Cousins for Nets Pick

[CitySushi]

I'm not used to disagreeing with @tlance . It's a weird day.

 

[Arizona_Sting]

Yeah, I tend to agree, although I think IT would stay if offered a max. Not sure he'd get too many max offers elsewhere.

Absolutely agree with IT, but you have to factor in if the Cavs even WANT to max him out if LeBron leaves, that comes with great risk as good as he is and with what direction they'd hypothetically be heading in. Cousins is the one I think would bolt in a hearbeat if LeBron left though. He's been talking about playing and reuniting with John Wall or Eric Bledsoe for a long, long time.

 

[Arizona_Sting]

BUT... all things considered if the Pelicans would accept it I say go for it. You'll NEVER have a chance to build a team that talented for a long time, an opportunity like that only comes once every 10-15 years for a team if they're lucky. Just pointing out there's a very good chance they are screwed and screwed BAD if it doesn't work out.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

I'm not used to disagreeing with @tlance . It's a weird day.

I haven't insulted anyone yet - it's even weirder for me!

 

[Arizona_Sting]

I haven't insulted anyone yet - it's even weirder for me!

Hey fuck you!

 

[gordontrue]

Absolutely agree with IT, but you have to factor in if the Cavs even WANT to max him out if LeBron leaves, that comes with great risk as good as he is and with what direction they'd hypothetically be heading in. Cousins is the one I think would bolt in a hearbeat if LeBron left though. He's been talking about playing and reuniting with John Wall or Eric Bledsoe for a long, long time.

Yeah, for sure.

If I'm the Cavs and I end up in that position (trade for Cousins, LeBron leaves in FA)... It all comes down to Cousins. If he's up for re-signing, I sign him and IT to max. With Love still under contract, that's still a top - if not THE top - team in the East.

If Cousins is out... I probably let IT go, trade Love for expiring deals and picks and start a true re-build. You could prob get another asset or two by doing a sign-and-trade for IT and/or Cousins too.

I honestly don't think its a worse scenario than if they have the BKN pick and no Cousins... especially compared to the upside of what they might be able to accomplish this season with Cousins.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

Hey fuck you!

 

[tlance]

See that I wasn't sure of. Thanks for clearing that up. Then it makes tons of sense


IT likely stays because he's going for the cash out as he's stated before. He's been vastly underpaid his entire career, plus he's also friends with Love which is a bonus. If the Cavs retain his bird rights, they're almost a lock to keep him barring a significantly lowball offer.

Cousins is a bit different, but you have to look at the teams out there that 1) are in a position to succeed and 2) can pay him. There aren't that many teams that fit that bill in the coming off-season. If both Cousins and IT got a taste of success, even without Lebron there, the East is still very weak. They're at worst a top 4 seed in the East with a core of Boogie, Love and IT.

So in summation, I think both would be highly inclined to stay because they could still be competitive in a really weak conference and both be paid at their highest max $. Where's the downside to that?

Big assumption though.

Does Cousins care about team success? Based on the way he plays, I am not sure. He might prefer a 1 year deal elsewhere in a spot where he can get paid later and dominate the stat sheet.

Lastly, IT, Cousins and Love would be a chemistry nightmare, IMO. That team would seriously underachieve without a LeBron there to keep em straight. They would be terrible defensively and maybe not all that great offensively. At least not enough to make up for the bad D against good teams.

 

[trojanfan12]

I'm not used to disagreeing with @tlance . It's a weird day.

Meh, no big deal. @tlance doesn't know anything about basketball anyway. I know this because Hurricane says so.

 

[CitySushi]

Big assumption though.

Does Cousins care about team success? Based on the way he plays, I am not sure. He might prefer a 1 year deal elsewhere in a spot where he can get paid later and dominate the stat sheet.

Lastly, IT, Cousins and Love would be a chemistry nightmare, IMO. That team would seriously underachieve without a LeBron there to keep em straight. They would be terrible defensively and maybe not all that great offensively. At least not enough to make up for the bad D against good teams.

I would also say it's a big assumption to say Cousins doesn't care about team success. Look at the teams he's had around him his entire career in Sacramento. Rudy Gay was probably the most talented teammates he's ever had. That and the mismanagement of the Kings organization and revolving door of coaches hasn't exactly put him in a great position to succeed.

Cousin's, imo, isn't actually a bad defender either. Yes Love and IT would be a problem, but you have give and take with any roster. From a fire power stand point, I think they all compliment each other. A double high set with Love and Cousins would be killer.

I do agree they'd need someone to keep them straight if Lebron left.

 

[tlance]

I would also say it's a big assumption to say Cousins doesn't care about team success. Look at the teams he's had around him his entire career in Sacramento. Rudy Gay was probably the most talented teammates he's ever had. That and the mismanagement of the Kings organization and revolving door of coaches hasn't exactly put him in a great position to succeed.

Cousin's, imo, isn't actually a bad defender either. Yes Love and IT would be a problem, but you have give and take with any roster. From a fire power stand point, I think they all compliment each other. A double high set with Love and Cousins would be killer.

I do agree they'd need someone to keep them straight if Lebron left.

I did not say he didn't care about team success. He might, but I have not seen any evidence up to now that he does. His sideline antics tend to divide a locker room and I have yet to see him sacrifice for the well being of the team. That does not mean he wouldn't in the right situation, I just haven't seen it yet.

 

[shopson67]

Bird rights go with a player when they are traded. They only go away if the player is renounced or waived or signs a new contract.

Player needs to have 3 consecutive seasons without being waived or changing teams as a free agent to have Bird rights available. If those terms are met, then those Bird rights do transfer with a trade.

 

[gordontrue]

Player needs to have 3 consecutive seasons without being waived or changing teams as a free agent to have Bird rights available. If those terms are met, then those Bird rights do transfer with a trade.

Right. Which applies to both Cousins and IT.

 

[shopson67]

Yeah, for sure.

If I'm the Cavs and I end up in that position (trade for Cousins, LeBron leaves in FA)... It all comes down to Cousins. If he's up for re-signing, I sign him and IT to max. With Love still under contract, that's still a top - if not THE top - team in the East.

If Cousins is out... I probably let IT go, trade Love for expiring deals and picks and start a true re-build. You could prob get another asset or two by doing a sign-and-trade for IT and/or Cousins too.

I honestly don't think its a worse scenario than if they have the BKN pick and no Cousins... especially compared to the upside of what they might be able to accomplish this season with Cousins.

I wouldn't offer the max to IT or Cousins. Giving it to both would guarantee the Cavs are locked in NBA purgatory; can't win it all, can't rebuild quickly though the draft and free agency.

 

[shopson67]

Right. Which applies to both Cousins and IT.

Agreed, just adding a little detail.

 

[gordontrue]

I wouldn't offer the max to IT or Cousins. Giving it to both would guarantee the Cavs are locked in NBA purgatory; can't win it all, can't rebuild quickly though the draft and free agency.

Yeah, it just depends on what else is going on. If LeBron leaves to the West and both Cousins and IT are willing to sign max deals... I'd do it. Those guys with Love would make the the Cavs the likely favorites to get to the Finals. And those guys are young with plenty of career left. If just one of them was willing though, then I think I'd let them both walk, trade Love for assets and rebuild.

 

[shopson67]

Yeah, it just depends on what else is going on. If LeBron leaves to the West and both Cousins and IT are willing to sign max deals... I'd do it. Those guys with Love would make the the Cavs the likely favorites to get to the Finals. And those guys are young with plenty of career left. If just one of them was willing though, then I think I'd let them both walk, trade Love for assets and rebuild.

I personally would not want to be locked into a team built on IT, Cousins, and Love. Actually seems like a nightmare to me. I think you have 3 pcs that cannot lead a team to a championship and no alpha (and no means to add one). Cousins had to be traded for pennies on the dollar to get rid of him just recently. Anyone that throws modern max money at him will be disappointed and ultimately fired IMO.

 

[gordontrue]

I personally would not want to be locked into a team built on IT, Cousins, and Love. Actually seems like a nightmare to me. I think you have 3 pcs that cannot lead a team to a championship and no alpha (and no means to add one). Cousins had to be traded for pennies on the dollar to get rid of him just recently. Anyone that throws modern max money at him will be disappointed and ultimately fired IMO.

Hard to argue any of that, but when you put it into context of what the East Conference would be (in this imaginary scenario where LeBron has gone to the west)... it changes things, imo.

 

[trojanfan12]

Hard to argue any of that, but when you put it into context of what the East Conference would be (in this imaginary scenario where LeBron has gone to the west)... it changes things, imo.

Changes things how? I doubt those 3, without Lebron, could get out of the East. Even if they could, it's still not close to beating any of the contenders in the West.

All it does is delay the rebuild until the contracts expire or guys start getting traded.

 

[gordontrue]

Changes things how? I doubt those 3, without Lebron, could get out of the East. Even if they could, it's still not close to beating any of the contenders in the West.

All it does is delay the rebuild until the contracts expire or guys start getting traded.

Yeah, I just disagree.

If LeBron leaves the East.... I'd put IT/Cousins/Love well above DeRozan/Lowry, Wall/Beal, and Hayward/Irving/Horford.

If you're getting to the Finals... I think you're crazy to rebuild just cause the best team in the other conference is an all-time great.