Bad rookie class, or tremendous depth?

[deep9er]

yep, either a move up or a move to the following draft? doesn't need to be BIG moves, but doesn't make sense adding later round picks who struggle making the team?

if it is a move up, then it depends how high? a BIG move up for a QB is fine, maybe just outside the top 10? cause getting into the top 10 is likely too costly? or if there's a QB this good, top 10 teams covet him too.

a "semi-big" move for an OLB (who can rush), is also fine. semi-big meaning middle of the 1st or late teens? i'd consider an OT except we seem to be good there.

else, do we really want to give up so much for another position? cause the team moving up gives up more value, or should i say perceived value. so for other positions i'd be thinking early 20's at best?

 

[Dodub]

I think a combination. I never liked to Jenkins pick, I thought we should have taken Hill or Janoris. That being said, I don't know that Hill would have gotten much PT due to our depth at WR.

I hated the James pick and thought it was kind of a wasted pick, we simply didn't need the guy at all. We have much too much depth for him to be any factor without an injury.

 

[dredinis21]

yep, either a move up or a move to the following draft? doesn't need to be BIG moves, but doesn't make sense adding later round picks who struggle making the team?

if it is a move up, then it depends how high? a BIG move up for a QB is fine, maybe just outside the top 10? cause getting into the top 10 is likely too costly? or if there's a QB this good, top 10 teams covet him too.

a "semi-big" move for an OLB (who can rush), is also fine. semi-big meaning middle of the 1st or late teens? i'd consider an OT except we seem to be good there.

else, do we really want to give up so much for another position? cause the team moving up gives up more value, or should i say perceived value. so for other positions i'd be thinking early 20's at best?

So you don't think that an aging defense is worth trading up for a difference maker that could potentially be a lateral move as opposed to a downgraded position? Instead you are ok with a semi big trade up for an OLB, someone who would ultimately be a long term backup with Brooks' contract and Aldon being Aldon? I'd rather get an heir apparent to JS, Ice, or Rogers as a difference maker a la JJ Watts to Mario Williams.

 

[Hangman]

I would not do any trades with one exception. Niners are solid all long the board. I would keep getting solid players to fill up the bench. When an injury happens or if someone leaves in free agency then the niners have someone solid to take his place. That is what the niners have done the last 2 years. No one they drafted the last 2 years was drafted to start immediately.

That being said the only thing I would trade up for is a Julio Jones type WR. Someone who must be double covered leaving holes all over the field for other receivers and running backs.

But this year what I would like them to draft is a NT or a DE

 

[deep9er]

So you don't think that an aging defense is worth trading up for a difference maker that could potentially be a lateral move as opposed to a downgraded position? Instead you are ok with a semi big trade up for an OLB, someone who would ultimately be a long term backup with Brooks' contract and Aldon being Aldon? I'd rather get an heir apparent to JS, Ice, or Rogers as a difference maker a la JJ Watts to Mario Williams.

no i don't, because i START with what you give up versus what you get. the team pushing for a trade up gives up more in value. not going to say 'much more', because it is hard to REALLY define value?

next, if you knew for sure you'd get the next JS at 16th or 17th, of course we'd do it......IF you knew for sure? if you knew for sure you'd get that "difference maker" (non pass rusher), of course you'd do it. but do you?

drafting an OLB next year is looking long term, meaning 10+ years. if you identify potential like another Aldon, go get him. you will not be sure either, but the value in this position makes it a go. it is similar (not same) to QB, you're never sure till he plays, but the value in QB makes you push it.

i wouldn't pass on another 'Aldon' because Brooks and Aldon are signed for another 4 years (or whatever it is?). the NFL is becoming (already is?) a passing league and TWO outstanding pass rushing OLB's is HUGE. even if he plays part-time his rookie year, or pushes Brooks to the bench year 2, you take him. everydown pass rushing LB's are hard to obtain. you never know when one goes down to injury, to think they'll never get dinged is not good odds over 4 years.

you have better odds of drafting 3-4 DE or NT later than mid 1st round, as opposed to drafting an everydown OLB with pass rushing skills....mid 1st round.

so all these reasons taken together, i wouldn't trade up to mid 1st round for a defensive linemen. now this is thinking about a typical draft, not a rare one where a "patrick peterson" prospect falls to 16th.

 

[Flyingiguana]

i almost feel like we took a gamble with a couple quick players when we could have taken some what i consider sure bets in glenn and allen (i was looking for konz instead of glenn, but glenn fell).

however, u can't teach speed and quickness.

 

[deep9er]

i almost feel like we took a gamble with a couple quick players when we could have taken some what i consider sure bets in glenn and allen (i was looking for konz instead of glenn, but glenn fell).

however, u can't teach speed and quickness.

i like to think Baalke went with the best value, not gamble? if so, i'm totally fine with it. yes it doesn't look as good this year, but we're looking at the next 9.

next draft the 49ers won't be 'generally', so the move up makes sense.
btw - although i threw it out earlier, not pushing a trade to the following year. but i'd take that over just drafting 9 and cutting 5.

 

[imac_21]

I would not do any trades with one exception. Niners are solid all long the board. I would keep getting solid players to fill up the bench. When an injury happens or if someone leaves in free agency then the niners have someone solid to take his place. That is what the niners have done the last 2 years. No one they drafted the last 2 years was drafted to start immediately.

That being said the only thing I would trade up for is a Julio Jones type WR. Someone who must be double covered leaving holes all over the field for other receivers and running backs.

But this year what I would like them to draft is a NT or a DE

But we wouldn't be filling up the bench. We'd be filling up the waiver wire. We have 13 picks next year. Our top two draft picks this year have combined for 0 snaps and 1 game on the active roster. I don't see the point in drafting guys we don't have room for and being forced to cut or deactivate them every week.

I asked this earlier in another thread, and will ask it again here:

Would you trade Lamichael James and AJ Jenkins for Bruce Irvin?

 

[imac_21]

i like to think Baalke went with the best value, not gamble? if so, i'm totally fine with it. yes it doesn't look as good this year, but we're looking at the next 9.

next draft the 49ers won't be 'generally', so the move up makes sense.
btw - although i threw it out earlier, not pushing a trade to the following year. but i'd take that over just drafting 9 and cutting 5.

Your fine with a draft that no one plays from, but the 2007 draft that gave us Willis, Staley, MacDonald, Goldson and Brown is "sub-par?"

 

[TobyTyler]

None of our rookies have played a snap this year. In fact, not a single one has even been active for a game. Is it because it's a poor, or raw draft class, or is it because we're an extremely deep team? A combination of both?

I actually thought it was one of our better drafts in a while.

I think Jenkins will be a complete bust and James will be a marginal player on the periphery. I'll say it was a bust. Jenkins must be pinching himself not believeing his good fortune. He made several million dollars and doesn't even have to suit up or do anything to earn it. What a deal!

 

[Kinzu]

It's a depth issue. We really did not need anything from the draft but depth and players to develop for the future. We did well enough in the draft over the last several years that we had good players at all positions.

Now with the 13 picks in the draft next year we have the ammo to go after players we really like that could make an immediate impact.

 

[NinerSickness]

Would you trade Lamichael James and AJ Jenkins for Bruce Irvin?

I would. However, the 2nd rounder wouldn't have been enough to move up & get him.

 

[deep9er]

It's a depth issue. We really did not need anything from the draft but depth and players to develop for the future. We did well enough in the draft over the last several years that we had good players at all positions.

Now with the 13 picks in the draft next year we have the ammo to go after players we really like that could make an immediate impact.

13??!!

wow....

 

[I_am_1z]

I would say the rookies are having difficulty learning the offense, but Mario Manningham, who took an astronomical amount of time to learn the Giants playbook before being able to show off his talents, signed only a month before the draft and regularly sees playing time. I hope it's just a ploy and we'll see them inserted into the lineups soon giving the opposing late down the stretch just another thing to lookout for.

 

[Flyingiguana]

i like to think Baalke went with the best value, not gamble? if so, i'm totally fine with it. yes it doesn't look as good this year, but we're looking at the next 9.

next draft the 49ers won't be 'generally', so the move up makes sense.
btw - although i threw it out earlier, not pushing a trade to the following year. but i'd take that over just drafting 9 and cutting 5.

it definately wasn't best value. they pigeon holed what they were looking for before the draft.

 

[Flyingiguana]

I think Jenkins will be a complete bust and James will be a marginal player on the periphery. I'll say it was a bust. Jenkins must be pinching himself not believeing his good fortune. He made several million dollars and doesn't even have to suit up or do anything to earn it. What a deal!

i think jenkins can be an effective slot guy. basically replaces kyle in the line up.

 

[NinerSickness]

i think jenkins can be an effective slot guy. basically replaces kyle in the line up.

Yay. That's worth a first rounder when the Niners could've had Glenn or Janoris Jenkins.

 

[I_am_1z]

Yay. That's worth a first rounder when the Niners could've had Glenn or Janoris Jenkins.

Couldn't believe Baalke didn't take Janoris, usually we're on the same page

 

[NinerSickness]

Couldn't believe Baalke didn't take Janoris, usually we're on the same page

Well, let's hope he continues his exemplary college behaviour and gets arrested a few times to make us feel better.

 

[TobyTyler]

Well, let's hope he continues his exemplary college behaviour and gets arrested a few times to make us feel better.

Agreed. I don't want that clown anywhere near the 49ers.