2021 NFL Draft Discussion thread

[nflbronco]

And thank you for doing that. He really enjoyed and appreciated you being on.

Not surprised this board has the best people around.

 

[Draft Crazy]

And thank you for doing that. He really enjoyed and appreciated you being on.

It was a lot of fun. They do a good job.

 

[Mingo]

And thank you for doing that. He really enjoyed and appreciated you being on.

Draft Crazy is always on - he was not designed with a mute button.

 

[Mingo]

Not surprised this board has the best people around.

Thank you Paulie Walnuts.

 

[Clayton]

My biggest concern with Surtain is man to man. But I think he fits our scheme just fine. My rankings of the top 3 CB’s really comes down to what team I am ranking them for.

I haven't watched a ton of him because he really isnt even on my radar as a Chiefs fan but isn't Surtain's fit as a press man-to-man guy? I do realize that he can have some issues man to man when going against someone he doesn't get a hand on but I feel like having him in any other scheme is a mistake.

 

[cdumler7]

Trey Lance just had a great Pro Day. Arm looked better than even during the season. He has been working with Watson's QB guru all offseason and it showed.

 

[cdumler7]

I haven't watched a ton of him because he really isnt even on my radar as a Chiefs fan but isn't Surtain's fit as a press man-to-man guy? I do realize that he can have some issues man to man when going against someone he doesn't get a hand on but I feel like having him in any other scheme is a mistake.

I would say press-man he would be fine. His size helps make up for some of his shortcomings in the speed category on those deep routes in man coverage. Personally I think his best fit is in either Cover-2 or Cover-3 where he has some help or a smaller zone to cover. If the Broncos played either I would have him ranked higher but right now I have him around 5 on my board for the CB position.

 

[Draft Crazy]

I haven't watched a ton of him because he really isnt even on my radar as a Chiefs fan but isn't Surtain's fit as a press man-to-man guy? I do realize that he can have some issues man to man when going against someone he doesn't get a hand on but I feel like having him in any other scheme is a mistake.

100% would agree with this. Unless you want to him to safety in another scheme, which I think he would make a very good safety.
You don’t want him locking up in man to man without a press scheme.

His man to man coverage skills are not of top 25 skill but everything else is. Which is what I was referring to when I said my CB rankings depend on the team I am drafting for.

The Fangio scheme really calls for his DB’s to be versatile and be used in multiple ways. If you use Surtain to his strengths he will excel. If you don’t he won’t. Can say that for pretty much any DB though.

 

[Draft Crazy]

I have always had this feeling that Fangio is most likely in love with Farley from the top CB group much like he loved Kyle Fuller coming out of Va Tech.

I am almost positive he is likely in love with Greg Newsome.

As I have said for awhile now my personal fav is Jaycee Horn but I don’t get the fuzzy warm feeling that he is our guy.

 

[cdumler7]

I have always had this feeling that Fangio is most likely in love with Farley from the top CB group much like he loved Kyle Fuller coming out of Va Tech.

You nailed it. No CB brings more versatility at the CB position than Farley. Or maybe better way to say it is the potential to be one of the most versatile CB's in the NFL. He is obviously still pretty raw for the position and needs more reps. That ability to have a chess piece that he can move around and have them be so multiple would be fun against some of the top QB's to get a few big plays.

 

[Clayton]

The way I look at it is that the best of the CB group in 2021 will probably be Jaycee Horn but the best of the group by 2023 will almost certainly be Farley.

I want to see Tyson Campbell's 3 cone. I can't tell if he has just had some bad luck with some lack of coordination or if he is going to have issues with that at the next level. He'd either be my CB3 or a late 2nd rounder based on that.

I need to see more of Kelvin Joseph. He has flashes of good play but Ive heard there is a lot of bad film on him and there just isnt much on youtube.

 

[Draft Crazy]

Side Note: They should be looking at OL but I pray the Chiefs don’t end up witj Kadarius Toney or Rondale Moore this Draft Season. Tony has TY Hilton replacement written all over him to me.

 

[Draft Crazy]

My dawg Etienne, ran his 40 in 4.40, about what I would have expected. His vision and explosion is so appealing to me. He has some of the best vision I have seen and he has been showing that since his FR season at Clemson. Love me some Travis Etienne.

The interesting thing to remember with Caleb Farley is that he didn't even really play much of the CB position until he got to the college level. Not unusual for a player coming out of HS as a QB to move to a different position on the field. But he bounced around a bit before he settled on CB... He started off as a WR then moved to CB> Farley is a great athlete. HIs athletic ability is eye popping, his upside is great.... Seems like we haven't always had the best luck with a prospect like Farley, but things are also a changin' in Denver (hopefully)... Farley also had a knee issue at Va Tech that appears to be fine now, but something to think about if it comes down to this vs that. His athletic ability combined with his size/length is really what blows a person away. He was consistent early on but by the 2019 season he locked down in coverage and proved to be pretty consistent. He shows good recovery speed and plays the ball pretty well from what I have seen of him. The injury history is going to bother some people (torn ACL and back surgery) but there have really been no issues with his recovery from either one. My biggest concern would be the overeall development. How good can he be vs How good will he be? Overeall, Farley has more upside then Horn or Surtain and that isn't to take anything away from those two because, IMO those two are VERY good CB's. I didn't see a CB play better in college football then Horn this year. The thing that appeals about Surtain is his athletic ability, his football IQ, his physcial style of play. He doesn't make mistakes but the concern is how good he can really be???? He was in a great defense where his man to man coverage skills weren't exposed (doesn't mean he is terrible in man to man) but was he able to get away with not being a great cover guy? I love Surtains versatility. I loved his dad's play. He comes from a good bloodline of great football IQ... My biggest beef when pondering him vs the Farley's and Horn's is.. Will he make a better safety then CB at the NFL level? The answer probably all depends on how you use him and what you ask him to do. I think he will be very dependable if you use him the right way. If you want to use him a certain way that doesn't match what he does best, then he probably isn't for you! I don't see a lot of bust potential in Surtain minus using him the wrong way. (But that can also be said for most players).

 

[Clayton]

Side Note: They should be looking at OL but I pray the Chiefs don’t end up witj Kadarius Toney or Rondale Moore this Draft Season. Tony has TY Hilton replacement written all over him to me.

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about that. I'm not saying the Chiefs are 100% taking OL in rd1 but they are almost certainly going to be taking 2 OLs in the draft at some point so...yeah...probably taking 1 in rd1.

JOK going to the Raiders or Slater going to the Chargers could be game changers, though.

I also think that Moore fits what the Chiefs do way more than Toney. I doubt Toney is even on their draft board.

 

[Draft Crazy]

I am curious what people think on Farley's situation sitting out this past year.

Help or hurt? Or neither.

I am going to say it didn't hurt simply because just like Ja'Marr Chase he was coming off a terrific season.... If Farley had shown inconsistent play this year it would have had people second guessing what he did the year before... At the same time you look at guys like Chase and Farley and had they had the same terrific season they did the year before they sat out they could be sitting alone at the top of their position group.. ( Had to say that after the year Smith just had at WR) but it really gave Smith the abilit to jump Chase this year. The debate is still on, but if Smith has the Heisman season yet Chase has a similar season again like he did in 2019 then I think with his size/ speed he is sitting atop the WR charts in this draft.

As a fan I would have really liked to see Farley play this year because had he played as well as he did in 2019 and stayed healthy he would be the clear #1 CB in this years draft without many questions, IMO. Now Surtain has shown throughout his college career that he has been playing at a consistent level and has the athletic ability to match a guy like Farley although may not fit into as many schemes, it does raise the question... What if Farley isn't as consistent??? I guess my point is... Now as a GM I have a better grasp of what Surtain is because I was able to watch him the last two seasons whereas Farley I did not. Just curious how much the covid opt outs will be impacted... Could help them in one way in which they are loving off their 2019 season in which guys like Chase and Farley were great... But could also hurt them due to the inability for some GM's to not be as confident with less of a sample size. I think it brings a bigger concern to me with a CB then a WR if I am the one deciding.

But like I mentioned before it could really help Farley too because you are going to go off his last season in action and if he had gotten injured or slipped a bit this year we likely would not be talking about him with Surtain and Horn.

 

[Draft Crazy]

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about that. I'm not saying the Chiefs are 100% taking OL in rd1 but they are almost certainly going to be taking 2 OLs in the draft at some point so...yeah...probably taking 1 in rd1.

JOK going to the Raiders or Slater going to the Chargers could be game changers, though.

I also think that Moore fits what the Chiefs do way more than Toney. I doubt Toney is even on their draft board.

I would be SHOCKED if Toney is not on their draft board. I know they have already shown him interest. There is surely a bit of interest there. Moore has Chief written all over him to me, but I really think KC needs to go another direction if they want to help fill some of those gaps! They have plenty of weapons and can find more without having to spend a high pick. I know it could be very appealing to them though.

Toney is soo good with the ball in his hands. He is tough to tackle, good return man. He is another X factor. Having him and Kyle Pitts at Florida was a real treat.

 

[Clayton]

I would be SHOCKED if Toney is not on their draft board. I know they have already shown him interest. There is surely a bit of interest there. Moore has Chief written all over him to me, but I really think KC needs to go another direction if they want to help fill some of those gaps! They have plenty of weapons and can find more without having to spend a high pick. I know it could be very appealing to them though.

Toney is soo good with the ball in his hands. He is tough to tackle, good return man. He is another X factor. Having him and Kyle Pitts at Florida was a real treat.

Toney is really good at what he does but I'm not sure he is versatile enough to be in the Chiefs offense. Andy Reid wants someone to run routes 30 yards down the field and not quick slants even when the situation calls for quick slants like in the Super Bowl. Toney is probably a 4.5 guy who has almost no contested catch data. He was always 'college open' although part of that is because he is a freak of nature.

Veach is probably wondering how many draft picks to give up to trade up and get Darrisaw or something like that.

 

[cdumler7]

I would be SHOCKED if Toney is not on their draft board. I know they have already shown him interest. There is surely a bit of interest there. Moore has Chief written all over him to me, but I really think KC needs to go another direction if they want to help fill some of those gaps! They have plenty of weapons and can find more without having to spend a high pick. I know it could be very appealing to them though.

Toney is soo good with the ball in his hands. He is tough to tackle, good return man. He is another X factor. Having him and Kyle Pitts at Florida was a real treat.

Chiefs went for a weapon last year in CEH and it kind of bit them in the behind when many were point to OL depth and defense being a major issue heading into the season. I'm thinking they learn from that lesson. Also should point out that their top weapons were not 1st round pick guys in Hill and Kelce.

It would be hard to pass up that level of talent though and make teams have to defend even more parts of the field. The Chiefs did just re-do Mahomes' contract to free up some cap space so if they can get that OL taken care of with a couple of veterans then maybe they will have some freedom to have some fun.

 

[Draft Crazy]

@Clayton At 31 right now (I know this could change tomorrow) who are your top 3 likey targets for KC?

 

[Clayton]

@Clayton At 31 right now (I know this could change tomorrow) who are your top 3 likey targets for KC?

Best available OT prospect (Radunz?), Jaelan Phillips, Landon Dickerson. Probably trading ahead of Buffalo or trading back.

Phillips and Dickerson are a bit of a catch-22. If they fall then there is something too wrong with them.