Moses gets 5 year extension $$$$$$

[gkekoa]

Nobody has bashed the Moses pick. That is your problem Dean. You don't listen to what is actually said.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Dean, Most of us were/are not bashing moses. He has become a good player (not a star as you claim). What the vast majority of us object to is your incessant claim that this "proves" that Moses is a better player than Murphy and this somehow validates this. Its a stupid comparison and this offers no proof. All this says is that the team valued Moses and awarded him as such. This is no way is a statement on Murphy. Murphy has also been a good player for us (not a star) and was also a good pick.

This is it right here, the entire argument comes down to who has been a better player Murphy or Moses. And at last check Murphy is suspended for PEDs and Moses is getting a big deal and this can't be overlooked.

Moses hasn't been great but he has been solid every year starting with his rookie season. And again he locked down a huge problem position. Murphy was not much of a factor as a rookie, but then again he was a rookie, then average if that as a starter (33 tackles and 3.5 sacks in 16 games), then very good. But of course it could have been illegally aided. So IMO right now if you look objectively at the 2 players' careers to me Dean has scoreboard. But that's a matter of opinion like everything else.

 

[j_y19]

This is it right here, the entire argument comes down to who has been a better player Murphy or Moses. And at last check Murphy is suspended for PEDs and Moses is getting a big deal and this can't be overlooked.

Moses hasn't been great but he has been solid every year starting with his rookie season. And again he locked down a huge problem position. Murphy was not much of a factor as a rookie, but then again he was a rookie, then average if that as a starter (33 tackles and 3.5 sacks in 16 games), then very good. But of course it could have been illegally aided. So IMO right now if you look objectively at the 2 players' careers to me Dean has scoreboard. But that's a matter of opinion like everything else.

Nope. That's not the issue. The issue is Dean's continued position that it is PROVEN that Moses is a better player. How is that proven? Proof requires irrefutable facts. What are those facts? Lets remember, Dean has been on this bandwagon for 3 years. So this recent contract extension is after the fact. What were those facts in their rookie years? In years 2 and 3? The only fact is that Moses and Murphy have both grown, both contributed and both have weaknesses. And now with this contract, it is a fact that the FO sees value in Moses. That doesn't mean they dont see similar, or greater (or less), value in Murphy, it could be that they just haven't come to terms yet. But to claim one "superior" to another is inane.

 

[deanpet21]

Nope. That's not the issue. The issue is Dean's continued position that it is PROVEN that Moses is a better player. How is that proven? Proof requires irrefutable facts. What are those facts? Lets remember, Dean has been on this bandwagon for 3 years. So this recent contract extension is after the fact. What were those facts in their rookie years? In years 2 and 3? The only fact is that Moses and Murphy have both grown, both contributed and both have weaknesses. And now with this contract, it is a fact that the FO sees value in Moses. That doesn't mean they dont see similar, or greater (or less), value in Murphy, it could be that they just haven't come to terms yet. But to claim one "superior" to another is inane.

you are insane to think they value TM like Moses.

 

[j_y19]

you are insane to think they value TM like Moses.

Dean, seriously. Are you an idiot? Where did I say that?

 

[Sharkinva]

This is it right here, the entire argument comes down to who has been a better player Murphy or Moses. And at last check Murphy is suspended for PEDs and Moses is getting a big deal and this can't be overlooked.

Moses hasn't been great but he has been solid every year starting with his rookie season. And again he locked down a huge problem position. Murphy was not much of a factor as a rookie, but then again he was a rookie, then average if that as a starter (33 tackles and 3.5 sacks in 16 games), then very good. But of course it could have been illegally aided. So IMO right now if you look objectively at the 2 players' careers to me Dean has scoreboard. But that's a matter of opinion like everything else.

Moses played in all of three games his rookie season and looked horrid in those three games. Then he went on IR. Murphy has missed one game since he has been here. And started 9 games as a rookie.

But again its not about which player is better. Moses got the big deal, Kudos to him. Dean would have had us forfeit TWO starters and a solid rotational player because he hated the fact that Murphy was picked over Moses.

So i think your Score board might be a bit Skewed, unless you would give up Murphy and Long just to make Dean feel like he was some how right.

 

[skinsdad62]

Dean dean dean sorry I was (and still am ) at work when all this went down . So in deans world being 2nd highest paid means we should break out his HOF bust . Fact , the sainted Moses hasn't made a Pb , isn't in the top 100 player rankings and didnt do squat it ride sherrf 's. Coat tails whoopty damn do. He got an overpay extension and he could be out the door n 2 years .

Now I challenge you to find anything I have written in a post that states I have said TM is. Better player? If you can't find one the just be quiet about it . People bash you because you are 20/20 hindsight boy . When people point out that we picked Moses anyway and still got a good player you can't accept that because you would rather just be right instead of being happy for the team .

You whine for a decade about an obscure draft pick we should have took in 1955(exaggeration ) but the point is you care more about being " vindicated" then anything else

So if you think I owe you some sort of apology then you are high as a Georgia pine

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Nope. That's not the issue. The issue is Dean's continued position that it is PROVEN that Moses is a better player. How is that proven? Proof requires irrefutable facts. What are those facts? Lets remember, Dean has been on this bandwagon for 3 years. So this recent contract extension is after the fact. What were those facts in their rookie years? In years 2 and 3? The only fact is that Moses and Murphy have both grown, both contributed and both have weaknesses. And now with this contract, it is a fact that the FO sees value in Moses. That doesn't mean they dont see similar, or greater (or less), value in Murphy, it could be that they just haven't come to terms yet. But to claim one "superior" to another is inane.

No the argument continues to be who has been the better player. Your issue, along with others, continues to be how Dean makes his argument to back his position as this post clearly shows. But the issue remains who has been more productive and to me it's clearly Moses.

 

[j_y19]

No the argument continues to be who has been the better player. Your issue, along with others, continues to be how Dean makes his argument to back his position as this post clearly shows. But the issue remains who has been more productive and to me it's clearly Moses.

And I have no problem with your opinion or dean's opinion. In fact, many times I actually agree with dean. But it is not a FACT nor has it been PROVEN that Moses is a better player and should have been drafted first as Dean has always maintained.
Dean loses everybody not by his opinions, but how he presents his arguments (as if the are the gospel written in stone) and his constant need for validation YEARS after the fact. He's like a dog with a bone, he won't let go. But he conveniently forgets all of the other predictions that he made that didn't work out. He had a huge hard on for Rambo and argued for weeks we fucked up not taking him earlier in the draft, kinda like the moses argument. Of course he will say that he never took that position. If you want recognition for what you predicted that turns out right, you also need to be prepared to accept you misses.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

And I have no problem with your opinion or dean's opinion. In fact, many times I actually agree with dean. But it is not a FACT nor has it been PROVEN that Moses is a better player and should have been drafted first as Dean has always maintained.
Dean loses everybody not by his opinions, but how he presents his arguments (as if the are the gospel written in stone) and his constant need for validation YEARS after the fact. He's like a dog with a bone, he won't let go. But he conveniently forgets all of the other predictions that he made that didn't work out. He had a huge hard on for Rambo and argued for weeks we fucked up not taking him earlier in the draft, kinda like the moses argument. Of course he will say that he never took that position. If you want recognition for what you predicted that turns out right, you also need to be prepared to accept you misses.

So in other words your problem is with the way Dean delivers his argument, not the argument itself. Kind of what I said.

Whatever, I'll let you guys continue to hammer away at each other while maintaining that right now Dean has scoreboard.

 

[j_y19]

So in other words your problem is with the way Dean delivers his argument, not the argument itself. Kind of what I said.

Whatever, I'll let you guys continue to hammer away at each other while maintaining that right now Dean has scoreboard.

That's fine. And I am sure that Dean will continue to get hammered as he never learns. I have actually begun to believe that he secretly likes the attention.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Yeah as I said in that thread I can certainly see why he gets so much crap around here. Let's not forget I used his quote openly cheering Griffin's injury as my signature when I first started posting here

 

[deanpet21]

Dean, seriously. Are you an idiot? Where did I say that?

your last sentence.

 

[j_y19]

your last sentence.

Well, at least you answered my first question.

 

[Sharkinva]

So in other words your problem is with the way Dean delivers his argument, not the argument itself. Kind of what I said.

Whatever, I'll let you guys continue to hammer away at each other while maintaining that right now Dean has scoreboard.

My problem is with Deans flawed logic. Better player is how he tries to justify that we some how made a mistake in drafting Murphy and Long at ALL. He omits that had we done what he wanted, and simply drafted Moses in the second instead of trading down, we likely would not have gotten either Long (our now starting Center) Or Murphy ( the guy who had the second most sacks on the team last year).

So which of these players would you have sacrificed just to make Dean feel like he was smarter than every NFL GM?? Because while Dean wants to twist it and say, well its obvious Moses is the better player, the reality is, it is NOT about the better player but about when Moses was picked that he is constantly moaning about.

Add in the little snide comments where he is all but HOPING the players we did draft some how fail in order to prove that he was right, and you have the crux of the debate.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Clearly Moses has outperformed his draft spot. So what if Moses had been taken by another team? Looking back that should have happened. Then you have a RT getting a second big deal as a solid starter for someone else while we try to justify why Long and Murphy are better players. They are not better players. So the point remains there is a solid argument that Morgan Moses is the best player of the three, and the most important in terms of solidifying a problem positon. Therefore Dean was correct, he should have been drafted before them.

 

[Sharkinva]

Clearly Moses has outperformed his draft spot. So what if Moses had been taken by another team? Looking back that should have happened. Then you have a RT getting a second big deal as a solid starter for someone else while we try to justify why Long and Murphy are better players. They are not better players. So the point remains there is a solid argument that Morgan Moses is the best player of the three, and the most important in terms of solidifying a problem positon. Therefore Dean was correct, he should have been drafted before them.

Come on man, thats like saying looking back Tom Brady should have been the #1 over all pick and some team should have needed to trade UP just to get him. 32 teams figured Moses was worth no more than a 3rd rounder. Has he outperformed being picked in the 3rd round?? Depends on what metrics you look at. Based on the contract he got, some one thinks he has.

But to say that the team would have been better off not drafting Murphy and likely Long as well in order to make Dean right?? Sorry, but thats a stretch.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Come on man, thats like saying looking back Tom Brady should have been the #1 over all pick and some team should have needed to trade UP just to get him. 32 teams figured Moses was worth no more than a 3rd rounder. Has he outperformed being picked in the 3rd round?? Depends on what metrics you look at. Based on the contract he got, some one thinks he has.

But to say that the team would have been better off not drafting Murphy and likely Long as well in order to make Dean right?? Sorry, but thats a stretch.

You are not listening and frankly I'm trying to get out of this argument.

Dean said it was a mistake to take Murphy earlier than they selected Moses.

Moses to date has outperformed both Murphy and Long in many people's opinion. Getting a solid starting RT in the middle of round three is outperforming your draft position, period.

Therefore Dean's original opinion that Moses should have been selected ahead of Murphy and that he has played better than both Murphy and Long appears to be spot on. This isn't revisionist history as your Tom Brady example implies, this was his position before any of these players were drafted.

 

[deanpet21]

Well, at least you answered my first question.

go screw your self. you are the biggest two face on here. spin this topic however you like. you are wrong.

 

[deanpet21]

Dean dean dean sorry I was (and still am ) at work when all this went down . So in deans world being 2nd highest paid means we should break out his HOF bust . Fact , the sainted Moses hasn't made a Pb , isn't in the top 100 player rankings and didnt do squat it ride sherrf 's. Coat tails whoopty damn do. He got an overpay extension and he could be out the door n 2 years .

Now I challenge you to find anything I have written in a post that states I have said TM is. Better player? If you can't find one the just be quiet about it . People bash you because you are 20/20 hindsight boy . When people point out that we picked Moses anyway and still got a good player you can't accept that because you would rather just be right instead of being happy for the team .

You whine for a decade about an obscure draft pick we should have took in 1955(exaggeration ) but the point is you care more about being " vindicated" then anything else

So if you think I owe you some sort of apology then you are high as a Georgia pine

I owe nothing. Countless messages of messages again Moses. You the fool not me.