Thought on Clyde Edward-Helaire

[Ram Tough]

I love CEH

Loved his gamefilm and running/pass catching style @LSU

He impressed me alot this year.. yes he's a smaller back but he has a thick frame.. his legs r also like tree trunks.

With him being drafted by KC and with his running/pass catching ability, I can easily see CEH being a top 3 fantasy selection for years to come

He realistically has the chance to eventually have a season with 1000 rush yds ,1000 rec yds.. 70+ rec and double digits tds

He is a Westbrook/MJD clone, to the people hating on CEH, you are going to feel awfully silly in the upcoming seasons

 

[HaroldSeattle]

I love CEH

Loved his gamefilm and running/pass catching style @LSU

He impressed me alot this year.. yes he's a smaller back but he has a thick frame.. his legs r also like tree trunks.

With him being drafted by KC and with his running/pass catching ability, I can easily see CEH being a top 3 fantasy selection for years to come

He realistically has the chance to eventually have a season with 1000 rush yds ,1000 rec yds.. 70+ rec and double digits tds

He is a Westbrook/MJD clone, to the people hating on CEH, you are going to feel awfully silly in the upcoming seasons

Let me ask you this ..if Swift and CEH swapped landing spots, which one would you be high on?

 

[SteelersPride]

Is it relevant to my point?

No one has EVER claimed that situation doesn’t matter, but again, that is the angle being taken...

“He sucks, but if he does really well, he still sucks, but the system is making him look good!... I’m right no matter what!”

I mean I laugh at some of the crap being said about the kid... “Doesn’t run routes beyond 5 yards.”.... Yeah, he does... and not against Wyoming Valley State either... “No elusiveness”, though there is plenty of “tape” to say otherwise that apparently is meaningless because it is a “highlight” so apparently that doesn’t count?

(Seriously, think of the asinine nature of that last point for a moment.)

Literally NO praise can be given to CEH because, “I watched tape and wasn’t impressed!”... It’s hilarious.

Actually it's quite relevant..... if you think Reid turns dust into diamonds. I'm not sure how you don't see that.

I wouldn't have the same position on him if he want to the bears or the jets or the dolphins.....extremely relevant.

I made it very clear pre draft what I thought of him. So yes my stance makes 100% sense.

I do notice that you didn't answer my question. You typed ALOT. But dodged it.

Yeah, that kinda what a system player is. And its not like CEH is some rare unicorn who that applies to.

Check out the Shanny/Kubiak system.. When they have great backs(Portis, Davis, Foster) they get league leading production, yearly. When they have a "system" back, they still get good numbers, but the guy ain't worth a shit outside of the system (Olandis Gary, Mike Anderson, Doug Slaton, everyone in SF right now)
In Reid's case, the exceptional guys are Shady and Hunt, to some extent Charles but he was in the skids, the also rans, Westbrook, Staley, Dam. Williams, S. Ware, even C West wasnt terrible.

This isnt some new CYA theory..its pretty prevalent throughout the leagues recent history

Exactly.... and now we have Mahomes at qb and one of the most explosive offenses there ever was. It's not rocket science to see where my stance comes from.

 

[Ram Tough]

Let me ask you this ..if Swift and CEH swapped landing spots, which one would you be high on?

Swift....


My pre draft rookie Rbs rankings went
Swift
Taylor
CEH
Akers
Vaughn
Dobbins


I was high on CEH and the landing spot catapulted him to top dog

 

[SteelersPride]

Think a lot of folks feel any of the top rookie RBs could/would do well in that high powered offense. The fact that Damien Wiliams became relevant( after years of doing nothing) once he was installed as the starter in the Chiefs offense is exactly why some feel CEH will do at least OK even if they themselves didn't see him as special while watching his tape. CEH had one good season in college. Lets compare his stats in college to other rookies stats and yes not necessarily apples to apples, but it is what we have to work with.
CEH:
View attachment 243077

Taylor:

View attachment 243078

Dobbins:

View attachment 243079

Swift:

View attachment 243080

Akers:

View attachment 243081

Fact of the matter is if the Chiefs hadn't of drafted CEH nobody here would be talking about him, because he just wasn't all that in college.

Disagree there. His senior year was very nice. He played a great role for LSU. Anytime you do that and win a natty, your name becomes gold.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Disagree there. His senior year was very nice. He played a great role for LSU. Anytime you do that and win a natty, your name becomes gold.

Only had one good season in college was my point.

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Disagree there. His senior year was very nice. He played a great role for LSU. Anytime you do that and win a natty, your name becomes gold.

Only had one good season in college was my point.

LSU was a powerhouse loaded with NFL quality players. 14 got drafted, 3 LSU OL drafted in the first 5 rounds.

 

[Clayton]

Only had one good season in college was my point.

Is that a plus or minus for fantasy?

If the idea is that RBs are fairly interchangable then you don't want the RBs who have been bellcows in college for 3 years.

 

[SteelersPride]

LSU was a powerhouse loaded with NFL quality players. 14 got drafted, 3 LSU OL drafted in the first 5 rounds.

I totally agree. It's just more ppl go "oh shiny he's awesome"

also in the point of only one good season.

I recall Larry Johnson the same. Oddly enough also dragged in the first by the chiefs

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Is that a plus or minus for fantasy?

If the idea is that RBs are fairly interchangable then you don't want the RBs who have been bellcows in college for 3 years.

Opinions vary on that point. I tend to like to see steady production. I can't say I can recall a college bellcow RB that was effected by being over worked in college once he was drafted in the NFL. Maybe you have some examples?

 

[HaroldSeattle]

Opinions vary on that point. I tend to like to see steady production. I can't say I can recall a college bellcow RB that was effected by being over worked in college once he was drafted in the NFL. Maybe you have some examples?

Think the main knock is it will effect their long term future in the NFL and for FF purposes that doesn't matter for me. Not even in dynasty, because I'm constantly turning over the RB corp any how.

 

[Clayton]

Opinions vary on that point. I tend to like to see steady production. I can't say I can recall a college bellcow RB that was effected by being over worked in college once he was drafted in the NFL. Maybe you have some examples?

I'd have to do some digging. I just tend to see this year's crop of RBs as 'Chiefs RB', 'Colts RB', 'Lions RB', 'Ravens RB', etc.

Damien Williams' name has been thrown a lot around here and the RB that reminds me the most of him is actually Dobbins. Dobbins production in college isnt too much of a factor to me other than the fact that he is good enough to start for Ohio State for awhile which does mean something.

I'm generally under the opinion that CEH is fairly interchangable with someone like Devin Singletary. Singletary was very productive in college on a no name team and CEH was on one of the best teams ever.

How does that translate into the NFL? Who knows. I just think the fits here matter more than the talent, tbh

 

[SteelersPride]

So we wanna talk about production and catching etc.

in 2018. Darrell Henderson led the nation in rushing. Had an on 2017 too and caught the ball some? What gives there?

what about a guy like Zack moss? He outrushed CHE, he can catch, heck he missed time with injury and had stats.... three productive years...

 

[CaptainStubing]

His numbers will be similar to Kareem hunts

 

[SteelersPride]

His numbers will be similar to Kareem hunts

another wildly productive RB in college who could run and pass, but went round3.......hmmm

 

[The Foot]

Well, I had the 1.1 and 1.6 in mine and of course ended up trading them for Cook, but when I still had the picks, I was going to take Taylor at 1.1 and hope Swift fell to 1.6 since I have Kerryon. Well not that it ended up mattering, but that shit wouldn't have happened even though in my best opinion if I went Taylor at 1 and CEH went 2 and Dobbins went 3 then I thought Akers would go 4 and it would be up to Fuzzy to take either Vaughn or Swift. Well I got the first 3 right, but the wild card at 4 screwed up the plan by taking Swift there so even when Fuzzy surprised everybody and took Burrow at 5 it wouldn't have mattered. All I can tell you is that whatever you guess is going to happen isn't going to happen. The night before the draft the guy that had the 2nd pick in my league (Roll Tide) told me that he was going to take Jeudy at 2 and then the next day he took CEH. LOL. My ranks of the rookies by talent alone (before they were drafted) was:

Swift
Taylor
Dobbins
CEH
Akers
Vaughn

However after their landing spots, this is how I had them ranked:

Taylor
CEH
Dobbins
Swift
Akers
Vaughn

Does Taylor have the most mileage, yes, but he just has the best offensive line and the team obviously has no faith in Marlon Mack. CEH might not "start" but I'll bet he averages 12 touches per week because they are going to manufacture ways to get the ball in his hands. I watched the draft and Andy Reid was freaking beside himself at how happy he was to have a new toy. I don't care what his tape or his measurables say, Andy Reid really likes him and that's enough for me. It's hard for me to get past my Ohio State bias for Dobbins, but it's not like Baltimore is just going to let him have 20-25 carries a game even after Ingram's gone. Everybody that owned Ingram last year can attest to the fact that they just rotate backs at extremely strange times, so I don't really think Dobbins will ever be a workhorse back. I mean he could be what Ingram was last year which was really good, but I think owners of him are going to constantly be disappointed by how many times they take him off the field regardless of how good he's playing. I still think Swift is the most talented, but the Lions kill running backs and Matt Patricia is a Belichick disciple which is enough to drop him to #4 for me. The problem with trying to evaluate Akers is that Florida State has just sucked so bad the last couple of years, so it's really hard to get a grasp on him. I know that everybody says the Rams like a back to be the workhorse and get the majority of the touches, but look where that shit got them with Gurley. Maybe, just maybe they will think it's a bad idea to do that again and go to more of a committee approach, which is exactly what I think they will do. And I just don't think Vaughn is that good. Yes neither is Ronald Jones, but I can tell you right now that the only thing that will matter in that backfield is who pass blocks better even if they have to get Mike Alstott out of retirement. The running is going to be a completely secondary skill set and do not rule out Dare Ogunbowale vulturing more touches than you think, because neither Vaughn or Jones is ever going to be anything close to James White and Brady really liked James White.

I like your read on Andy Reid. You can tell a lot from someone's reaction.

 

[The Foot]

Gotta say though, I love the, “No matter what I’m right!” angle the CEH detractors have taken here...

He sucks, but even if he does really well it’s because of Andy Reid, so he still sucks...

I dont think anyone is saying it's my way and that is it. We all have opinions and that's really all they opinions. Sorry if it sounded like that.

 

[SmokingMonkey]

to the people hating on CEH, you are going to feel awfully silly in the upcoming seasons

what's funny is that I don't think anyone is saying they are avoiding him for fantasy, since he's on the chiefs, even if you didn't like him pre-draft, you'd be foolish to think that means he won't produce on a high-powered offense (at the very least be given a chance to produce due to draft stock)

unless I'm reading the comments wrong, feel like everyone is high on his situation, even if they weren't high on his college film.

don't think it matters much on my end - yes, I watch clips/cut ups of prospects I'm interested in, but i certainly don't think I know better than NFL talent evaluators (who take their fair share of 'guesses' when it comes to talent themselves)

 

[The Foot]

Yeah, that kinda what a system player is. And its not like CEH is some rare unicorn who that applies to.

Check out the Shanny/Kubiak system.. When they have great backs(Portis, Davis, Foster) they get league leading production, yearly. When they have a "system" back, they still get good numbers, but the guy ain't worth a shit outside of the system (Olandis Gary, Mike Anderson, Doug Slaton, everyone in SF right now)
In Reid's case, the exceptional guys are Shady and Hunt, to some extent Charles but he was in the skids, the also rans, Westbrook, Staley, Dam. Williams, S. Ware, even C West wasnt terrible.

This isnt some new CYA theory..its pretty prevalent throughout the leagues recent history

I agree 100 percent. I truly believe it's the system that makes or breaks guys.

 

[SteelersPride]

what's funny is that I don't think anyone is saying they are avoiding him for fantasy, since he's on the chiefs, even if you didn't like him pre-draft, you'd be foolish to think that means he won't produce on a high-powered offense (at the very least be given a chance to produce due to draft stock)

unless I'm reading the comments wrong, feel like everyone is high on his situation, even if they weren't high on his college film.

don't think it matters much on my end - yes, I watch clips/cut ups of prospects I'm interested in, but i certainly don't think I know better than NFL talent evaluators (who take their fair share of 'guesses' when it comes to talent themselves)

. The other side of the argument is doing the same thing funny enough. "i saw this" "he did this" "I watched this game"........thats great, theres a TON of wildly productive college running backs.......lots of guys who did good things....i can say that about alot of players........undrafted guys. I havent really heard anyone truly tell me how hes really special.....