Series Thread: 2nd Round: Cleveland Cavs vs Toronto Raptors

[WiggyRuss]

Defensively? Yes. If they somehow don't make it out of the East, their defense will be the reason. If they lose in the finals, their defense will be the reason.

My opinion on this has not changed. If they can find a way to play at least close to the level of defense that they played last year, they will not only come out of the East, but they stand a very good chance of getting the repeat.

So far, I haven't seen anything from them that shows they can get back to that level defensively.

Maybe they know they can just outscore everyone in the East and figure they'll step their defense up in the finals, but that's a very dangerous game to play.

wait.....so just to get this straight- if they lose in the East you will blame it on their defense- but you think that its practically impossible they lose in the East? is that a fair characterization?

 

[trojanfan12]

do you still think they are "a bit vulnerable" in the East? to quote you directly.

Read post #319.

 

[gordontrue]

Not really. What do you think those teams records would look like if they were playing a Western Conference schedule?

Considering the fact that their strength of schedule was virtually identical... no different.

The conf schedule strengths last year were the same. The West had tougher teams at the top, but they also had a lot of easy wins at the bottom. It evened out.

 

[trojanfan12]

A little over the top? If that was his point, he could say it, instead of what he actually said. Does he need you to explain what he really meant?

Yes, a bit over the top. I mean, are you seriously going to read the shit that Wiggy and Shane post on here and then call someone else out for being over the top in a post?

 

[WiggyRuss]

I just would like to re-iterate my opinion on the Cavs "vulnerability" in the East---- anyone who thinks the Cavs are at all "vulnerable" in the East- CLEARLY has not watched LeBron Raymone James domination of the East for the last few years and has significantly overvalued the regular season as an indicator of post-season success.

The proof is out there on the court- or at least has been thus far. 5-0. I gotta say- EVEN I didnt expect them to be 5-0 in an improved Eastern Conference at this point.

 

[Wamu]

I just would like to re-iterate my opinion on the Cavs "vulnerability" in the East---- anyone who thinks the Cavs are at all "vulnerable" in the East- CLEARLY has not watched LeBron Raymone James domination of the East for the last few years and has significantly overvalued the regular season as an indicator of post-season success.

The proof is out there on the court- or at least has been thus far. 5-0. I gotta say- EVEN I didnt expect them to be 5-0 in an improved Eastern Conference at this point.

Do you have a statue of LeBron made out of macaroni shells in your front yard?

 

[WiggyRuss]

Considering the fact that their strength of schedule was virtually identical... no different.

The conf schedule strengths last year were the same. The West had tougher teams at the top, but they also had a lot of easy wins at the bottom. It evened out.

The East over last season and this season has definitely been improved overall.

But- i mean- improved is one thing--- a totally different thing is actually having anything other than a snow-balls chance in hell to beat LeBron.

the East IS improved this year----- and was pretty solid overall last year as well-- but LeBron is LeBron.

They need to improve a LOT more to get at LeBron's level- or even get to a level where they are to be taken seriously as a challenger.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Do you have a statue of LeBron made out of macaroni shells in your front yard?

I mean dude-

ill be the first to admit the East is improved--- but just because its improved doesnt mean anyone has a snowballs chance in hell against LBJ and the Cavs.

the Warriors ahve 4 of the top 15 players in the league- if not for a historic team like that- LeBron would run over EVERYONE. I dont think in the HISTORY of the league anyone has ever had 4 of the top 15-20 players----- and its the only reason the cavs and lebron arent heavy favorites to repeat.

and dont make me laugh about the spurs--- that team has NO next level, no way to ratchet it up once the postseason starts--- which is something simpletons always discount---- they put WAAAAAY to much stock in the regular season.

 

[trojanfan12]

wait.....so just to get this straight- if they lose in the East you will blame it on their defense- but you think that its practically impossible they lose in the East? is that a fair characterization?

Yes, I'm not sure what is so difficult for you to understand. Last year, they played championship caliber defense pretty much all season and throughout the playoffs. It's why they won the championship.

This year, they have been terrible on defense and even in the East are giving up in the neighborhood of 110 points per game in the playoffs. Last night was their "easiest" win so far and they still gave up 105 points. Last years team wouldn't have allowed that to happen.

So, if they don't make it out of the East, it will be because of their defense. Fortunately for them, the East is a weak conference right now, so it is very likely that they can just outscore everyone to get to the finals.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yes, I'm not sure what is so difficult for you to understand. Last year, they played championship caliber defense pretty much all season and throughout the playoffs. It's why they won the championship.

This year, they have been terrible on defense and even in the East are giving up in the neighborhood of 110 points per game in the playoffs. Last night was their "easiest" win so far and they still gave up 105 points. Last years team wouldn't have allowed that to happen.

So, if they don't make it out of the East, it will be because of their defense. Fortunately for them, the East is a weak conference right now, so it is very likely that they can just outscore everyone to get to the finals.

hey- as long as - and like i said- i will assume its what you think becuase you agreed with me in this post---

that the chances of the Cavs losing in the East are practically zilch- i will totally agree with you.

 

[trojanfan12]

Considering the fact that their strength of schedule was virtually identical... no different.

The conf schedule strengths last year were the same. The West had tougher teams at the top, but they also had a lot of easy wins at the bottom. It evened out.

And it's the tougher teams that get to the playoffs. So, the fact still remains that the Cavs had an easier path because the playoff teams they faced weren't as good as the teams in the West.

 

[gordontrue]

Yes, a bit over the top. I mean, are you seriously going to read the shit that Wiggy and Shane post on here and then call someone else out for being over the top in a post?

It wasn't even a big deal until you started white knighting for him. I don't see what Wiggy's posts have to do with it. People call him out all the time and you never take issue with it. Lord knows you call people you when you feel like it.

 

[Hambombs]

I mean dude-

ill be the first to admit the East is improved--- but just because its improved doesnt mean anyone has a snowballs chance in hell against LBJ and the Cavs.

the Warriors ahve 4 of the top 15 players in the league- if not for a historic team like that- LeBron would run over EVERYONE. I dont think in the HISTORY of the league anyone has ever had 4 of the top 15-20 players----- and its the only reason the cavs and lebron arent heavy favorites to repeat.

and dont make me laugh about the spurs--- that team has NO next level, no way to ratchet it up once the postseason starts--- which is something simpletons always discount---- they put WAAAAAY to much stock in the regular season.

How does the regular season not matter? Then tell me why the majority of 1 and 2 seeds have won it all then?

 

[gordontrue]

And it's the tougher teams that get to the playoffs. So, the fact still remains that the Cavs had an easier path because the playoff teams they faced weren't as good as the teams in the West.

In terms of who the Warriors faced last year: 41 win Rockets, 44 win Blazers, 55-win Thunder and who the Cavs faced last year: 44 win Pistons, 48 win Hawks, 56-win Raptors.... its debatable.

Certainly not enough of a difference to warrant the "well the Warriors were worn out from their much tougher road" excuse that I was responding to.

 

[trojanfan12]

The East over last season and this season has definitely been improved overall.

There's improved, then there's improved enough to be a threat. I mean, the Lakers were improved over last year. But they still weren't anywhere close to a playoff team.

No one in the East improved enough for them to have anything better than a punchers chance against the Cavs. For a team to actually beat the Cavs, the Cavs would have to continue to play poor defense and go through an offensive drought that lasted at least 4 games.

As good as they are offensively, I don't see even a 2 game drought happening.

 

[WiggyRuss]

How does the regular season not matter? Then tell me why the majority of 1 and 2 seeds have won it all then?

for the Cavs?

you think that the way the Cavs were playing in March and April was a legitimate indicator of how they would play in the playoffs? that it mattered AT ALL?

i mean- i think anyone who actually follows basketball at this poitn would realize that ---- maybe 2007 LeBron and the Cavs it would have meant something- but not 32 year old lebron and the cavs....the focus isnt on winning as many games as possible or playing their A game in March and April- if you want that go watch the Spurs and then watch them FAIL to have another level they can reach in the post-season.

 

[trojanfan12]

hey- as long as - and like i said- i will assume its what you think becuase you agreed with me in this post---

that the chances of the Cavs losing in the East are practically zilch- i will totally agree with you.

Yes, that's what I think and it's what I've said all along. I know you Cavs fans want to spin every criticism into hate.

I have never made it a secret that I don't like Lebron and I don't like the Cavs because he plays for them. But I also have eyes and an understanding of the game. Whether I like it or not, Lebron is the best player in the game and the Cavs are the overwhelming favorite to come out of the East.

I guess the best way to put it is this: If the Cavs don't make it out of the East, I will be shocked. Just not as shocked as I would have been last year when they were playing championship caliber defense.

 

[trojanfan12]

It wasn't even a big deal until you started white knighting for him. I don't see what Wiggy's posts have to do with it. People call him out all the time and you never take issue with it. Lord knows you call people you when you feel like it.

Now you are comparing Wiggy and Shane's nonsense and constant spamming to 2 posts from another poster.

 

[Hambombs]

for the Cavs?

you think that the way the Cavs were playing in March and April was a legitimate indicator of how they would play in the playoffs? that it mattered AT ALL?

i mean- i think anyone who actually follows basketball at this poitn would realize that ---- maybe 2007 LeBron and the Cavs it would have meant something- but not 32 year old lebron and the cavs....the focus isnt on winning as many games as possible or playing their A game in March and April- if you want that go watch the Spurs and then watch them FAIL to have another level they can reach in the post-season.

We will see i guess

 

[gordontrue]

Now you are comparing Wiggy and Shane's nonsense and constant spamming to 2 posts from another poster.

lol, no, that was you. You brought it up. I said it was irrelevant. Nice try.