Coffee Talk V: The Final Battle

[buffhockey]

 

[dash]

My understanding is our in-demand industries (ie: tech) also pay shit compared to American companies and many of those jobs are in low-COL metros nowadays whereas most of Canada’s are in Toronto and Vancouver where single family homes go for upward of $2 mil CDN (of course a lot of major cities in countries on that list are similar cost-wise).

I don't know if it has recently changed and maybe it depends on the tech/industry, but my experience has been that tech pay in Canada is very competitive compared to pay in the US. In fact, when talking to recruiters based in the US, they were often surprised to hear what my compensation expectations were. My reply is I'm sure you'll be able to find somebody at that rate of pay, but they are probably a) desperate for a job or b) inexperienced and don't realize they could command a much higher rate of pay.

 

[mooger_35]

Let's go Darwin! LOL

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I don't know if it has recently changed and maybe it depends on the tech/industry, but my experience has been that tech pay in Canada is very competitive compared to pay in the US. In fact, when talking to recruiters based in the US, they were often surprised to hear what my compensation expectations were. My reply is I'm sure you'll be able to find somebody at that rate of pay, but they are probably a) desperate for a job or b) inexperienced and don't realize they could command a much higher rate of pay.

So I said my understanding because I'm basing it mostly on what I read in a Toronto reddit thread the other day in response to this NYT article where it says the gap is around $65k US average between Toronto and Silicon Valley. Anecdotal of course but a lot of comments mentioning things like positions in Buffalo or Detroit paying more base than positions in Toronto (and obviously being accommodated by astronomical living cost decreases).

Someone also posted this Globe article talking up that the gap is closing somewhat but as of 2021 Toronto still lagging basically every major tech market in average salary by a pretty large margin.

Again, a lot of it's anecdotal and it's never the same across the board, and a lot of the conversation did seem to revolve around FAANG employment so maybe that plays a part. Those articles talk about Toronto being a draw for tech but I think there's likely an equal number of newcomers hoping to use Canada's easier immigration system for that sector as a springboard into the US still.

 

[dash]

Again, a lot of it's anecdotal and it's never the same across the board, and a lot of the conversation did seem to revolve around FAANG employment so maybe that plays a part. Those articles talk about Toronto being a draw for tech but I think there's likely an equal number of newcomers hoping to use Canada's easier immigration system for that sector as a springboard into the US still.

I think the bolded above is definitely true, but I also think that a lot of people come to Canada and maybe their original goal is to use Canada as a springboard to the US and while we lose some of the immigrants to the States, I'm pretty sure some remain in Canada because it's a pretty good place to live and work.

 

[puckhead]

popcorn

 

[forty_three]

to this NYT article where it says the gap is around $65k US average between Toronto and Silicon Valley. Anecdotal of course but a lot of comments mentioning things like positions in Buffalo or Detroit paying more base than positions in Toronto (and obviously being accommodated by astronomical living cost decreases).

Comparing anything to Silicon Valley or someplace like NYC is always going to skew the numbers. I talked to one of the big three in Silicon Valley and could have easily doubled my salary if I was willing to move there, which I wasn't.

What's happening is companies with roots in places that are less sexy to live in (the Detroits, Buffalos and yes, Columbuses) that are smart are getting in front of the shift to remote work and paying better to get talent now that they don't have to try and talk people into living somewhere in particular. They can do more with tech because they don't have to rely on people living nearby having the highly specialized skill sets.

Unfortunately, especially where I am now, places are NOT getting in front of the soon to be massive problem of retaining talent.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Comparing anything to Silicon Valley or someplace like NYC is always going to skew the numbers. I talked to one of the big three in Silicon Valley and could have easily doubled my salary if I was willing to move there, which I wasn't.

Yeah but you kinda have to in this case considering Toronto’s cost of living issues are catching up to those locations pretty quickly (and in some regards are already worse - you can go an hour out from NYC and find a 2500 sq ft home in Jersey or LI for $700k, an hour out from Toronto is Hamilton or Oshawa and you’re looking at well over a million for anything remotely comparable). Cost of living in Vancouver is even closer to NY/SF.

And yeah, there are places in Canada with good tech jobs that are cheaper to live but attracting talent there is a problem - Shopify had to move their HQ from Ottawa to Toronto (it’s still technically in Ottawa but they downsized that location and their Toronto space is going to be huge) because the talent pool just wasn’t enough for their goals. KW has a lot of tech talent but as it is it’s not much of a draw.

And then there’s the taxes.

 

[dash]

Victoria is a pretty good tech hub as well, but the cost of housing while not quite as crazy as Vancouver is still out of reach for most people.

/It's why I live in the Cowichan Valley

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

So the Ruble’s basically back to where it was when the invasion happened. Are the sanctions just useless?

 

[thedddd]

So the Ruble’s basically back to where it was when the invasion happened. Are the sanctions just useless?

Per what I read a lot of that value is based on Russia stockpiling other currencies from residents. Essentially they made everyone who earned money outside of Russia to exchange it for Ruble's.

 

[thedddd]

Let me note his plan is wacko Trumpism to the extreme.

 

[dash]

Already, you can get CNN+ at 50% off two days after their initial launch.

 

[puckhead]

Per what I read a lot of that value is based on Russia stockpiling other currencies from residents. Essentially they made everyone who earned money outside of Russia to exchange it for Ruble's.

corporations are forced to expatriate 80% of cash back into rubles.
not quite a paper tiger, i guess a paper bear.

 

[thedddd]

Already, you can get CNN+ at 50% off two days after their initial launch.

Seriously who thought this was a good idea and who would really want to pay one news channels streaming service?

 

[dash]

Seriously who thought this was a good idea and who would really want to pay one news channels streaming service?

Kind of late to the game as far as streaming is concerned, but the key is having to pay more when you already have CNN for "free". Based on what I've read, it's just more of the same that basic CNN already provides.

 

[thedddd]

Kind of late to the game as far as streaming is concerned, but the key is having to pay more when you already have CNN for "free". Based on what I've read, it's just more of the same that basic CNN already provides.

Yeah it has to be packaged with another bundle for it to make sense.

So out of curiosity I went and checked and it seems you can get Chris Wallace on CNN+ now there it is and worth it!

 

[Comeds]

Yeah it has to be packaged with another bundle for it to make sense.

So out of curiosity I went and checked and it seems you can get Chris Wallace on CNN+ now there it is and worth it!

Chris Wallace OnlyFans Content, only on CNN+

 

[blindbaby]

Victoria is a pretty good tech hub as well, but the cost of housing while not quite as crazy as Vancouver is still out of reach for most people.

/It's why I live in the Cowichan Valley

It's really no more expensive now in Campbell River compared to Victoria for rent right now. I'm glad I managed to buy before everything tripled in price.

 

[dash]

Talk about a sticky situation...