Commanders News thread

[duke1861]

the point is the HC Turner made the pick b/c he was the o coordinator and HC. Casserly was a good GM and he still made the HC make the pick. You think that is crazy and the GM should trump the HC/O coordinator. I just proved to you that it already happened from a good GM in Casserly. The the HC is the one who is calling the plays that matters.

If you force a QB on Johnson a guy he doesn't want if it goes bad Johnson is going to say well this isnt the QB i wanted to run my offense. Then there is turmoil.

You are making the case against coaches making the pick.

Turner was wrong
Casserly was right

I believe casserly admitted Shuler was a mistake publically. Casserly was a good GM, but he made a bad decision there clearly.

You and I view front offices differently.

I want the GM, who is the talent evaluator and architect of the roster to be the final authority. The GM takes input from coaches and scouting, but makes the decision.

You like the coach centric model where the coach can make the final decision and the GM is simply a voice in a group. You even repeatedly said EB should sign free agents and make draft picks last year.

Yout method is a bunch of people looking at each other wondering who is in charge and then asking the coach what he wants.

Its your opinion, but it doesn't work and we have 4 years of data to back that up.

Name a successful team that operates like you want?

 

[deanpet21]

When the GM picks his coach , they will be on the same page as to whom they pick at Qb . Neither Maye or Daniel’s are simply drop back passers . Both Run a lot and often and it’s lazy scouting to say otherwise

i agree they have to be on the same page about picking a QB at #2. Im speculating about Maye at #2. Caserly and Norv were not. This is the same situation actaully. THE GM and HC have to be in agreement of the guy they want at #2. Duke is saying its the GM way or hte highway.

 

[deanpet21]

You are making the case against coaches making the pick.

Turner was wrong
Casserly was right

I believe casserly admitted Shuler was a mistake publically. Casserly was a good GM, but he made a bad decision there clearly.

You and I view front offices differently.

I want the GM, who is the talent evaluator and architect of the roster to be the final authority.

You like the coach centric model where the coach can make the final authority and the GM is simply a voice in a group. You even repeatedly said EB should sign free agents and make draft picks last year.

Its your opinion, but it doesn't work and we have 4 years of data to back that up.

im making the case that the HC should be on board with the QB pick at #2. Turner got his way b.c he was the new coach and play caller. You're saying if we hire Johnson and pay him big money, he cant have the QB he wants at #2 b/c the Gm thinks otherwise.

 

[duke1861]

i agree they have to be on the same page about picking a QB at #2. Im speculating about Maye at #2. Caserly and Norv were not. This is the same situation actaully

But that is not what you are saying.
You are saying that the coach is the final authority.

You said that with Johnson in your hypothetical

You said it with norv Turner.

Again, I think that is what you want. You want another coach centric model.

 

[skinsdad62]

im making the case that the HC should be on board with the QB pick at #2. Turner got his way b.c he was the new coach and play caller. You're saying if we hire Johnson and pay him big money, he cant have the QB he wants at #2 b/c the Gm thinks otherwise.

The GM should make the choice on whom is drafted and the HC better know his role and be on board with that

 

[deanpet21]

The GM should make the choice on whom is drafted and the HC better know his role and be on board with that

do you think this comes up at the 2nd interview? If the GM asks Johnson what QB you want at #2 and Johnson answers wrong, he doesn't get the job?

 

[duke1861]

im making the case that the HC should be on board with the QB pick at #2. Turner got his way b.c he was the new coach and play caller. You're saying if we hire Johnson and pay him big money, he cant have the QB he wants at #2 b/c the Gm thinks otherwise.

They should and must be on board.

But yes, I defer to the GM on who they want. It is his job to acquire talent, not the coach.
I trust peters or Cunningham more than i would Johnson.

Your own example proved that. I am surprised you played that card. Turner was wrong...really wrong...and casserly admitted he made a mistake.

If the coach and GM are at odds, the GM wins out every time.

 

[deanpet21]

But that is not what you are saying.
You are saying that the coach is the final authority.

You said that with Johnson in your hypothetical

You said it with norv Turner.

Again, I think that is what you want. You want another coach centric model.

no its not. this is a particular situation. Was it coach centric with Casserlya nd Norv?

 

[deanpet21]

They should and must be on board.

But yes, I defer to the GM on who they want. It is his job to acquire talent, not the coach.
I trust peters or Cunningham more than i would Johnson.

Your own example proved that. I am surprised you played that card. Turner was wrong...really wrong...and casserly admitted he made a mistake.

If the coach and GM are at odds, the GM wins out every time.

fine but isnt this discussed at the 2nd interview?

 

[duke1861]

no its not. this is a particular situation. Was it coach centric with Casserlya nd Norv?

Casserly was the GM and turner was the coach.
Casserly made a huge error, perfect his own words, by not sticking to his guy.

Do you want another coach centric model?

 

[skinsdad62]

do you think this comes up at the 2nd interview? If the GM asks Johnson what QB you want at #2 and Johnson answers wrong, he doesn't get the job?

I don’t think that question needs to be asked . The question should be the organization likes this qb and can you coach him

 

[duke1861]

fine but isnt this discussed at the 2nd interview?

With harris and the GM candidate?

I am sure general philosophy is discussed but I doubt it gets that granular as to what his precise draft plan and draft board look like.
Harris is hiring a GM for hopefully years to come, not just for 2024.

Harris will want to know about strategy and leadership style along with vision. I dount they go through draft scenerios at length. I am sure Cunningham and peters bring examples of what they think should happen, but I doubt that is the only thing discussed.

 

[deanpet21]

I don’t think that question needs to be asked . The question should be the organization likes this qb and can you coach him

i agree with that. So the HC has to be on board with that guy. IF the HC answers no. he doesn't get the job?

 

[redskinsfan1963]

When the GM picks his coach , they will be on the same page as to whom they pick eat Qb . Neither Maye or Daniel’s are simply drop back passers . Both Run a lot and often and it’s lazy scouting to say otherwise

they showed a lot of mayes games in my part of virginia,he started good,but look nothing better than average further into the season.i,d take daniels over him everytime,but i think howell would better with a decent oline.

 

[deanpet21]

With harris and the GM candidate?

I am sure general philosophy is discussed but I doubt it gets that granular as to what his precise draft plan and draft board look like.
Harris is hiring a GM for hopefully years to come, not just for 2024.

Harris will want to know about strategy and leadership style along with vision. I dount they go through draft scenerios at length. I am sure Cunningham and peters bring examples of what they think should happen, but I doubt that is the only thing discussed.

i meant Gm and HC interview.

 

[kbso83432]

The debate that you guys are having is good content. I'm enjoying hearing both sides. This type of dynamic is very common. I've also wondered what will happen if the GM and coach disagree on QB @2. Gibbs and Bethard had this same issue toward the end.

Gibbs wanted Desmond Howard and Casserly wanted Troy Vincint. I think the guy who usually wins out is the guy that the owner would least like to lose. Gonna be interesting.

Bethard got his way until Gibbs started winning SBs. It's a very delicate dynamic that is fluid based on who the owner values more at the time.

 

[deanpet21]

The debate that you guys are having is good content. I'm enjoying hearing both sides. This type of dynamic is very common. I've also wondered what will happen if the GM and coach disagree on QB @2. Gibbs and Bethard had this same issue toward the end.

Gibbs wanted Desmond Howard and Casserly wanted Troy Vincint. I think the guy who usually wins out is the guy that the owner would least like to lose. Gonna be interesting.

Bethard got his way until Gibbs started winning SBs. It's a very delicate dynamic that is fluid based on who the owner values more at the time.

Thanks, but the new owner is supposed to be hands off. So if the GM makes the final decision again his offensive HC on QB so be it.

 

[skinsdad62]

The debate that you guys are having is good content. I'm enjoying hearing both sides. This type of dynamic is very common. I've also wondered what will happen if the GM and coach disagree on QB @2. Gibbs and Bethard had this same issue toward the end.

Gibbs wanted Desmond Howard and Casserly wanted Troy Vincint. I think the guy who usually wins out is the guy that the owner would least like to lose. Gonna be interesting.

Bethard got his way until Gibbs started winning SBs. It's a very delicate dynamic that is fluid based on who the owner values more at the time.

We shouldn’t have traded up , should have kept both picks

 

[duke1861]

i meant Gm and HC interview.

What is the role of the GM in your opinion.
What if a coach and GM are at odds with a draft selection? Who wins out?

Example
2nd round pick

GM likes player A
Coach likes player B

What happens?

Example 2

GM wants to go LB in round 3
Coach wants to go RB in round 3

What happens?

 

[skinsdad62]

Thanks, but the new owner is supposed to be hands off. So if the GM makes the final decision again his offensive HC on QB so be it.

No owner is hands off