2021-2022 NBA Season

[CitySushi]

when you really look at it....LeBron decided to go to LA...his family lived there, etc....and then, surprise surprise.....Clutch client Anthony Davis demanded a trade to the Lakers 3 months later- said he would re-sign nowhere else- a move was made that costed the Lakers Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Hart, and multiple 1st round picks and pick swaps.

If Pelinka has made one signature move that was actually in his hands- it was the Westbrook trade.

Seeing the night and day difference between last years Warrior roster and this one, I've never been a stronger advocate for fit. The Lakers roster just doesn't work because of the pieces they have around Lebron and AD. I'll have to admit I was wrong on Westbrook. I thought he would be able to take some of the load off Lebron and AD and allow them more rest, but I also think the pieces around him don't fit well either. So it makes his inefficiencies highlighted even more.

The Lakers when they were at their best had a bunch of wing defenders and knock down 3 point shooters. This year this roster is absent of both. Caruso, Danny Green, Jared Dudley, KCP, Kuzma, Markieff Morris all provided perfect ancillary pieces to Lebron and AD. They defended at a high level and they were able to space the floor. This year, the Lakers are just lost on both ends.

FIT MATTERS PEOPLE.

 

[tlance]

probably yes- 20 years ago. and certainly 40 years ago. Today- definitely not.

as I said- they used to have 5-6 arrows in their quiver that were advantages. They are down to 1 or 2 now.

that and- if i was a player id be hesitant to give up 13.4% of my salary to state income tax. Especially if I could play in Dallas or Miami and pay 0.0%.

You bring this up every time.

Yet still, have yet to see a single professional athlete make their choice of teams based on state income tax.

 

[dtgold88]

Sooner rather than later as in sooner than most NBA cities.

That is all I meant. Not that it would happen within a few years.

And what they have done is play their home games in the Forum while proving not completely incompetent.

While a franchise like Cleveland needs to do almost everything right, that is all that is required in LA.

Don’t suck.

LA took 7 years to get back to the playoffs and had to be saved by Lebron. also had multiple top 3 picks AND room for another max player
Cavs look like they might get back in year 4 after losing Lebron with awful lottery luck and one top 3 pick.

Being LA should help, but sure hasn't so far when we take out the Lebron factor (which we are for this discussion).

 

[dtgold88]

You bring this up every time.

Yet still, have yet to see a single professional athlete make their choice of teams based on state income tax.

I can agree with this.....well, teams have gone to Miami but likely more for weather and/or to play with their buddies.

But, still, when not Lebron related Lakers have really struggled taking advantage of their situation which is what this discussion is about.

 

[WiggyRuss]

You bring this up every time.

Yet still, have yet to see a single professional athlete make their choice of teams based on state income tax.

I would never say it is the DECIDING factor, but I am sure it is A factor.

the Lakers cant say anymore:

1. we will outspend everyone- its not true anymore

2. we have one of the best owners/gm's in the history of the league- its not true anymore

3. we can make you a huge marketer that Orlando just cant do- its not true anymore

4. we will get you in front of more eyes since no one can see you play in Milwaukee- its not true anymore

they can sell weather, and legacy, and a lot of tax. Which leaves them with some advantage, but a LOT LOT less than it has been in the past.

 

[Shanemansj13]

so true. I love Rubio as a backup PG but gets way more credit than he deserves at times. Like we'd be better with him instead of sexton? Or he's why Garland has continued to improve.

Does Garland learn some things from him? Probably, but he made huge strides last year and were some players who said he'd be an all star before knowing we'd get Rubio. Also like being able to use him at PG instead of Sexton and we'd be Fd if we didn't have him after losing Sexton.

I think Rubio is getting exactly the amount of credit he should. The Cavs didn’t acquire him to score or even be that efficient. He has been a vefy important player off the bench, distributing the wealth and he plays very well with Love and Osman, even Garland. Having another key distributor behind Garland is a huge key, PG’s that can distribute in this league are also very important. Scoring doesn’t seem to be the problem for the Cavs so it’s hard saying this but Rubio is needed is more than Sexton for this current team but it doesn’t mean Sexton won’t be valuable when he comes back. Leadership is another key and I think he does help Garland more for that aspect but also even though Sexton was improving he was more ball dominant.

 

[dtgold88]

He did answer the question. You just didn’t like his answer.

The confidence that @trojanfan12 and I have in the Lakers has nothing at all to do with Pelinka.

Pelinka just has to prove he isn’t a total ass clown and players will look at the Lakers.

Jury is still out on that at the moment.

I guess that's fair. You might have both given an answer that make little to no sense based on today's NBA and who currently runs the Lakers (along with the current CBA).

In a sense, the question kind of is left unanswered as it's what has Pelinka done that's not LeBron related that would give you confidence he could get it done? Titles won by West and others in a completely different NBA wont matter.

 

[Shanemansj13]

right.

They cant lose Sexton and Rubio or they will need to replace at least one of them with a strong player.

Right. I still think the best case is sign Rubio to a 1 and 1 then sign-amd-trade with Sexton but that trade has a lot of factors: who is out there, do they fit the team, salary, etc.

 

[dtgold88]

I think Rubio is getting exactly the amount of credit he should. The Cavs didn’t acquire him to score or even be that efficient. He has been a vefy important player off the bench, distributing the wealth and he plays very well with Love and Osman, even Garland. Having another key distributor behind Garland is a huge key, PG’s that can distribute in this league are also very important. Scoring doesn’t seem to be the problem for the Cavs so it’s hard saying this but Rubio is needed is more than Sexton for this current team but it doesn’t mean Sexton won’t be valuable when he comes back. Leadership is another key and I think he does help Garland more for that aspect but also even though Sexton was improving he was more ball dominant.

Sexton was taking 4-5 less shots per game and his usage was down. Team was 7-4 with him against an incredibly difficult schedule, starting the season with many guys who had never played together and 8 of 11 on road. Do was also getting to the point of where it is now before he was hurt.

garland made huge strides last season and players were calling him a future all star before even knowing Rubio would come. Does Rubio help him? Likely.....but saying it's as much as some seem to imply is lessening Garland's ability IMO.

Teams like we'd need to beat to go far - Jazz and the Bucks - were swarming garland and making it tough on him.....harder to do with another scorer like Sexton. Isn't to say we wont have an exciting season without him and we don't need Rubio as we clearly do (and an extension would be nice, too).

 

[Shanemansj13]

Not saying much but I agree with points Wiggy and TLance have made lol. Both are right to an extent.

In terms of the Lakers, Sushi hit it on the money. AD and Lebron are fine but RW is the move that ruined everything. They had to pick up cheap pieces that didn’t fit. The piece(s) that did fit to an extent were traded or could not be resigned. RW just doesn’t fit but like he said, not all his fault with the pieces around him.

Main point, RW needs to go and if this is possible it would be for a downgrade which is perfectly fine bc it wouldn’t be a downgrade for the Lakers to this point.

 

[Wamu]

Sexton is out for the season. No one else has missed one of their top players for nearly as long

Klay Thompson hasn't played since the '18-'19 season. But yeah, no other team in the league has missed one of their top players longer than the Cavs have missed Sexton.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Not saying much but I agree with points Wiggy and TLance have made lol. Both are right to an extent.

In terms of the Lakers, Sushi hit it on the money. AD and Lebron are fine but RW is the move that ruined everything. They had to pick up cheap pieces that didn’t fit. The piece(s) that did fit to an extent were traded or could not be resigned. RW just doesn’t fit but like he said, not all his fault with the pieces around him.

Main point, RW needs to go and if this is possible it would be for a downgrade which is perfectly fine bc it wouldn’t be a downgrade for the Lakers to this point.

that is a big gamble. To trade RW at a "discount" to get lesser pieces than you traded for him.

It would take a lot of balls and creativity.

So much so, that I would probably hope that RW came around to change his game rather than take that risk because it just looks so bad.

Like I said yesterday- RW plays hard and cares and thats not a bad place to start from. Is there a way to get him to reduce his shot volume, focus more on defensive team concepts, and offensive efficiency? That is a BIG BIG ask, but maybe its not impossible, and maybe its a better gamble than trading RW for less than you just gave up to get him when there are just very little viable options out there.

I do know one thing- it would take some BIG BALLS - some MASSIVE COJONES- to trade RW right now so soon after trading for him.

 

[Hambombs]

lakers are the most horribly fit team ive ever seen

 

[Wamu]

lakers are the most horribly fit team ive ever seen

They look damn good to me this season.

Go Celtics!

 

[Shanemansj13]

that is a big gamble. To trade RW at a "discount" to get lesser pieces than you traded for him.

It would take a lot of balls and creativity.

So much so, that I would probably hope that RW came around to change his game rather than take that risk because it just looks so bad.

Like I said yesterday- RW plays hard and cares and thats not a bad place to start from. Is there a way to get him to reduce his shot volume, focus more on defensive team concepts, and offensive efficiency? That is a BIG BIG ask, but maybe its not impossible, and maybe its a better gamble than trading RW for less than you just gave up to get him when there are just very little viable options out there.

I do know one thing- it would take some BIG BALLS - some MASSIVE COJONES- to trade RW right now so soon after trading for him.

It would be a big gamble but it’s ship or bust. They aren’t winning a championship with RW, I firmly believe that bc it’s extremely difficult to make even small moves to get pieces around him that do fit. Only alternative is trading RW

 

[tlance]

LA took 7 years to get back to the playoffs and had to be saved by Lebron. also had multiple top 3 picks AND room for another max player
Cavs look like they might get back in year 4 after losing Lebron with awful lottery luck and one top 3 pick.

Being LA should help, but sure hasn't so far when we take out the Lebron factor (which we are for this discussion).

Would they have been saved by LeBron if they were any other franchise?

Yes or no?

Pretty clear as to why LeBron went there. And a title soon followed.

You are making my case for me.

 

[dtgold88]

Not saying much but I agree with points Wiggy and TLance have made lol. Both are right to an extent.

In terms of the Lakers, Sushi hit it on the money. AD and Lebron are fine but RW is the move that ruined everything. They had to pick up cheap pieces that didn’t fit. The piece(s) that did fit to an extent were traded or could not be resigned. RW just doesn’t fit but like he said, not all his fault with the pieces around him.

Main point, RW needs to go and if this is possible it would be for a downgrade which is perfectly fine bc it wouldn’t be a downgrade for the Lakers to this point.

That's kind of the point in my comments.....Acquiring Lebron had zero to do with Pelinka. sure, he had to make the deal for AD but if no Lebron there is no AD.

His one big move - as of now - looks like a disaster so what has he done to make anyone believe he could get them back to contender status with no Lebron?

 

[tlance]

I guess that's fair. You might have both given an answer that make little to no sense based on today's NBA and who currently runs the Lakers (along with the current CBA).

In a sense, the question kind of is left unanswered as it's what has Pelinka done that's not LeBron related that would give you confidence he could get it done? Titles won by West and others in a completely different NBA wont matter.

Why are so hung up on Pelinka?

He fails and this core implodes, he won’t have his job too long.

But his successor will still have the glitz and glam that is LA.

 

[dtgold88]

Would they have been saved by LeBron if they were any other franchise?

Yes or no?

Pretty clear as to why LeBron went there. And a title soon followed.

You are making my case for me.

I'm making your case because Lebron has a home and does a ton of offseason work in LA so he chose LA......in a discussion about building WITHOUT Lebron? In addition, no one but Lebron has wanted to come there as a FA in a long time.

Been a while, but ya gotta love this forum.

 

[dtgold88]

Why are so hung up on Pelinka?

He fails and this core implodes, he won’t have his job too long.

But his successor will still have the glitz and glam that is LA.

Yep.....and still a rebuild that Pelinka might have made even more difficult. Pre Pelinka how has the glitz/glam done in convincing guys not named Lebron to come to LA. OK, the Lakers, as PG and Kawhi did choose LA.