Judge Recommends Suspension of 6 Games for Deshaun Watson

[UnrealTerm04]

I do think that regardless of the length of his suspension, he has to rebuild his image which is going to be hard.

 

[futballiscool]

That’s not what you said. You said no priors and no criminal conviction

We're talking about personal conduct off the field vs gambling that has on the field ramifications and directly effects the integrity of the game.

Those two things aren't comparable

 

[broncosmitty]

I'm not sure why you keep comparing Deshaun Watson to Roger Ailes. The sports world works on a different plane.

Its always been that way

I'm certainly not excusing his actions, but it's clear based on every bit of evidence and testimony what he did do was more in line wirh creepy/weirdo behavior than sexual predator.

Else he would be behind bars.

Nah, he got women alone with him, under false pretenses. Repeatedly.

He’s a sexual predator.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Can't break the rules to do it, though. If Robinson can only consider the four cases presented, the punishment is pretty much capped at 12 games. NFL conduct policy doesn't seem well thought out.

The rest of society is not obliged to follow the NFL's lead. Watson playing on TV is not going to go over well.

(I think Big Ben and the Steelers would have a tougher time today than they did 12 years ago.)

I don't think the punishment is capped at all. There isn't another case like this ever in the NFL, dozen of women involved and filed suit, before the NFL ( which like all huge entities move at a glacier pace) was able to hear Watson case. Watson even continued after suits were filed. Having a suit for sexual harassment filed should be all the warning needed to change your behavior. Goodell can change the suspension to indefinitely and he won't be breaking any rules because the rule per CBA give him this option.
Also as stated earlier it's about precedent. Watson a serial abuser with 2 dozen suits that he had to settle. The punishment needs to reflect the sheer magnitude of a serial abuser.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I'm not sure why you keep comparing Deshaun Watson to Roger Ailes. The sports world works on a different plane.

Its always been that way

I'm certainly not excusing his actions, but it's clear based on every bit of evidence and testimony what he did do was more in line wirh creepy/weirdo behavior than sexual predator.

Else he would be behind bars.

IMO it's quiet similar to Ailes actions. Neither used physical force, they both used their stature of being VIP to coerce sex from those who weren't in a position to complain. I do get that some feel sports star are entitled to get by with things that lesser beings go to jail for, same in the business world.
Time to put a stop to that.

 

[wilwhite]

I don't think the punishment is capped at all. There isn't another case like this ever in the NFL, dozen of women involved and filed suit, before the NFL ( which like all huge entities move at a glacier pace) was able to hear Watson case. Watson even continued after suits were filed. Having a suit for sexual harassment filed should be all the warning needed to change your behavior. Goodell can change the suspension to indefinitely and he won't be breaking any rules because the rule per CBA give him this option.
Also as stated earlier it's about precedent. Watson a serial abuser with 2 dozen suits that he had to settle. The punishment needs to reflect the sheer magnitude of a serial abuser.

Unfortunately it wasn't dozens that were presented to Robinson. It was four.

From Robinson's ruling:

It is not disputed by the parties here that it is the NFL’s burden to establish by a preponderance of the evidence that a player engaged in the alleged prohibited conduct, and that the NFL must rely on “credible evidence” found in the record in order to carry its burden of proof.​

---​

It is important to note at the outset that, serving as the jointly-appointed Disciplinary Officer, my decision is limited by the record presented to me.​

--​

Of these 24 complainants, the NFL investigators were only able to interview 12; of those 12, the NFL relied for its conclusions on the testimony of 4 therapists...​

The NFL could base an appeal on what comes after that ellipsis: "...as well as interviews of some 37 other third parties and substantial documentary evidence." If those other interviews and evidence show victims beyond the four therapists.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Unfortunately it wasn't dozens that were presented to Robinson. It was four.

From Robinson's ruling:

It is not disputed by the parties here that it is the NFL’s burden to establish by a preponderance of the evidence that a player engaged in the alleged prohibited conduct, and that the NFL must rely on “credible evidence” found in the record in order to carry its burden of proof.​

---​

It is important to note at the outset that, serving as the jointly-appointed Disciplinary Officer, my decision is limited by the record presented to me.​

--​

Of these 24 complainants, the NFL investigators were only able to interview 12; of those 12, the NFL relied for its conclusions on the testimony of 4 therapists...​

The NFL could base an appeal on what comes after that ellipsis: "...as well as interviews of some 37 other third parties and substantial documentary evidence." If those other interviews and evidence show victims beyond the four therapists.

Goodell is not capped when/ if deciding to change the punishment.

 

[DJ]

 

[Stakesarehigh]

IMO it's quiet similar to Ailes actions. Neither used physical force, they both used their stature of being VIP to coerce sex from those who weren't in a position to complain. I do get that some feel sports star are entitled to get by with things that lesser beings go to jail for, same in the business world.
Time to put a stop to that.

I don't think they're entitled to anything. I just think we are comparing the head of entire news station to someone who plays qb. Ailes used his position to sleep with employees. That's an extra layer of authority for starters.

But as I've said a hundred times now Watson is a creep. But im not entirely sure how you plan to completely prevent men using their celebrity to sleep with women or proposition women in strange ways.

No doubt the massage therapist route was a terrible plan.

 

[broncosmitty]

I don't think they're entitled to anything. I just think we are comparing the head of entire news station to someone who plays qb. Ailes used his position to sleep with employees. That's an extra layer of authority for starters.

But as I've said a hundred times now Watson is a creep. But im not entirely sure how you plan to completely prevent men using their celebrity to sleep with women or proposition women in strange ways.

No doubt the massage therapist route was a terrible plan.

Fuck over dudes who surprise working women with the fact they’re now a hooker.

Make examples of them to future creeps.

Roger can just put him on the exempt list until he decides to start the clock on the suspension. Which is what I’d like to see.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Fuck over dudes who surprise working women with the fact they’re now a hooker.

Make examples of them to future creeps.

Roger can just put him on the exempt list until he decides to start the clock on the suspension. Which is what I’d like to see.

You can't rewrite the collective bargaining agreement on the fly. If the NFL was this concerned about their perception to women they should have handled Kraft and Snyder much better.

The latter was promoting the most hostile work environment possible for women. Had they set the tone there they'd be arguing from a position of strength. The former frequented actual sex slaves. I mean...yikes.

Which is why I don't think Roger will do anything here. He can fire Sue Robinson from future cases I'd suspect. That's his save face. And address this issue in the next round of negotiations. Because if he pushes this he better be prepared to open a whole can of worms.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

You can't rewrite the collective bargaining agreement on the fly. If the NFL was this concerned about their perception to women they should have handled Kraft and Snyder much better.

The latter was promoting the most hostile work environment possible for women. Had they set the tone there they'd be arguing from a position of strength. The former frequented actual sex slaves. I mean...yikes.

Which is why I don't think Roger will do anything here. He can fire Sue Robinson from future cases I'd suspect. That's his save face. And address this issue in the next round of negotiations. Because if he pushes this he better be prepared to open a whole can of worms.

No doubt Snyder is a problem for the league, not sure Kraft is. Never the less those that actually own teams fall under different set of consequences and have to be handled differently. Snyder will have to be dealt with, but owners and players are not apples to apples no matter if the league claims they are held to a higher standard. No body is saying rewrite the CBA, in fact all I want is the NFL to apply what is their right under the CBA and impose the penalty we all know Watson deserves. INDEFINITE SUSPENSION.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

No doubt Snyder is a problem for the league, not sure Kraft is. Never the less those that actually own teams fall under different set of consequences and have to be handled differently. Snyder will have to be dealt with, but owners and players are not apples to apples no matter if the league claims they are held to a higher standard. No body is saying rewrite the CBA, in fact all I want is the NFL to apply what is their right under the CBA and impose the penalty we all know Watson deserves. INDEFINITE SUSPENSION.

So let me get this straight

You've stated your issue is men sleeping with or harassing women using power and money as their lever but you see Snyder as a separate and lesser issue?

Robinson openly is stating that the NFL would be acting well outside of their precedent by punishing non violent sexual behavior with an indefinite suspension. And if they do push it you best believe the person who's going to become even more front and center is Dan Snyder. The timing on the alignment of these two issues couldn't be more problematic for the NFL if they tried.

Call me crazy but I see enabling an workplace culture that is that messed up a pretty major issue for the NFL. And deshaun has a very good legal team that will be more than happy to highlight the difference in treatment.

 

[broncosmitty]

You can't rewrite the collective bargaining agreement on the fly. If the NFL was this concerned about their perception to women they should have handled Kraft and Snyder much better.

The latter was promoting the most hostile work environment possible for women. Had they set the tone there they'd be arguing from a position of strength. The former frequented actual sex slaves. I mean...yikes.

Which is why I don't think Roger will do anything here. He can fire Sue Robinson from future cases I'd suspect. That's his save face. And address this issue in the next round of negotiations. Because if he pushes this he better be prepared to open a whole can of worms.

Snyder isn’t my concern here. Kraft paid a willing participant. That isn’t predatory.

Watson needs to get fucked. And Rog can fuck him within the CBA. Watson is a member of a shitty Union.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

So let me get this straight

You've stated your issue is men sleeping with or harassing women using power and money as their lever but you see Snyder as a separate and lesser issue?

Robinson openly is stating that the NFL would be acting well outside of their precedent by punishing non violent sexual behavior with an indefinite suspension. And if they do push it you best believe the person who's going to become even more front and center is Dan Snyder. The timing on the alignment of these two issues couldn't be more problematic for the NFL if they tried.

Call me crazy but I see enabling an workplace culture that is that messed up a pretty major issue for the NFL. And deshaun has a very good legal team that will be more than happy to highlight the difference in treatment.

Pointing to owners misconduct is deflection and has no baring on Watson case. I’m for a life time ban for Watson. He deserves it. Star players been given way to much leeway, time to correct that. The CBA gives Goodell the right and he should apply it.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Snyder isn’t my concern here. Kraft paid a willing participant. That isn’t predatory.

Watson needs to get fucked. And Rog can fuck him within the CBA. Watson is a member of a shitty Union.

Kraft paid a willing participant? I don't think you're recalling the story correctly. That spa was busted for sex trafficking.

Help me understand why you would be more concerned with a guy acting on his own (wildly inappropriate mind you) as opposed to an owner who facilitated an entire organization mistreating women?

If the goal here is treatment of women of course.

But I have a different question? What has really changed in the year plus this story has been around? It was 22 women well over a year ago. Had deshaun read the room better he would've settled then and moved on. Because it's really funny to see the responses then in the thread from a year ago to now.

Harold specifically isn't beating his chest asking for indefinite suspensions. And I was calling deshaun a creepy fuck back then.

Trust me I'd much rather he not be the qb of the Browns but I've also never argued his career should be over.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Pointing to owners misconduct is deflection and has no baring on Watson case. I’m for a life time ban for Watson. He deserves it. Star players been given way to much leeway, time to correct that. The CBA gives Goodell the right and he should apply it.

And I'd respect your position had you argued that a year ago. You didn't.

 

[broncosmitty]

Kraft paid a willing participant? I don't think you're recalling the story correctly. That spa was busted for sex trafficking.

Help me understand why you would be more concerned with a guy acting on his own (wildly inappropriate mind you) as opposed to an owner who facilitated an entire organization mistreating women?

If the goal here is treatment of women of course.

But I have a different question? What has really changed in the year plus this story has been around? It was 22 women well over a year ago. Had deshaun read the room better he would've settled then and moved on. Because it's really funny to see the responses then in the thread from a year ago to now.

Harold specifically isn't beating his chest asking for indefinite suspensions. And I was calling deshaun a creepy fuck back then.

Trust me I'd much rather he not be the qb of the Browns but I've also never argued his career should be over.

I don’t really care about Bob Kraft, or Big Ben, or Dan Snyder on this.

Just your sexual predator eventual QB.

Who shouldn’t play this season. And your franchise deserves to be fucked with over him.

The only game Suh has missed his entire career was for stepping on a guys foot and Rog being a fag. I’m asking him to be a bigger fag here.

 

[Battlelyon]

 

[Stakesarehigh]

I don’t really care about Bob Kraft, or Big Ben, or Dan Snyder on this.

Just your sexual predator eventual QB.

Who shouldn’t play this season. And your franchise deserves to be fucked with over him.

The only game Suh has missed his entire career was for stepping on a guys foot and Rog being a fag. I’m asking him to be a bigger fag here.

I appreciate you acknowledging you're making this about football and not women

I appreciate the honesty