Chris sale. This is getting ridiculous.

[navamind]

Very big difference between that and your original statement.

Even though I can't for the heck of me understand any reason for your laser focus on only his last ten starts for any other reason than you are trying to obfuscate the truth and paint a rosier picture than the garden really is.

Because his velocity was down earlier in the season and he was getting fewer whiffs. now he's throwing harder and striking everyone out. This isn't a hard thing to grasp.

 

[Ty41Office]

Is missing bats not important for a pitcher?

I was touching on this earlier today. In Sale's case, last night it would have been better for him to go 8 or 9 IP rather than get double digits Ks, right?

Heavy strikeout guys throw a lot of pitches. I mentioned Randy Johnson's comments about how he extended his career by pitching to fly ball outs to keep his pitch counts down.

A guy like Sale who gets handled with kid gloves could probably do himself a service by learning to do that. He could get more mileage out of his starts. On a team with a terrible bullpen, that feels like it could make a difference to his ballclub.

 

[Mofo]

Is missing bats not important for a pitcher?

Sometimes. But OUTS are the overriding concern, not so much how you get them.

 

[Ty41Office]

"damaged goods"

lmao. is this guy real?

Doesn't he have a history of breaking down late every summer? Wasn't last year his worst 2nd half yet? Wasn't he too hurt to pitch his load in October? Isn't his velocity down 6-8MPH this season?

Maybe damaged goods was the wrong term? But that was what I was referring to.

 

[kburjr]

I was touching on this earlier today. In Sale's case, last night it would have been better for him to go 8 or 9 IP rather than get double digits Ks, right?

Heavy strikeout guys throw a lot of pitches. I mentioned Randy Johnson's comments about how he extended his career by pitching to fly ball outs to keep his pitch counts down.

A guy like Sale who gets handled with kid gloves could probably do himself a service by learning to do that. He could get more mileage out of his starts. On a team with a terrible bullpen, that feels like it could make a difference to his ballclub.

That is making the assumption that he would get his outs without damage. Eliminate his Ks from the stats and what kind of pitcher is he without the Ks?

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Does that mean you don't want to answer the question?

No, that's not what it means. It means I'm amused by a stupid fan complaining about stupid fans.

 

[Used 2 B Hu]

Most sensible thing about him.

um...

i dont either

Bofayall can go stand in the corner

 

[Chewbaccer]

Is missing bats not important for a pitcher?

It is. Not the end all be all though. If a ground ball pitcher gets a shot ton of grounders, he’s doing his job too(see Mike Soroka)

 

[Mofo]

Ah, the ol' "pitch to contact" model. Pitcher becomes more dependent on his defense then. A ball in play is not an out unless your teammates do their job. It works for some, but given the choice, I'll go with a high % strikeout guy. Think Josh Hader

Josh Hader has the luxury of only having to pitch 1-2 innings per outing. The average starter should rely at least somewhat on his fielders to help get the outs. That's how he lasts 5+ innings to get his team to the manage only a short relief session. It takes at LEAST 3 pitches for a K (and generally 5 or more), but one good one in on the hands, and the guy gets jammed for a pop-up.

 

[Mofo]

No, that's not what it means. It means I'm amused by a stupid fan complaining about stupid fans.

So sorry to offend you, jerkoff. What- I'm imagining that Yankees and Red Sox fans don't vote a thousand times each and screw over the better players every year's ASG?

 

[Ty41Office]

Josh Hader has the luxury of only having to pitch 1-2 innings per outing. The average starter should rely at least somewhat on his fielders to help get the outs. That's how he lasts 5+ innings to get his team to the manage only a short relief session. It takes at LEAST 3 pitches for a K (and generally 5 or more), but one good one in on the hands, and the guy gets jammed for a pop-up.

Correct. Baseball 101, right? Relievers go in short bursts and can afford to dump everything into their one or two innings. Pitchers have to be more aware of their longevity for the start. Strikeouts aren't bad, but if you're trying to maximize mileage and limit bullpen exposure, pitching to contact is not a bad thing.

 

[Rock Strongo]

Very big difference between that and your original statement.

Even though I can't for the heck of me understand any reason for your laser focus on only his last ten starts for any other reason than you are trying to obfuscate the truth and paint a rosier picture than the garden really is.

no, no it isnt. do you speak english?

how are these 2 statements vastly different?

hes been arguably the best pitcher in baseball in his last 10 starts.

so yes, one could argue sales been one of the best pitchers in MLB over his last 10.

both statements argue a case for him being one of the best pitchers in MLB over his last 10.

 

[kburjr]

Josh Hader has the luxury of only having to pitch 1-2 innings per outing. The average starter should rely at least somewhat on his fielders to help get the outs. That's how he lasts 5+ innings to get his team to the manage only a short relief session. It takes at LEAST 3 pitches for a K (and generally 5 or more), but one good one in on the hands, and the guy gets jammed for a pop-up.

I think that is balanced by Sale's low BB rate. He doesn't go deep in counts. A power pitcher with suspect control(Randy Johnson) would be better served going to contact but a guy whose K/BB rate is the best in history would not, IMO.

 

[Ty41Office]

Because his velocity was down earlier in the season and he was getting fewer whiffs. now he's throwing harder and striking everyone out. This isn't a hard thing to grasp.

Ok, but how is that doing anything but cherry-picking what stats you want to look at to point the rosiest possible portrait?

You may think it's not a "hard thing to grasp" but it seems like you and the other Boston fan are the only two who seem to be grasping it. I'm going to guess that in this instance, correlation does equal causality.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

If Boston knew then what they know now, I can't imagine they make that trade again. Seems like the White Sox GM knew something that everyone else did not.

Derp.

 

[Ty41Office]

no, no it isnt. do you speak english?

how are these 2 statements vastly different?

hes been arguably the best pitcher in baseball in his last 10 starts.

so yes, one could argue sales been one of the best pitchers in MLB over his last 10.

both statements argue a case for him being one of the best pitchers in MLB over his last 10.

There is a very big difference between the two.

 

[Rock Strongo]

Very big difference between that and your original statement.

Even though I can't for the heck of me understand any reason for your laser focus on only his last ten starts for any other reason than you are trying to obfuscate the truth and paint a rosier picture than the garden really is.

one last time. its a valid sample size. in science, 30 = validation. since he only starts 30-35, im using %, which is statistically valid.

his last 10 starts is approx 30% of his season total barring injury.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Definitely on the pen. But Cora knew before he took Sale out that his bullpen is bad. His team needed 8 or 9 IP and he could only give them seven.

He's not the reason they lost. But he's also a main reason they didn't win.

Holy shit.

 

[Rock Strongo]

There is a very big difference between the two.

"hes been arguably the best in the game" vs "hes been arguably one of the best in the game" is the same statement.

its grouping. both being arguable vs a group of peers.

 

[kburjr]

Josh Hader has the luxury of only having to pitch 1-2 innings per outing. The average starter should rely at least somewhat on his fielders to help get the outs. That's how he lasts 5+ innings to get his team to the manage only a short relief session. It takes at LEAST 3 pitches for a K (and generally 5 or more), but one good one in on the hands, and the guy gets jammed for a pop-up.

So if a high rate of Ks by a reliever is a good thing why don't all teams have a reliever that strikes out 2 per inning?