castellanos, a cheap catcher, and Kelly for around $3mil maybe less.



Your team costs you........$200.7 million

Ok but maybe you havent noticed. Ive only said it many times....i dont want both fielder and choo.....if the tigers kept fielder, i would of been fine with hernan perez at 2B. And nicky c in LF......im only wanting choo because we lost fielders bat.......who replaces fielders bat, not to mention also replacing infante and peralta.....we got kinsler.....if the tigers hadnt made the fielder trade, i would of been fine with keeping the team...,,,trade fister as they did......then get BP help.....