34-64-94 MLB Draft : CHAT

[UK Cowboy]

@Nosferatu , here's how I decided to line up

Lineup

1 Paul Molitor (R) 2B 94
2 Paul Waner (L) RF 34
3 Alex Rodriguez (R) SS 94
4 Eddie Murray (B) 1B 994
5 Mark McGwire (R) DH 94
6 Willie Stargell (L) LF 64
7 Al Simmons (R) CF 34
8 Bill Freehan (R) C 64
9 Pie Traynor (R) 3B 34

Bench

Heinie Manush (L) LF 34
Vada Pinson (L) CF 64
Edgar Martinez (R) 3B 94
Del Crandall (R) C 64
Luis Aparicio (R) SS PR 64
Riggs Stephenson (L) LF 34

Rotation

1 Randy Johnson (L) 94
2 Whitey Ford (L) 64
3 Don Drysdale (R) 64
4 Billy Pierce (L) 64
5 Tommy Bridges (R) 34

Bullpen

Trevor Hoffman (R) 94 Closer
Lee Smith (R) 94
Rube Walberg (L) 34
Dutch Leonard (R) 34
Jack Russell (R) 34

 

[UK Cowboy]

Medwick is 5'10... If you want to play someone out of position at least use someone tall... 1B, short players are such a disadvantage since they have smaller reach, which makes just too much of a need for perfect throws by the rest of the infield... It is kind of like how catchers make pitchers better, 1B can make other positions better... But you are certainly making them much worse IMO...

I agree in part....A taller 1B does give the IF a much bigger target at 1st, but guys who are 5'10'', 5'11(for the most part) are quicker and have more range at 1st. Medwick, having been an OF, is probably faster and carries a bigger arm than a typical 1B. I really like putting former left side IFers at 1st, that extra slick glove at 1st can give the pitcher a ton of confidence. A big target is nice, but in the majors, it's not a big deal at the MLB level

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I agree in part....A taller 1B does give the IF a much bigger target at 1st, but guys who are 5'10'', 5'11(for the most part) are quicker and have more range at 1st. Medwick, having been an OF, is probably faster and carries a bigger arm than a typical 1B. I really like putting former left side IFers at 1st, that extra slick glove at 1st can give the pitcher a ton of confidence. A big target is nice, but in the majors, it's not a big deal at the MLB level

I feel like range zone factor for a first baseman is the least important part of a first baseman... While the most IMO is receiving the throws from the other infielders and pitcher... And there a short 1B certainly has the disadvantage... I agree that an OF is probably more athletic and would have a larger range of fielding, but I don't think that is a significant part of the position, neither is throwing the ball... Really how often does the first baseman throw the ball... the throws they make are not the most challenging ones either... I really think you need to be at least 6'0 to be a good 1B...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

LINEUP VS RIGHTIES(main lineup)
1. Kenny Lofton - (L) - CF - 94
2. Buddy Myer - (L) - 2B - 34
3. Babe Ruth - (L) - RF - 34
4. Frank Robinson - (R) - LF - 64
5. Mike Schmidt - (R) - 3B - WC
6. Don Mattingly - (L) - 1B - 94
7. Ernie Banks - (R) - SS - 64
8. Gabby Hartnett - (R) - C - 34
9. Lefty O'Doul- (L)-DH-34
BENCH
Gary Sheffield- (R)-RF-94
Spud Davis - (R) - C - 34
Travis Jackson - (R) - SS/3B - 34
Otis Nixon - (B) - CF - 94
Andres Galarraga - (R) - 1B - 94
Freddie Lindstrom - (R) - 3B/OF - 34
ROTATION
1. Gaylord Perry - (R) - 64
2. Robin Roberts - (R) - 64
3. Mickey Lolich - (L) - 64
4. Bucky Walters - (R) - 34
5. Frank Viola - (L) - 94
BULLPEN
Bobby Shantz - (L) - 64
Ron Perranoski - (L) - 64
Don McMahon - (R) - 64
Doug Jones - (R) - 94
Todd Worrell - (R) - 94

 

[UK Cowboy]

I feel like range zone factor for a first baseman is the least important part of a first baseman... While the most IMO is receiving the throws from the other infielders and pitcher... And there a short 1B certainly has the disadvantage... I agree that an OF is probably more athletic and would have a larger range of fielding, but I don't think that is a significant part of the position, neither is throwing the ball... Really how often does the first baseman throw the ball... the throws they make are not the most challenging ones either... I really think you need to be at least 6'0 to be a good 1B...

I have to disagree....We are talking about the Majors here, infielders don't need a 6'4'' target to hit.....they have been playing 60-90 since they were 14, and the majority of 1B at the HS level aren't 6'4''. Heck, the 1B on our varsity(which is 11-3 and ranked in the top 20) has a 1B who is 5'7'', and it's a non issue. Granted, it's better to have a 6'4'' guy that can go get it, but I see a WHOLE.....lot more balls in an MLB season that the 1B should have gotten to but didn't than were thrown high. 90% of MLB throws hit the 1B right between the numbers

Greatest defensive 1B of all time...LISTED...6'0''....Keith Hernandez

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I have to disagree....We are talking about the Majors here, infielders don't need a 6'4'' target to hit.....they have been playing 60-90 since they were 14, and the majority of 1B at the HS level aren't 6'4''. Heck, the 1B on our varsity(which is 11-3 and ranked in the top 20) has a 1B who is 5'7'', and it's a non issue. Granted, it's better to have a 6'4'' guy that can go get it, but I see a WHOLE.....lot more balls in an MLB season that the 1B should have gotten to but didn't than were thrown high. 90% of MLB throws hit the 1B right between the numbers

Clearly comparing highschool is not the same as pros... But the taller players also have the longer stretch... generally taller players have longer arms and longer legs... so they can just get to more balls easier...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Just found a study from 2009 about short 1B...

From 1990-2009 there were only 9 1B under 6'0 who played at least half a season at first... John Kruk and Gregg Jeffries both did it 3 times, so there was only 5 different 1B... Point is, yes it has been done, but it just is not common...

 

[UK Cowboy]

Clearly comparing highschool is not the same as pros... But the taller players also have the longer stretch... generally taller players have longer arms and longer legs... so they can just get to more balls easier...

The thing is, you're the one who made his short 1B an issue, when the greatest defensive 1B ever is about the same height
And why can't you compare HS and MLB baseball? Good grief, if HS kids can make throws to 5'10",1B's, you don't think pro's could? And one other thing...a lot of the 6'5" 1st basemen in the majors aren't there for their defensive prowess, on the contrary, many are TERRIBLE defenders who are in the lineup for their stick

 

[blstoker]

I don't find Medwick's height all that concerning. I have plus defenders at the other 3 positions, with at least one elite defender able to come off the bench, not to mention that Olerud himself can be counted on to provide great defense in late game situations. Joe Cronin played with shorter firstbasemen, Joe Judge (5'8"), Joe Kuhel (6'0"), Babe Dahlgren (6'0") and Jimmie Foxx (6'0") just to name a few. The same can be said for Max Bishop (Joe Hauser, 5'10"; Jim Poole, 6'0"; Jimmy Dykes, 5'9"; Foxx) and Stan Hack (Charlie Grimm, 5'11"; Phil Cavaretta, 5'11"; Ripper Collins, 5'9"). In fact, Hack seems to be the only one to have played a season where a majority of the games were played by someone taller than 6'. So, overall, height isn't my concern, cause bigger players tend to get to high thrown balls easier, but they usually struggle more in the dirt.

The original question was, is 1B a position where due to it's relative ease of play that a player with next to no experience be concidered a pariah for being started there, or just seen as another low defense 1st basemen (which to be honest most successfully offensive firstbasemen are)?

 

[blstoker]

Line Up: (Righties)

3B Stan Hack (L)
SS Joe Cronin (R)
CF Kirby Puckett (R)
DH Albert Belle (R)
1B John Olerud (L)+
LF Joe Medwick (R)
RF Roberto Clemente (R)
C Rick Ferrell (R)*
2B Max Bishop (R)

Bench:

C Dan Wilson (R)
2B Brett Boone (R)
SS Leo Durocher (R)
1B/3B/LF/CF Frank Thomas (R)
OF Hack Wilson (R)

Rotation:

Lefty Grove (L)
Greg Maddux (R)
Clayton Kershaw (L)
Juan Marichal (R)
Mel Stottlemyre (R)

Bullpen

CP Bryan Harvey
SU Hoyt Wilhelm
RH Mark Eichhorn
RH Bob Lee
LH Billy O'Dell
LH Don Mossi

+ - Medwick would play first vs. lefties with Hack Wilson playing DH and Belle in left (Order stays the same with Wilson taking Olerud's spot).

* - Ferrell and Wilson would platoon depending on who is pitching. Wilson will catch for Stottlemyre.

Granted this is pre drops, I have drops (being sick and not thinking well does not bode well for drafting players).

 

[MilkSpiller22]

The thing is, you're the one who made his short 1B an issue, when the greatest defensive 1B ever is about the same height
And why can't you compare HS and MLB baseball? Good grief, if HS kids can make throws to 5'10",1B's, you don't think pro's could? And one other thing...a lot of the 6'5" 1st basemen in the majors aren't there for their defensive prowess, on the contrary, many are TERRIBLE defenders who are in the lineup for their stick

Never made an issue of it... All I said is that shorter 1Bs have a disadvantage... Never said I would not vote for Blstoker because of a short 1B... He also brought up moving a player who has never played the position, and I think an inexperienced player who does not have the size or body a 1B ideally needs, and especially one that was a below average OF, is certainly not going to be a plus for the team at the position... I just don't see how it doesn't hurt the rest of the defense, whether significant or not...

Did you know, that after 1946 the MLB average for errors was never above .95 per game, while before 1947 it has always been over 1 per game and only under 1.1 twice... I am not saying that this is because of the average 1B being taller... Most of it is of course due to the OF dimensions shrinking, and much is likely due to different error rules... But I am sure that part of it is due to identifying the ideal position for some players and that includes how 1B average height increased...

 

[wlk3]

The more you can attend his lessons, the better. No one will ever study hid swing as much as you will, so the more you learn, the better. Remember, the quieter and simpler, the better. College scouts tell me the undisputed biggest mistake kids make is not being ready to hit...to much but wiggling, late loading. Next is hitting around the ball, trying to pull the ball instead of keeping their hands in and driving it where it was pitched

Yeah, I haven't heard of him either.

I'm completely with UK on working at things little by little. I battle this everyday at practice. One coach can't help himself from haulting drills to breakdown every little thing for one kid. Especially when it comes to hitting. It overloads and accomplishes less than just focussing on creating good habits bit by bit overtime. Perfect practice doesn't make perfect, cuz perfect practice doesn't exist.

I also think that every hitter is different and being comfortable in the box is most important. Less is more to me when it comes to movement. But if a kid does go with a leg kick, and he's done it long enough where he can honestly say it's how he bats. Well, that's how he bats. And we can work from there.

So it was 31 bucks I payed on Wednesday... Just got the video breakdown and I gotta say I really like what I'm seeing... He pointed out 3 points that need fixing... Weight transfer, a "cast" in his swing in the back arm, and his step needs to be straight if he's going to use his a step... All 3 can be addressed at the same time since they are all connected is what he says... He sent 4 drills to work on for the week... I'll keep you posted...

 

[femurov]

I feel like sliding an outfielder from center to left or whatever would be a lot less of a stretch than playing an OF at 1B. I would dock points if I were voting.

 

[blstoker]

I feel like sliding an outfielder from center to left or whatever would be a lot less of a stretch than playing an OF at 1B. I would dock points if I were voting.

But, that's the point. How much? How much is the defense of a 1st baseman worth in the grand scheme compared to the offensive output? Though, in all fairness, he did play the position, just not a lot, and not at all until he was fairly old.

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

Who wants to help give me advice on what my lineup should look like?

 

[UK Cowboy]

• So it was 31 bucks I payed on Wednesday... Just got the video breakdown and I gotta say I really like what I'm seeing... He pointed out 3 points that need fixing... Weight transfer, a "cast" in his swing in the back arm, and his step needs to be straight if he's going to use his a step... All 3 can be addressed at the same time since they are all connected is what he says... He sent 4 drills to work on for the week... I'll keep you posted...

I would ditch the step....he's young, it would simplify his timing....lots of major leaguers use kick/step, but they have unreal batspeed

 

[UK Cowboy]

Who wants to help give me advice on what my lineup should look like?

How about

Rickey R
Fox L
Trout R
Ripkin R
Trosky L
Carter R
Cash L
Howard R
Boyer R

 

[Nosferatu]

@broncosmitty Benton is gone please pick again.

@ehb5 @Mebert @Ritzarmy please make your final picks.

 

[wlk3]

I would ditch the step....he's young, it would simplify his timing....lots of major leaguers use kick/step, but they have unreal batspeed

SOB... I'm looking through a bunch of stuff, asking you guys, all over YouTube... Just turning over every leaf I can... My wife mentioned you should call uncle Robert he'd love to come work with the boys... Uncle Robert is like 70 something, ex-college coach... I respect him off that only but I met him a couple times and thought maybe the "now" coaches have new stuff since he's old and hasn't coached in a while and lives 2 hours away... So I never really took the option serious... Well, my wife just sent me this...

WLBT : Jackson State's Bob Braddy in College Baseball HOF Class of 2016

Uncle Robert is being inducted to the College Baseball HOF...

Wtf... Lol I wished when she suggested call uncle Robert she would have mentioned he wasn't some old timey guy that says "those little rascals" but a a damn HOFer...

Needless to say I will be visiting uncle Robert soon and often lol...

 

[wlk3]

@broncosmitty Benton is gone please pick again.

@ehb5 @Mebert @Ritzarmy please make your final picks.

I'd be willing to trade Benton for Manny...