Deadline Trades

[Illinest]

Yeah that's what I'm thinking too. Screw the trade market if those are the sorts of prices that are being asked.

I think you might be right when you say that a major target might be a better target Ramburgh. Just because the middle of the road players are fetching more doesn't mean that a guy like Cliff Lee is also more expensive. You've got to figure that there's a max value for a major trade piece like Lee and that it doesn't change too significantly from year to year.

Actually Lee makes sense on a few levels. I saw one proposal that had us sending Hanson, Heredia and Herrera. That seems light on our end (imho)

 

[thecrow124]

Ervin Santana is on the market, I would immediately target him in a trade, but that is just me.

 

[thedddd]

Schierholtz, Rios Top Pirates' Wish List: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

I honestly see both as doing no more for the club than Ludwick and Lee did.

Santana is not a bad option for a SP but the mention of Cliff Lee the issue there is how much would the Phillies be willing to take on of his contract for the next 3 years? Peavy on the other hand only has 2 years for 10 million less per year.

With the Lee/Peavy comparison, both have put up consistently good number. Pro for Lee is he has been healthy, Con the contract. Peavy pro is the contract and con prior to last year '09, '10 and '11 he wasn't healthy.


Then with Santana he probably would take the least amount to obtain, best contract but the con is what will you get the '13 or the '12 version?

 

[thedddd]

Side note about the Pitching. The Braves just got thrust into the equation of teams looking for SP. With Maholm on the 15 day DL and Hudson out for the year that just made this "sellers" market even tough for the NL teams in contention.

 

[ramburgh]

A couple of names that are starting to be mentioned as potential trade candidates - Jose Bautista and Adam LaRoche. LaRoche usually has big second halves...

 

[thedddd]

Multiple Teams Present For Brian Wilson's Audition: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

Granted the Giants are probably at the top of the list he would be worth the flier.

 

[pghkid]

I don't see the Buccos making the playoffs with the team they have presently. Either or both a first baseman and a right fielder are needed. Jones, Sanchez, and Snyder are bench players at best. How about seeing the Phillies for Chase Utley to play first base. He is proven and knows what it takes to win. It may just be a rental with a high asking price, but there is no guarantee that the team makes it back this far again next year. Just ask the Phillies about that.

 

[element1286]

I don't see the Buccos making the playoffs with the team they have presently. Either or both a first baseman and a right fielder are needed. Jones, Sanchez, and Snyder are bench players at best. How about seeing the Phillies for Chase Utley to play first base. He is proven and knows what it takes to win. It may just be a rental with a high asking price, but there is no guarantee that the team makes it back this far again next year. Just ask the Phillies about that.

Can you give a reason why you don't think they'll make it? I mean they have an 8 game lead on third place in the wild card. And any team below then also has problems.

Phils are declining cause they keep on getting older, and give out bad contracts, while depleting their farm system, it was completely foreseeable they were gonna suck this year.

 

[sychmd]

i live in philly and people were predicting the demise because of too much loyalty to the WS champ players and the lack of farm system due to some going for all the marbles trades they made.

pat gillick put together a great team of role players around a couple stars and they went all the way.
amaro keeps trading for fantasy type players and not building a full team.
there is no foundation for lasting productivity.

the pirates will never dramatically overspend for a player (phils did with howard, utley, rollins, halliday, and lee) and are thinking of doing it again with a 3 yr deal for utley at 45M.
upside, we dont get paralyzed with the bad contract
downside, we arent in the bidding for stars that will get that money from NY, Bosox, LA, LAA, cubbies, Tex, Atl.

hopefully our coaches can develop people at the lower levels so we can have a pipeline like a couple other teams have.

 

[Darkstone42]

Can you give a reason why you don't think they'll make it? I mean they have an 8 game lead on third place in the wild card. And any team below then also has problems.

Phils are declining cause they keep on getting older, and give out bad contracts, while depleting their farm system, it was completely foreseeable they were gonna suck this year.

Yeah, looking around the league, while I don't know if the Bucs are "that good," it really does look like everyone else is "that bad." Atlanta's the only team in the East with a winning record. The West has the Dodgers, but everyone else has only made the playoffs recently because the rest of the division was so bad it seems.

I don't know that we'll necessarily run away with it, but I think we'll make the playoffs by default. There just aren't that many teams better than us, and we have a nice cushion to boot.

 

[ramburgh]

Would like to sign Brian Wilson, trade for Adam LaRoche and trade for RF (Bautista, Rios, Stanton)

Marte, Walker, McCutchen, RF, Alvarez, LaRoche, Martin, Mercer
BN- Jones, G. Sanchez, T. Sanchez, Barmes, Tabata
SP- Liriano, Locke, Burnett, Morton, Cole/Rodriguez
BP- Grilli, Melancon, B. Wilson, J. Wilson, Watson, Black/Morris/Hughes, Mazzaro/Gomez

throw Snider in as part of a trade or release him. McKenry back to AAA.

With Glasnow emerging, Taillon might be a bit more easier to include in a trade if they do go for Stanton. Taillon, Hansen, Herredia for Stanton? Maybe include a AAA pitcher (Irwin, McPherson, etc).

If the Pirates really want to go all in then maybe Josh Bell and ? for Cliff Lee.

The TV money along with Rodriguez, Burnett, Barmes, Jones (potentially) coming off the books next year would allow the Pirates to pay for Lee, Stanton and LaRoche. Wilson would probably just be auditioning for a contract else where, but could help the Pirates for the rest of of 2013.

Next year's rotation could then be Lee, Liriano, Locke, Morton, Cole.

 

[Darkstone42]

Would like to sign Brian Wilson, trade for Adam LaRoche and trade for RF (Bautista, Rios, Stanton)

Marte, Walker, McCutchen, RF, Alvarez, LaRoche, Martin, Mercer
BN- Jones, G. Sanchez, T. Sanchez, Barmes, Tabata
SP- Liriano, Locke, Burnett, Morton, Cole/Rodriguez
BP- Grilli, Melancon, B. Wilson, J. Wilson, Watson, Black/Morris/Hughes, Mazzaro/Gomez

throw Snider in as part of a trade or release him. McKenry back to AAA.

With Glasnow emerging, Taillon might be a bit more easier to include in a trade if they do go for Stanton. Taillon, Hansen, Herredia for Stanton? Maybe include a AAA pitcher (Irwin, McPherson, etc).

If the Pirates really want to go all in then maybe Josh Bell and ? for Cliff Lee.

The TV money along with Rodriguez, Burnett, Barmes, Jones (potentially) coming off the books next year would allow the Pirates to pay for Lee, Stanton and LaRoche. Wilson would probably just be auditioning for a contract else where, but could help the Pirates for the rest of of 2013.

Next year's rotation could then be Lee, Liriano, Locke, Morton, Cole.

Those deals would gut the farm system. I would rather not gut the system.

We have some internal options for upgrades, we don't need to sacrifice so many resources to get that upgrade. Polanco could be up as soon as next year, and then our outfield is set. We could make a play in free agency next offseason for a first baseman if we want to.

 

[steelparrot]

I know I said this last year and it didnt work


But our schedule isnt real hard

6 vs the Marlins
7 vs the Padres
6 vs the Rockies
6 vs the Brewers
7 vs the Cubs

All but these next 3 against the Marlins are after the trade deadline too. Thats right at half our games left vs sellers(I know some havent sold yet...). Doesnt mean anything if we go into another 'slide', but even if we start playing a little worse, we can get the wildcard.

 

[thedddd]

Per reports Stanton is not leaving Miami.

Another report the Pirates aren't as high on Rios, once again very glad not think he is worth a top prospect or any major prospect due to the contract next year.

Then there is Justin Morneau if he could be had for peanuts might be worth a shot but once again I am worried will he just another Lee/Ludwick signing?

 

[pghkid]

EVeryone puts too much of depleting the farm system. You have to get a player or two to win right now. Prospects are just that and there is no guarantee that they will ever make it. The Pirates have been much luckier than most of the contenders this year in regards to injuries. With the exception of Grilli, they have not had any major dl stints. Go for it this year and worry about the future in the future.

 

[thecrow124]

EVeryone puts too much of depleting the farm system. You have to get a player or two to win right now. Prospects are just that and there is no guarantee that they will ever make it. The Pirates have been much luckier than most of the contenders this year in regards to injuries. With the exception of Grilli, they have not had any major dl stints. Go for it this year and worry about the future in the future.

Seriously? The Pirates have used 11 starting pitchers, they have also had injuries to Walker, Martin and Tabata and now Snider. The Pirates have been very un-lucky with injuries, and yet they are still winning. Why you might ask, because they have a strong deep minor league system. If we were to take Stanton and put him on our team, we still would not have a team that I would feel comfortable with in a long series.

I understand the win now mentality, you never know when you might be in this position again, but I would prefer to go the route of Tampa Bay and the Braves and just continue to do most of my team construction through our minor league system. It is the most consistent way to have positive results.

 

[Illinest]

I've been a huge proponent of trading for a fix for the lineup but that was until I saw the shape of the trade market. I don't think there is any trade worth making if we go by the value of the players that have been traded and the rumored asking prices for some other players that haven't moved yet.

I am not comfortable with the prices that are being asked and I have to admit that there's a certain appeal to the idea of waiting one more year to see who steps up.

For example:
Polanco, Dickerson, and now Hanson all in AA right now. Polanco and Hanson are very young but it's not unthinkable that one (or both) could contribute in late 2014.
Dickerson on the other hand has started the year in AA, is a more mature player with less going on defensively and he has been crushing the ball for the last 2 months. His July split is .417/.446/.708/1.154

I would be sad to see Tony Sanchez go when he's so close to filling a need on the big league club. Alex Dickerson might be the middle of the order hitter we've been discussing. Polanco has a good shot at being the rightfielder we need. The pitching staff is strong and probably going to get stronger if we leave the minors alone.


I know it's going to hurt our chances in 2013 but we've separated ourselves from Arizona so much in the wildcard race that I'd be willing to let it ride this time.

 

[tsmbaseball]

25 Predictions for the 2013 MLB Trade Deadline | Bleacher Report

I read this and didn't get the writers logic. Why would the Pirates deal their top 1B prospect for an aging RF? I would rather see Dickerson in Pittsburgh next year vs Rios.

Dickerson's been moved to the outfield this season. He's started every game in the outfield or at DH this season, so he's probably not going to be coming up at first.

That being said, if I could get Alex Rios in a deal centered around Dickerson, I'd probably move on that depending on how much salary the White Sox were absorbing.

 

[HammerDown]

You guys can get pissed off for me saying this if you want but if you don't make a move, you don't make the playoffs. And don't deny that the race is going to be that close because you know it will. The Cards just got swept and you're playing them for the next five games. Reward yourself by going after a major upgrade!!!

 

[evolver115]

You guys can get pissed off for me saying this if you want but if you don't make a move, you don't make the playoffs. And don't deny that the race is going to be that close because you know it will. The Cards just got swept and you're playing them for the next five games. Reward yourself by going after a major upgrade!!!

Not pissed off about your thoughts at all, HD. You can make the case that the opportunity to win is right now for the Pirates. However, if the asking prices remain as high as they've reportedly been, I have a hard time saying our GM should sell the farm for one or two upgrades. I say that because this is really the first time in a long time the Bucs have had this much high end talent on the farm. I am willing to wait another year or two for guys like Taillon and Polanco to mature and make the jump to the big club.

The other thing for me is this; is it worth making a blockbuster trade right now only to be eligible for a one game WC playoff? I say this because I have my doubts the Bucs overtake the Cards for the NLC.