Overall Career or at their peak?
Career:
Mo
Smith
Hoffman
Fingers
Franco
Eckersley
Reardon
Wagner
Nathan
Papelbon
Peak:
Eckersley
Mo
Gagne
Kimbrel
Mesa
KRod
Fingers
Quisenberry
Montgomery
Smoltz
you dont have Wagner in peak? Oh, cuz his peak was his career, gotcha!
He should be much higher than that.
Overall Career or at their peak?
Career:
Mo
Smith
Hoffman
Fingers
Franco
Eckersley
Reardon
Wagner
Nathan
Papelbon
Peak:
Eckersley
Mo
Gagne
Kimbrel
Mesa
KRod
Fingers
Quisenberry
Montgomery
Smoltz
For peak, I think there's a good amount of non-listed guys I'd put over Mesa and maybe K-Rod (who saved a lot of games, but was very shaky)...Nathan, Papelbon, Lidge, Hoffman, Wetteland, Foulke, Nen.
Milky never saw him play.....Interesting opinion.
Milky never saw him play.....
Milk, saying Eck wasn't a top 10 closer is absurd. It's like saying Earl Campbell wasn't an all time great running back. At some point, you have to quit looking in a stat book and simply watch a game.No, but why does that matter?? He only had 2 Great closer seasons, if we are separating Peak players with career players then how can he be in career??
Milk, saying Eck wasn't a top 10 closer is absurd. It's like saying Earl Campbell wasn't an all time great running back. At some point, you have to quit looking in a stat book and simply watch a game.
Milk, go find the written opinion of the players he played against, managers he played against, GM's, scouts, whoever you want, the consensus will always be that Eck wasn't just top 5, usually top 3, and if not for Mo, might be considered the GOAT. Not sure how you can contradict thatDidn't say he wasn't a top 10 reliever... On the first page Nos, did not mention RP like Hoyt wilhelm, because he was not a "closer"... so then we are to assume that this whole thread is only for closers, and not for RP... then when we started differentiating between peak and career, how can you include a pitcher whose career as closer was ONLY his peak and only 4 seasons, with ONLY 2 great ones...
1. Mo
2. Eck
3. Hoffman
Debatable after that for me. I'd put Kimbrel 4th and maybe KRod 5th.
I think my top 4 is etched in. The more I think about KRod, the more Im slipping on him. I believe the Brewers used him as a set up guy in the 8th and he was really good but thats a downgrade from closer. Hoffman is closer to 2 than having anyone beat him. I think people lose track of how good his career was.I gotta put Wagner in there somewhere, I like Hoffman but I think i'd take Wagner over him and I know i'd take Wagner over KRod. I also don't think Henke gets enough love...
Milk, go find the written opinion of the players he played against, managers he played against, GM's, scouts, whoever you want, the consensus will always be that Eck wasn't just top 5, usually top 3, and if not for Mo, might be considered the GOAT. Not sure how you can contradict that
Man I get what you are saying, here's what I know...you take all the guys that have ever closed a game, pick the best team you could, Eck is one of the top 5 guys you're looking at as closerAgain, you are misunderstanding my argument... If we are differentiating Peak and career, then how can you put Eck on the career list... We are not talking about who you would WANT more, it is who had the better "CLOSER" career... Nos made a point of it right away that the likes of Hoyt Wilhelm should not be listed because he was not a closer, Eckersley was only a "closer" for 9 seasons and had a 5 season peak... outside those 5 seasons he was either a SP or just not a good closer...
If we are differentiating career with peak, how does that make him top 10?? and you guys have him top 3...
Now, if you are only making one list, then fine, but if you are making a career and a peak list then he should not be in the career list... And realize, i originally made the comment during the whole peak season conversation....