Andrew Luck having a day today

[sonnyblack65]

I posted this above. the format didn't translate well.

Russell Wilson Tom Brady Peyton Manning
W-L since Wilson entered NFL 39-13 38-13 39-11
2014 yards (passing+rushing) 4,078 4,077 4,124

Ahh with rushing gotcha

 

[gowazzu02]

Ahh with rushing gotcha

Yup, gotta give brady credit for his sports center top 10 rush including juke move last week!!!

 

[Ties5o11]

Luck has more class in his pinkey finger than most of the Hawks fans on this thread. Whats up with Hawks fans always trying to put this guy down?

 

[gowazzu02]

Luck has more class in his pinkey finger than most of the Hawks fans on this thread. Whats up with Hawks fans always trying to put this guy down?

When your an "elite" qb, you get your haters who point out your flaws........ you wouldn't know anything about that rooting for Kap....

 

[Ties5o11]

Its one thing to point out his flaws, its another thing to make a sarcastic, biting post at another player designed to take him down. It's simply a classless post.

 

[gowazzu02]

Its one thing to point out his flaws, its another thing to make a sarcastic, biting post at another player designed to take him down. It's simply a classless post.

wahhh wahhh wahh the message board guys are mean to poor andrew luck. Dont want to be criticized dont get boat raced by Dallas

 

[flyerhawk]

Its one thing to point out his flaws, its another thing to make a sarcastic, biting post at another player designed to take him down. It's simply a classless post.

What this thread really needed was a concern troll. Thanks for stopping by

 

[unc0mm0n1]

I just want to repeat that I don't hate at all. Wilson is a good quarterback. To me it's not about if he will be elite but when he will be elite.

My only point is that as of right now, you simply can't say he's elite just because he has a super bowl and doesn't turn it over. To me degree of difficulty is very important for quarterbacks.

Not a fan of either guy (Dolphins fan) but I do like statistical debates. I have a few issues with your assertions.

Claim 1 Colts have no defense or running game:

Colts had given up 292 points while the Hawks had given up 234. On the surface that seems like a big discrepancy but the Colts have given up 84 points because of turnovers while the Hawks have only given up 35. Take those out and you're looking at 210 -201. Now clearly I don't think The Colts defense is as good as the Seahawks but I also don't the Colts division is as good as Seattle's.

On their own side of the field (where turnovers are especially hurtful). Andrew Luck has thrown 3 TDs and 9 interceptions whereas Wilson has thrown 1 TD 3 Ints. It is fair to question if Andrew Luck makes his defense look worse than it is.

As far as the running game, the Colts average 4.0 yards per carry which is about middle of the pack in the NFL but they rank 21st in the NFL in rushing yards. The main reason for this is they don't have a commitment to running game that some other teams do. If they added 4 more rushes per game (and kept the same average), they'd be a top 10 rushing team.

Claim 2: Luck has more pressure so that accounts for the turnovers.

Even if you take out playoffs, where Wilson clearly outperforms Luck, Wilson may be better in the regular season when the pressure is on as well. I'm not sure how you know this or how you calculate pressure. You claim pressure comes from Luck thinking he has to be perfect or the Colts lose. First, I'm not sure how we know he feels this way. Secondly, you could just as easily say Wilson is under pressure because he's the defending Superbowl winner. I think an objective measure would be how do these guys perform when trailing. This is a time when the game is on the QBs shoulders and Wilson outperforms Luck.

When Russell is behind his numbers are: 95/149 (63.8) 1,147/yds 7.7/avg 9TDs 4Ints for a rating of 96.2
plus he gives you 31 carries for 337yds (10.9 avg) and 3 Tds.

Luck's number are: 127/211 (60.2) 1,510yds 7.2/avg 12Tds 10ints for a rating of 83.1
plus he gives you 99yds (6.6 avg) and 1 Td.

So for 100 more yards and 1 more TD luck gives you 6 more picks, less completion percentage, less running and the runs and passes are shorter. Not saying that Wilson is better than Luck but I think that not all the numbers back up your assertions.

 

[Ties5o11]

Ive asked this before and Ill ask it again- wtf is in the water up there in Seattle. Or does the general lack of sunshine make everyone bitter? Y'all got the best team in football atm, and Seattle fans are by and far the most biting, negative fans around.

 

[sonnyblack65]

Yup, gotta give brady credit for his sports center top 10 rush including juke move last week!!!

Lol he gained more this year than his whole career inc pop warner,hs and college

 

[gowazzu02]

Ive asked this before and Ill ask it again- wtf is in the water up there in Seattle. Or does the general lack of sunshine make everyone bitter? Y'all got the best team in football atm, and Seattle fans are by and far the most biting, negative fans around.

years and years of no respect. We were told to win something then talk... Well they won the superbowl.... and we be talkin

 

[cwood]

Luck has more class in his pinkey finger than most of the Hawks fans on this thread. Whats up with Hawks fans always trying to put this guy down?

Same draft class as Wilson so they want their guy to be perceived as the better of the two. Peyton vs Brady part 2.

 

[Desean12345]

Not a fan of either guy (Dolphins fan) but I do like statistical debates. I have a few issues with your assertions.

Claim 1 Colts have no defense or running game:

Colts had given up 292 points while the Hawks had given up 234. On the surface that seems like a big discrepancy but the Colts have given up 84 points because of turnovers while the Hawks have only given up 35. Take those out and you're looking at 210 -201. Now clearly I don't think The Colts defense is as good as the Seahawks but I also don't the Colts division is as good as Seattle's.

On their own side of the field (where turnovers are especially hurtful). Andrew Luck has thrown 3 TDs and 9 interceptions whereas Wilson has thrown 1 TD 3 Ints. It is fair to question if Andrew Luck makes his defense look worse than it is.

As far as the running game, the Colts average 4.0 yards per carry which is about middle of the pack in the NFL but they rank 21st in the NFL in rushing yards. The main reason for this is they don't have a commitment to running game that some other teams do. If they added 4 more rushes per game (and kept the same average), they'd be a top 10 rushing team.

Points and total yards given up are both important and not only do the colts give up a lot of points but they give up a lot of yards. Second the Seahawks have had lots of injuries on defense all season which accounts for their lower numbers. They are just now starting to get healthy and your seeing what's happening. Even despite those injuries they still have the number 1 defense in the NFL. I won't deny that Luck does put his defense in tough spots sometimes. Thirdly, there is no good running backs on the roster, so why would they commit to the running game when it's not effective? Seahawks can commit to running the ball because they have a stable of good running backs. The Colts have Trent Richardson.

Claim 2: Luck has more pressure so that accounts for the turnovers.

Even if you take out playoffs, where Wilson clearly outperforms Luck, Wilson may be better in the regular season when the pressure is on as well. I'm not sure how you know this or how you calculate pressure. You claim pressure comes from Luck thinking he has to be perfect or the Colts lose. First, I'm not sure how we know he feels this way. Secondly, you could just as easily say Wilson is under pressure because he's the defending Superbowl winner. I think an objective measure would be how do these guys perform when trailing. This is a time when the game is on the QBs shoulders and Wilson outperforms Luck.

When Russell is behind his numbers are: 95/149 (63.8) 1,147/yds 7.7/avg 9TDs 4Ints for a rating of 96.2
plus he gives you 31 carries for 337yds (10.9 avg) and 3 Tds.

Luck's number are: 127/211 (60.2) 1,510yds 7.2/avg 12Tds 10ints for a rating of 83.1
plus he gives you 99yds (6.6 avg) and 1 Td.

So for 100 more yards and 1 more TD luck gives you 6 more picks, less completion percentage, less running and the runs and passes are shorter. Not saying that Wilson is better than Luck but I think that not all the numbers back up your assertions.

Is it not easier for a quarterback to play turnover free football when he has an elite defense and running game?

 

[Desean12345]

Same draft class as Wilson so they want their guy to be perceived as the better of the two. Peyton vs Brady part 2.

Luck and Wilson have similar career paths as those two as well.

 

[Ties5o11]

years and years of no respect. We were told to win something then talk... Well they won the superbowl.... and we be talkin

I think people are more concerned with the style and not the substance. Threads like this scream "immature jealous teenager", and not "mature, pontificating adult".

 

[unc0mm0n1]

[/B]

Is it not easier for a quarterback to play turnover free football when he has an elite defense and running game?

Do you have stats to back this up? AP is about as elite as it gets and his QBs all sucked. Baltimore back in the day had an elite Defense and Running back and their QBs still sucked. In fact many elite QBs don't have either. Marino didn't, Peyton didn't, Rodgers didn't. If the question is does an elite defense and running game make it easier to win, but the point I'm making is that Indy (and in some case Luck) make the defense and running game seem worse than they are. Also you didn't respond to the fact that Luck plays worse than Wilson in pressure situations like when trailing.

 

[unc0mm0n1]

Is there a way to edit your replies? I meant to say "If the question is does an elite defense and running game make it easier to win? I agree it does."

 

[sonnyblack65]

Is there a way to edit your replies? I meant to say "If the question is does an elite defense and running game make it easier to win? I agree it does."

Yeah but only have 5 min to do it. Hit edit button and fix

 

[Desean12345]

Do you have stats to back this up? AP is about as elite as it gets and his QBs all sucked. Baltimore back in the day had an elite Defense and Running back and their QBs still sucked. In fact many elite QBs don't have either. Marino didn't, Peyton didn't, Rodgers didn't. If the question is does an elite defense and running game make it easier to win, but the point I'm making is that Indy (and in some case Luck) make the defense and running game seem worse than they are. Also you didn't respond to the fact that Luck plays worse than Wilson in pressure situations like when trailing.

You don't need an elite quarterback to win super bowls. That's my point.

Wilson performs well in the rare instances when he is asked to step up which is why he has the makings of elite quarterback and not another Alex Smith.

However, Andrew Luck has 9 4th quarter comebacks since he's been in the league, same as Wilson.

 

[BHF]

Yes, he has.

Honest question: how many of those comebacks were necessary because he shat the bed in the first half?