Commanders News thread

[duke1861]

No owner is hands off

Call me confused Dean, but didn't you and Brock want harris to intervene and hire EB at the end of the year without a GM?

 

[duke1861]

The debate that you guys are having is good content. I'm enjoying hearing both sides. This type of dynamic is very common. I've also wondered what will happen if the GM and coach disagree on QB @2. Gibbs and Bethard had this same issue toward the end.

Gibbs wanted Desmond Howard and Casserly wanted Troy Vincint. I think the guy who usually wins out is the guy that the owner would least like to lose. Gonna be interesting.

Bethard got his way until Gibbs started winning SBs. It's a very delicate dynamic that is fluid based on who the owner values more at the time.

I am going to always side with a GM because I support the traditional front office model.

Dean supports a more coach centric model that we had under Rivera...with some tweaks.

Is that not accurate Dean?
You want Ben Johnson, or the coach, to be the final authority when it comes to draft picks. In your example, Johnson would draft Drake maye.

 

[kbso83432]

Thanks, but the new owner is supposed to be hands off. So if the GM makes the final decision again his offensive HC on QB so be it.

It's a power dynamic, not a title dynamic. Harris has already shown he is willing to step in if need be.

Trust the process in Philly.
Trading Chase and Sweat.
Not allowing Ron to start Jacoby (We all know its true).

I would hope the GM and the coach could sit in a room and hash that out. We all want the GM to make the decision, but I would hope Peters for example, would ask Ben for example, what type of QB do you need for your offense.

The GM's job security after all could depend on the success of the coach and the team. Neither you or Duke are wrong imo. Just my 2 cents.

 

[deanpet21]

What is the role of the GM in your opinion.
What if a coach and GM are at odds with a draft selection? Who wins out?

Example
2nd round pick

GM likes player A
Coach likes player B

What happens?

Example 2

GM wants to go LB in round 3
Coach wants to go RB in round 3

What happens?

GM in those rounds. At #2 if you bring on an offensive HC for lot of money, that person should have alot of say

 

[deanpet21]

Call me confused Dean, but didn't you and Brock want harris to intervene and hire EB at the end of the year without a GM?

i dont remember saying that. I said if Howell did well this year EB should be considered for HC

 

[deanpet21]

I am going to always side with a GM because I support the traditional front office model.

Dean supports a more coach centric model that we had under Rivera...with some tweaks.

Is that not accurate Dean?
You want Ben Johnson, or the coach, to be the final authority when it comes to draft picks. In your example, Johnson would draft Drake maye.

alot of tweaks. I talking about #2 overall not the whole draft so its not coach centic. Just the #2 overall situation.

 

[deanpet21]

It's a power dynamic, not a title dynamic. Harris has already shown he is willing to step in if need be.

Trust the process in Philly.
Trading Chase and Sweat.
Not allowing Ron to start Jacoby (We all know its true).

I would hope the GM and the coach could sit in a room and hash that out. We all want the GM to make the decision, but I would hope Peters for example, would ask Ben for example, what type of QB do you need for your offense.

The GM's job security after all could depend on the success of the coach and the team. Neither you or Duke are wrong imo. Just my 2 cents.

EXACTLY!!! The GM would ask the HC what type of QB do you need to run your offense. Thats my whole point.

 

[Sportster 72]

I forget who I heard report this or if it is even true but the report war in order of importance this year the Harris group wants:
1. GM
2. 2nd round pick
3. HC

Bobby Beathard left Washington because he and Gibbs were not seeing eye to eye ..... Bobby wanted to get younger and Joe wanted the guys who played well for him

Casserly, Turner and Snyder:
The Daniel Snyder era in Washington began with warning signs

 

[duke1861]

EXACTLY!!! The GM would ask the HC what type of QB do you need to run your offense. Thats my whole point.

You are changing lanes now dean...thats fine.

You said Johnson picks maye. Post 4,250.

You said Johnson makes the pick.

 

[deanpet21]

You are changing lanes now dean...thats fine.

You said Johnson picks maye. Post 4,250.

You said Johnson makes the pick.

not changing lanes. Johnson and GM not one person should pick the QB whoever it is. IMO it would be Maye. you are saying its the GM's way or the highway on the QB choice

 

[duke1861]

i dont remember saying that. I said if Howell did well this year EB should be considered for HC

You did say that.
You and Brock lectured me on how harris will need to hire EB if another team wants him.
Brock said he didn't want a GM to make the call.

 

[kbso83432]

I am going to always side with a GM because I support the traditional front office model.

Dean supports a more coach centric model that we had under Rivera...with some tweaks.

Is that not accurate Dean?
You want Ben Johnson, or the coach, to be the final authority when it comes to draft picks. In your example, Johnson would draft Drake maye.

There are nuances to this. If the HC told the GM he wanted a FS or he needed a LG, I could see the GM blowing the coach off and rightly so.

However, when you are going to be a first year HC trying to install a new offense, I would hope the HC would have SOME kind of a voice in the room. The GM's and the HC's job security will be tied to each others to a certian extent, especially early.

 

[deanpet21]

There are nuances to this. If the HC told the GM he wanted a FS or he needed a LG, I could see the GM blowing the coach off and rightly so.

However, when you are going to be a first year HC trying to install a new offense, I would hope the HC would have SOME kind of a voice in the room. The GM's and the HC's job security will be tied to each others to a certian extent, especially early.

especially at #2 at QB

 

[kbso83432]

especially at #2 at QB

I see both of you guy's point of view. I'm done with the coach centric stuff too, but not asking your HC what type of QB best fits his offense is short-sighted imo.

 

[duke1861]

not changing lanes. Johnson should pick the QB whoever it is. IMO it would be Maye. you are saying its the GM's way or the highway on the QB choice

No...he shouldn't.
The coach should give counsel and that is it.
In a perfect world, the GM and coach are on the same page.

In your example, Johnson picks maye.
I trust peters and Cunningham over Johnson. Johnson has about 10 years in the league and 2 as an OC. Peters for example has 20 years in the league.

If Johnson and peters are at odds, i trust peters and I hope Johnson would as well.

What happens if Peters wants a wr or OT at #2? What about trading for fields?

Again, you are still shell shocked from the rivera regime and prefer the coach make these decisions.

 

[deanpet21]

I see both of you guy's point of view. I'm done with the coach centric stuff too, but not asking your HC what type of QB best fits his offense is short-sighted imo.

Right duke and skisndad want the GM to trump everything. Most cases yes. but at #2, no.

 

[duke1861]

I see both of you guy's point of view. I'm done with the coach centric stuff too, but not asking your HC what type of QB best fits his offense is short-sighted imo.

I agree and nobody said that.

I have said a handful of times that the GM should consult and ask input from the coach.
At the end of the day, it's the GMs call.

Dean gave 2 examples of what he wants. That is fine.

He mentioned the heath Shuler pick and then a new hypothetical about Johnson selecting maye.

I disagree with coaches making picks. Just my 2 cents.

 

[deanpet21]

No...he shouldn't.
The coach should give counsel and that is it.
In a perfect world, the GM and coach are on the same page.

In your example, Johnson picks maye.
I trust peters and Cunningham over Johnson. Johnson has about 10 years in the league and 2 as an OC. Peters for example has 20 years in the league.

If Johnson and peters are at odds, i trust peters and I hope Johnson would as well.

What happens if Peters wants a wr or OT at #2? What about trading for fields?

Again, you are still shell shocked from the rivera regime and prefer the coach make these decisions.

yes hopefully they are on the same page but if not, what happens? That would be discussed on draft strategy im saying if both GM and HC are one the same page of picking a QB at #2 overall.

 

[duke1861]

Right duke and skisndad want the GM to trump everything. Most cases yes. but at #2, no.

Yup..GM is the boss.

You got it.

That's how the nfl works dean...or the successful teams do.

We haven't had a traditional front office since snyder took over. I have missed that..perhaps you haven't.

I think you miss the rivera model honestly. You even wanted EB to make draft picks.

 

[deanpet21]

Yup..GM is the boss.

You got it.

That's how the nfl works dean...or the successful teams do.

We haven't had a traditional front office since snyder took over. I have missed that..perhaps you haven't.

I think you miss the rivera model honestly. You even wanted EB to make draft picks.

HC's have input of course you take it out of context. We will never know what happens when that pick is made. You are not isolating this situation. I want the guy who is calling the plays to have the players he wants to run his offense the way he wants. Not to roadblocks after jsut being hired.