Too early to talk about draft

[Anointed One]

These aren't the only 2 choices. The Hawks looked like the surprise of the league for half the season, then faded a bit down the stretch mostly due to poor defense. They have enough young talent to believe they will compete for a playoff spot again next year. The 2022 draft class may end up being top 3 in franchise history.

No team except the SB winner wants a repeat of the previous season. Pointless question.

Yes. If Rex Grossman and Trent Dilfer can, so can Geno Smith. Will he? Well, that depends on a lot of non-Geno factors, most importantly what the team does to improve the defense. But only 2 teams play in the SB each year, so it's unlikely that any given QB will lead their team to it. Aaron Rodgers has been to 1 in his entire career, and it was 12 years ago.

T. Eason, J Hostetler, B. Johnson, Jimmy G, R. Gannon, Nick Foles, T. Dilfer, J. McMahon, J. Namath, C. Kaepernick, J. Flacco, D. Williams, J. Plunkett, J. Goff, R. Grossman, M. Hasselback, K. Collins, C. Chandler, S. Humphries, N. O'Donnell, D. Woodley, etc...

None of these QB's were all pro QB's... But, what these QB's had in common was the fact that they were backed, for the most part with great defenses and very good running games... Beefing up our defense, while focusing on the run would definitely put us in position to allow Geno and the Hawks to a SB appearance...

 

[flyerhawk]

T. Eason, J Hostetler, B. Johnson, Jimmy G, R. Gannon, Nick Foles, T. Dilfer, J. McMahon, J. Namath, C. Kaepernick, J. Flacco, D. Williams, J. Plunkett, J. Goff, R. Grossman, M. Hasselback, K. Collins, C. Chandler, S. Humphries, N. O'Donnell, D. Woodley, etc...

None of these QB's were all pro QB's... But, what these QB's had in common was the fact that they were backed, for the most part with great defenses and very good running games... Beefing up our defense, while focusing on the run would definitely put us in position to allow Geno and the Hawks to a SB appearance...

Exactly. The chances that PC/JS can rebuild the defense to a championship level and this offense could do enough to win a SB are considerably higher, IMO, than drafting an elite QB to carry an average defense to a Super Bowl.

 

[Screamin12th]

I see a lot of people also forgetting that We have Tyler Lockett, THE MOST UNDERRATED WR in the NFL and DK Metcalf. These two WR can make a lot of QB's look good. Just like Rice, Baldwin made Wilson look outstanding then it continued with Baldwin and Lockett then DK and Lockett. Lockett catches almost everything thrown his way. What has he had 2 drops in the past 5 years? lol.

Geno still turns the ball over to much and even though the Defense was bad they had middle of the road type games that offensive TO caused them to lose.

You want to build around the Defense thats great, we know that works but then you need a QB that turns the ball over less than 8 times a year. This team just needs to work on the Defense and find a game manager that the coaches can real in so they are not throwing 10+ INT's and fumbling 3+ times a season because turnovers are the biggest way to kill your chances at a win. We lost 3 games at least this year because of them.

 

[flyerhawk]

I see a lot of people also forgetting that We have Tyler Lockett, THE MOST UNDERRATED WR in the NFL and DK Metcalf. These two WR can make a lot of QB's look good. Just like Rice, Baldwin made Wilson look outstanding then it continued with Baldwin and Lockett then DK and Lockett. Lockett catches almost everything thrown his way. What has he had 2 drops in the past 5 years? lol.

There is no question that having 2 very good receivers, and a cadre of pass catching TEs, helped Geno last year. But there are two things that can derail a QB more than anything. Poor accuracy and poor decisionmaking. You can limit the latter by keeping the QB on schedule and limiting his exposure to bad decision making situations. The latter, otoh, is just not something you can fix.

Geno, for whatever his flaws, is a an accurate passer. He really always has been. Decision making has always been more of a problem. IMO, Pete and Shane did a good job keeping him in situations where he didn't need to make bad decisions. Except when the defense was getting trucked and forced Geno into higher risk situations.

 

[blstoker]

These aren't the only 2 choices. The Hawks looked like the surprise of the league for half the season, then faded a bit down the stretch mostly due to poor defense.

Defense was great to finish out the regular season. They gave up 20 points and 312 yards per game over the final 6 games. I know the defense has some improvement to do this offseason, but the defense was just as much to credit for the team being in the playoffs as the offense was. Hell, they held the #1 offense in the NFL to their lowest yards of the season. Just because SF was able to exploit the defense during the playoff game doesn't mean that the Hawks aren't there without the defense playing lights out the last 2 games (It was actually 3, but since the offense couldn't take advantage of a great defensive game against KC they only won the last 2).

 

[flyerhawk]

Defense was great to finish out the regular season. They gave up 20 points and 312 yards per game over the final 6 games. I know the defense has some improvement to do this offseason, but the defense was just as much to credit for the team being in the playoffs as the offense was. Hell, they held the #1 offense in the NFL to their lowest yards of the season. Just because SF was able to exploit the defense during the playoff game doesn't mean that the Hawks aren't there without the defense playing lights out the last 2 games (It was actually 3, but since the offense couldn't take advantage of a great defensive game against KC they only won the last 2).

They played well against the Niners. They gave up 170+ yards rushing in 3 of those last 6 games. In another game they gave up 146 yards. To the Rams.

Our pass defense was actually better than perhaps people would realize. But our run defense was pretty much trash all year. The fewest rushing yards we gave up all year was 75. To a broken Jets offense.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

T. Eason, J Hostetler, B. Johnson, Jimmy G, R. Gannon, Nick Foles, T. Dilfer, J. McMahon, J. Namath, C. Kaepernick, J. Flacco, D. Williams, J. Plunkett, J. Goff, R. Grossman, M. Hasselback, K. Collins, C. Chandler, S. Humphries, N. O'Donnell, D. Woodley, etc...

None of these QB's were all pro QB's... But, what these QB's had in common was the fact that they were backed, for the most part with great defenses and very good running games... Beefing up our defense, while focusing on the run would definitely put us in position to allow Geno and the Hawks to a SB appearance...

You go clear back to Joe Namath LOL. How many off those were going on 33 years of age while playing well? I'm amazed at recency bias swaying everyone over a decade track record. Tell me @Anointed One what were your thoughts on Geno at this time last year, you had years and years of track record to judge him on. How many QBs bloomed at 32 and many sustained that longer than a season? If Geno goes back to vintage Geno how do the Seahawks recover having gave him a jackpot of money. Where do they turn if they don't have a promising rookie in waiting and having committed serious money to Geno? I know you don't care for any of the QBs in this draft, but did you think Herbert would be good? How about Mahomes or Allen? How about we go back clear to Rodgers, did you think he would be good? How often did you nail a elite QB before they were drafted?
What I'm sure of is Geno won't repeat 2022 season, won't come close. If the Seahawks do what others here are suggesting-- committing to him $$$$ and punting at QB in the draft it will be the second biggest mistake in Pete and John time with the Seahawks, only surpass by the whole Jamal Adams decisions. I get depressed just thinking about it.

 

[flyerhawk]

You go clear back to Joe Namath LOL. How many off those were going on 33 years of age while playing well? I'm amazed at recency bias swaying everyone over a decade track record. Tell me @Anointed One what were your thoughts on Geno at this time last year, you had years and years of track record to judge him on. How many QBs bloomed at 32 and many sustained that longer than a season? If Geno goes back to vintage Geno how do the Seahawks recover having gave him a jackpot of money. Where do they turn if they don't have a promising rookie in waiting and having committed serious money to Geno? I know you don't care for any of the QBs in this draft, but did you think Herbert would be good? How about Mahomes or Allen? How about we go back clear to Rodgers, did you think he would be good? How often did you nail a elite QB before they were drafted?
What I'm sure of is Geno won't repeat 2022 season, won't come close. If the Seahawks do what others here are suggesting-- committing to him $$$$ and punting at QB in the draft it will be the second biggest mistake in Pete and John time with the Seahawks, only surpass by the whole Jamal Adams decisions. I get depressed just thinking about it.

Which QB do you think the Seahawks should go for? Are you just going to ignore this question?


Geno had a very poor start to his career for various reasons. He never got a chance to be a starter. He spent time improving his game.


38 QBs drafted in the first round since 2010. 4 have made he Super Bowl.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Which QB do you think the Seahawks should go for? Are you just going to ignore this question?


Geno had a very poor start to his career for various reasons. He never got a chance to be a starter. He spent time improving his game.


38 QBs drafted in the first round since 2010. 4 have made he Super Bowl.

I'll trust Pete and John to make that decision. So many to scout . The draft guru's have some tiers I feel.

Tier 1) Young, Stroug, Levis
Tier 2) Richardson, McKee, Hooker
Tier 3) Duggan Haener
Tier 4) mostly I don't know about but McCall maybe? I'm sure we will hear some names as the draft gets closer

Just for better odds I rather they go tier 1, the later they wait the longer the odds of hitting. Mostly I just want them to draft a QB they feel can be potentially the QB of the future.

 

[Screamin12th]

Atl, Won their game against us because Geno threw a pick at their 18 yard line with 1 minute 30 seconds to go in the game trailing 23-27.
Buc, Hawks lost because Geno and the offense couldn't do diddly shit. Bucs only scored 21 points.
LV Geno fumbles the ball at the raiders 23 yard line in a tie game in regulation. Hawks eventually lose in over time.
Panthers, Genos 2 turnovers turned into 10 points for the Panthers in a 6 point loss.
KC, Hawks Defense holds KC under 300 yards and Geno struggles to do anything.

All these games were winnable just by having a better decision maker Behind center and someone that understands the situation and protecting the ball.

Also lets not kid ourselves also as I know you all saw this one thing from Geno repeatedly after HE made mistakes, He would complain to someone ( WR/RB/TE ) like they did something wrong.

Geno is not a leader of men but has a talented arm. Always has had a talented arm but it's his decision making and turn overs that have haunted him and still do. Thankfully a very talented offense and good coaching was able to mask a lot of it but thats living on a very sharp double edged sword. What we saw from Geno in 2022 is the best you will ever see from him.

 

[blstoker]

They played well against the Niners. They gave up 170+ yards rushing in 3 of those last 6 games. In another game they gave up 146 yards. To the Rams.

Our pass defense was actually better than perhaps people would realize. But our run defense was pretty much trash all year. The fewest rushing yards we gave up all year was 75. To a broken Jets offense.

DId they or did they not give up 20 points and 312 yards per game over that stretch?

Yeah, the run defense had issues, but even the numbers you show are actually more damning of the offense IMO than the defense.

SF, barely had 100 yards before a garbage time long run that inflated their final numbers and were completely meaningless in the end. Offense not only did jack crap all game - but they gifted SF a touchdown on a fumble that was returned to the 6. Geno appeared terrified to go downfield most of the game (4.3 air yards per completion) and Kenneth Walker making a huge play to set up the only TD is all that made the score even seem close. Despite the defense holding the #6 offense to 21 (14) points, the game never really seemed all that close.

The Rams always scheme well against Pete and that first matchup had 68 yards rushing from WRs. Despite having the lead for most of the game, Seattle still threw the ball nearly 70% of the time which led to 2 turnovers and kept the game close enough that the Rams weren't forced to make Wofford throw the ball to keep in it. 438 yards of offense and a positive TOP and still required a last minute TD to win a game against a 3-9 team that the defense held their offense to just 319 yards.

Hell, despite that 146 in the second Rams game the Seahawks had nearly 200 of their own, handily won TOP, outgained the Rams by 160 and still needed a big play by the defense in overtime to put the game away. Couldn't put upmore than 16 points in regulation against the Rams with the playoffs on the line. The offense even gifted the Rams 3 points to start the game.

Even the horrible Carolina game had the running game fairly well handled going into the 4th despite giving up a 26 yard scramble to Darnold. If the offense would've shown more consistency instead of giving the Panthers 10 points and really only showing up in the last 2 minutes of each half, maybe the defense isn't put in a position where they face nearly 20 run plays in the 4th quarter after holding the Panther running baks to just 3.3 yards per carry through the first 3 quarters (27 carries)

So, yeah, the defense had issues against the run, and the offense had issues too. Offense turned the ball over in 17 of 18 games this season. Geno not only faded down the stretch, he did so at the time where the defense was actually putting up top 10 defense numbers. If they steal that game against the Chiefs, then they play Minnesota instead of SF in the playoffs and that could've made a huge difference. At the very least it would've made up for losing to a team they should've beat because the defense really did shit the bed (i.e. the Raiders, Buccs, Saints)

BTW the run defense's best game was against the Chargers when they gave up 53 yards in a 37-23 win.

 

[flyerhawk]

I'll trust Pete and John to make that decision. So many to scout . The draft guru's have some tiers I feel.

Tier 1) Young, Stroug, Levis
Tier 2) Richardson, McKee, Hooker
Tier 3) Duggan Haener
Tier 4) mostly I don't know about but McCall maybe? I'm sure we will hear some names as the draft gets closer

Just for better odds I rather they go tier 1, the later they wait the longer the odds of hitting. Mostly I just want them to draft a QB they feel can be potentially the QB of the future.

You say that you trust Pete and John to make that decision but you ALSO think it would be a huge mistake NOT to draft a QB. What if they don't think any QB is really worth drafting?

 

[flyerhawk]

Atl, Won their game against us because Geno threw a pick at their 18 yard line with 1 minute 30 seconds to go in the game trailing 23-27.
Buc, Hawks lost because Geno and the offense couldn't do diddly shit. Bucs only scored 21 points.
LV Geno fumbles the ball at the raiders 23 yard line in a tie game in regulation. Hawks eventually lose in over time.
Panthers, Genos 2 turnovers turned into 10 points for the Panthers in a 6 point loss.
KC, Hawks Defense holds KC under 300 yards and Geno struggles to do anything.

All these games were winnable just by having a better decision maker Behind center and someone that understands the situation and protecting the ball.

Also lets not kid ourselves also as I know you all saw this one thing from Geno repeatedly after HE made mistakes, He would complain to someone ( WR/RB/TE ) like they did something wrong.

Geno is not a leader of men but has a talented arm. Always has had a talented arm but it's his decision making and turn overs that have haunted him and still do. Thankfully a very talented offense and good coaching was able to mask a lot of it but thats living on a very sharp double edged sword. What we saw from Geno in 2022 is the best you will ever see from him.

Atlanta had 550 yards of offense.
The Bucs, once of the worst rushing teams in football, had 161 yards rushing
The Raiders had TWO AND EIGHTY yards rushing.
The Panthers had 223 yards rushing

You're right though. If we had a QB that didn't ever turn the ball over, we would be a much better team.


NO ONE is arguing that Geno Smith is an elite QB. But what he's a guy who came in and did his job fairly competently. If someone has a plan to get equal or superior play from a different QB for less money I'm all ears. If that plan is close our eyes and pray then no thank you.

 

[flyerhawk]

DId they or did they not give up 20 points and 312 yards per game over that stretch?

Yeah, the run defense had issues, but even the numbers you show are actually more damning of the offense IMO than the defense.

SF, barely had 100 yards before a garbage time long run that inflated their final numbers and were completely meaningless in the end. Offense not only did jack crap all game - but they gifted SF a touchdown on a fumble that was returned to the 6. Geno appeared terrified to go downfield most of the game (4.3 air yards per completion) and Kenneth Walker making a huge play to set up the only TD is all that made the score even seem close. Despite the defense holding the #6 offense to 21 (14) points, the game never really seemed all that close.

The Rams always scheme well against Pete and that first matchup had 68 yards rushing from WRs. Despite having the lead for most of the game, Seattle still threw the ball nearly 70% of the time which led to 2 turnovers and kept the game close enough that the Rams weren't forced to make Wofford throw the ball to keep in it. 438 yards of offense and a positive TOP and still required a last minute TD to win a game against a 3-9 team that the defense held their offense to just 319 yards.

Hell, despite that 146 in the second Rams game the Seahawks had nearly 200 of their own, handily won TOP, outgained the Rams by 160 and still needed a big play by the defense in overtime to put the game away. Couldn't put upmore than 16 points in regulation against the Rams with the playoffs on the line. The offense even gifted the Rams 3 points to start the game.

Even the horrible Carolina game had the running game fairly well handled going into the 4th despite giving up a 26 yard scramble to Darnold. If the offense would've shown more consistency instead of giving the Panthers 10 points and really only showing up in the last 2 minutes of each half, maybe the defense isn't put in a position where they face nearly 20 run plays in the 4th quarter after holding the Panther running baks to just 3.3 yards per carry through the first 3 quarters (27 carries)

So, yeah, the defense had issues against the run, and the offense had issues too. Offense turned the ball over in 17 of 18 games this season. Geno not only faded down the stretch, he did so at the time where the defense was actually putting up top 10 defense numbers. If they steal that game against the Chiefs, then they play Minnesota instead of SF in the playoffs and that could've made a huge difference. At the very least it would've made up for losing to a team they should've beat because the defense really did shit the bed (i.e. the Raiders, Buccs, Saints)

BTW the run defense's best game was against the Chargers when they gave up 53 yards in a 37-23 win.

I honestly don't know what to say about this. The defense was NEVER top 10 in any real sense. They had a nice game against the Chiefs. I actually thought their best run was when they played the Cardinals, Chargers, Giants, and Cardinals again. They actually played pretty well and kept the other team in check.

When a defense gives up a 150 yards rushing it often can make the stats a little deceiving. Because those teams don't have to throw the ball as much so the total yards, and the score itself, will look nominally lower.

The team's offense puttering out in the 2nd half of the season has been a trend of the team for 4 or so seasons. Not sure why.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

You say that you trust Pete and John to make that decision but you ALSO think it would be a huge mistake NOT to draft a QB. What if they don't think any QB is really worth drafting?

Before trading RW what you think the odds are that the Seahawks were scouting QBs in college and felt they could draft a replacement? They were not banking on Geno otherwise the contact would of been for multiple years rather than a cheap one year deal to get them to this draft.

 

[flyerhawk]

Before trading RW what you think the odds are that the Seahawks were scouting QBs in college and felt they could draft a replacement? They were not banking on Geno otherwise the contact would of been for multiple years rather than a cheap one year deal to get them to this draft.

I think that they scout quarterbacks EVERY year. Which is why they looked to move up to get Mahomes. Which is whey they looked to trade up to get Josh Allen.

Of course they weren't going to give Geno a multi-year contract last year. Now you are just engaging in silly arguments.

Seems like you only trust them if they draft a QB with their 1st pick.

 

[MrS]

DId they or did they not give up 20 points and 312 yards per game over that stretch?

Yeah, the run defense had issues, but even the numbers you show are actually more damning of the offense IMO than the defense.

SF, barely had 100 yards before a garbage time long run that inflated their final numbers and were completely meaningless in the end. Offense not only did jack crap all game - but they gifted SF a touchdown on a fumble that was returned to the 6. Geno appeared terrified to go downfield most of the game (4.3 air yards per completion) and Kenneth Walker making a huge play to set up the only TD is all that made the score even seem close. Despite the defense holding the #6 offense to 21 (14) points, the game never really seemed all that close.

The Rams always scheme well against Pete and that first matchup had 68 yards rushing from WRs. Despite having the lead for most of the game, Seattle still threw the ball nearly 70% of the time which led to 2 turnovers and kept the game close enough that the Rams weren't forced to make Wofford throw the ball to keep in it. 438 yards of offense and a positive TOP and still required a last minute TD to win a game against a 3-9 team that the defense held their offense to just 319 yards.

Hell, despite that 146 in the second Rams game the Seahawks had nearly 200 of their own, handily won TOP, outgained the Rams by 160 and still needed a big play by the defense in overtime to put the game away. Couldn't put upmore than 16 points in regulation against the Rams with the playoffs on the line. The offense even gifted the Rams 3 points to start the game.

Even the horrible Carolina game had the running game fairly well handled going into the 4th despite giving up a 26 yard scramble to Darnold. If the offense would've shown more consistency instead of giving the Panthers 10 points and really only showing up in the last 2 minutes of each half, maybe the defense isn't put in a position where they face nearly 20 run plays in the 4th quarter after holding the Panther running baks to just 3.3 yards per carry through the first 3 quarters (27 carries)

So, yeah, the defense had issues against the run, and the offense had issues too. Offense turned the ball over in 17 of 18 games this season. Geno not only faded down the stretch, he did so at the time where the defense was actually putting up top 10 defense numbers. If they steal that game against the Chiefs, then they play Minnesota instead of SF in the playoffs and that could've made a huge difference. At the very least it would've made up for losing to a team they should've beat because the defense really did shit the bed (i.e. the Raiders, Buccs, Saints)

BTW the run defense's best game was against the Chargers when they gave up 53 yards in a 37-23 win.

come on man, you are basically saying

"DONT BELIEVE YOUR LYING EYES!!!!!!!!"

I'll trust Pete and John to make that decision. So many to scout . The draft guru's have some tiers I feel.

Tier 1) Young, Stroug, Levis
Tier 2) Richardson, McKee, Hooker
Tier 3) Duggan Haener
Tier 4) mostly I don't know about but McCall maybe? I'm sure we will hear some names as the draft gets closer

Just for better odds I rather they go tier 1, the later they wait the longer the odds of hitting. Mostly I just want them to draft a QB they feel can be potentially the QB of the future.

so if the top three are gone by 5, then what?

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Seems like you only trust them if they draft a QB with their 1st pick.

I'm dead set against putting all the eggs in Geno basket as some here suggest we do. That's just crazy talk IMO.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

so if the top three are gone by 5, then what?

Then if they still like a QB or two they have to figure out at what point they need to pull the trigger and draft him.

 

[blstoker]

come on man, you are basically saying

"DONT BELIEVE YOUR LYING EYES!!!!!!!!"

Don't know where you get that. Defense played well at times this year - doesn't change the fact that I would rather invest in making the defense better than blowing our load on a 3/4 year wonder at QB.