2018-2019 NBA Regular Season Thread

[dtgold88]

Honestly it depends on your front office. How much shit have you given the Lakers for their missed draft picks, then what good is having all those picks?

There's no clear cut formula to winning. The answer is always dependent on the organizational structure, scouting and player development. Always.

sure it helps to be able to hit on those picks and have a smart FO, but as a generic question seems continuously being a 6-8 seed or missing the playoffs with mid to low first round picks can't get you out of Purgatory quicker than bottoming out.

 

[dtgold88]

Again depends on player development. The Warriors were a perennial 6th seed until Kerr took over as head coach and revamped the entire offense and defensive schemes. There's really not much difference in the team from 2014 and the team from 2015.

Not saying that all teams can do what the Warriors did. Obviously there is superstar talent that helped, but I don't see why a team like say New Orleans couldn't have done something similar. They were a fringe playoff team with a top 5 NBA player. But their organization was so shit in putting pieces around him that fit, that it caused the rift.

Look at the Bucks too. Giannis took the leap, but in addition to that the organization hit on a second round draft pick in Brogdon and was able to make the trade for Eric Bledsoe. Two big pieces to their success. Then they added a quality free agent in Brook Lopez and all of a sudden they're in the mix.

Sure IF you find a Giannis later you can do it, but more often that guy is found near the top of the draft.

 

[dtgold88]

Well, not really.

Steph Curry - drafted first round #7
Klay Thompson -drafted first round #11
Kobe Bryant -drafted first round #13
Draymond Green - drafted SECOND ROUND # 35

Right...and Tom Brady went in the 6th round so don't waste a pick and take a QB high.

If you can have a top 3 pick one year or instead pick 13 and 35 for 2 seasons what are you taking?

 

[dtgold88]

Well a Cavs fan would know - given this season and all.

Exactly!! I get you reply based on poster and not post but you are finally getting it.

 

[dtgold88]

Not in the Cavs' case...but who's keeping count? lol

Kyrie and Lebron say hi. Traded wiggins (with Bennett) for Love. If I finish with an "lol" will you get it?

 

[dtgold88]

Lol really? So LBJ specifically recruiting Love was part of Gilbert's "rebuild" process? lol

We're not even going to mention they trick Kyrie into an extension after his rookie deal to then turn around & sign LBJ later that same summer.

Then some people have nerve to be surprised when Kyrie announces he no longer wants to play with LBJ & demands a trade.

The process was clear as much cap space and as as many assets as possible to have options.

You don't think Kyrie knew Lebron was an option and had to be tricked into a max deal after his rookie contract? You know, the kind of deal that is almost never turned down?

 

[tlance]

Nobody is saying anything different to that, except adding the opinion that he was hoping he’d be able to trade those player(s).

Yeah.

Signing players to long term deals with hopes to trade them is just a bad idea.

Cap space is way more valuable than a long term deal to a non star player. Unless it is on cap friendly terms. Most newly signed long term contracts aren't cap friendly.

 

[dtgold88]

exactly. For some reason Riley thought it was a good idea to sign a bunch of mediocre guys to long term expensive contracts. Its like, honestly, the worst idea i have ever heard in the NBA...

RILEY: "What if we signed a ton of guys, crowded the rotations, locked all our cap space into mediocre players for the next 3-4 years?"

MICKEY: "uhhh, well, i dunno"

RILEY: "Cmon- who wouldnt want to trade for James Johnson making 15M a year when you can pick up a replacement level guy off the street to give you 80% of what he does? Who doesnt want to trade for Waiters on a 4 year 50M dollar contract? They will be banging down our door to trade for Whiteside and his 27M dollar player option!--- Tyler Johnson 19M a year his last 2 years--- I bet we can squeeze some major value out of that!"

Cue the foolish comparison with these deals to the cavs signing 5X all star Kevin Love to a huge deal.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

exactly. For some reason Riley thought it was a good idea to sign a bunch of mediocre guys to long term expensive contracts. Its like, honestly, the worst idea i have ever heard in the NBA...

RILEY: "What if we signed a ton of guys, crowded the rotations, locked all our cap space into mediocre players for the next 3-4 years?"

MICKEY: "uhhh, well, i dunno"

RILEY: "Cmon- who wouldnt want to trade for James Johnson making 15M a year when you can pick up a replacement level guy off the street to give you 80% of what he does? Who doesnt want to trade for Waiters on a 4 year 50M dollar contract? They will be banging down our door to trade for Whiteside and his 27M dollar player option!--- Tyler Johnson 19M a year his last 2 years--- I bet we can squeeze some major value out of that!"

If the Cavs didn’t overpay LeBrons posse, maybe they would have another title, and still have him?

You conveniently ignore the crazy contracts given that summer ( even though I listed some).
Ill wait for your list of players who were available for 80% less.

And, its also Rileys fault that injuries occured?

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Cue the foolish comparison with these deals to the cavs signing 5X all star Kevin Love to a huge deal.

No.
Love signing seemed to make sense at the time.
LeBron just had no clue the Warriors could out LeBron him, and while doing so have a roster that Love was basically useless against.

 

[dtgold88]

Yeah.

Signing players to long term deals with hopes to trade them is just a bad idea.

Cap space is way more valuable than a long term deal to a non star player. Unless it is on cap friendly terms. Most newly signed long term contracts aren't cap friendly.

Seems like this would be obvious.

And, hell, I'm not even saying the Cavs plan will work again. There is no Lebron to lure back. But I'd rather try my luck with top 3-5 picks along with extra assets and cap room then overpay middling players to at best make the playoffs and win 1 round (and even that is a huge stretch).

 

[dtgold88]

If the Cavs didn’t overpay LeBrons posse, maybe they would have another title, and still have him?

You conveniently ignore the crazy contracts given that summer ( even though I listed some).
Ill wait for your list of players who were available for 80% less.

And, its also Rileys fault that injuries occured?

This would be another example where I will refute your comments with logic, facts and reason. I think it was @Wamu who asked for an example.....

The Cavs had the choice of signing Lebron's posse - you know, the guys who played a huge role in winning a title - or no one as they were way over the cap. You say letting the guys go who Lebron wants to keep and replacing them with lesser players was the way to keep him?

 

[dtgold88]

No.
Love signing seemed to make sense at the time.
LeBron just had no clue the Warriors could out LeBron him, and while doing so have a roster that Love was basically useless against.

Except when he was outplaying Green in the last 2 Finals.

And you get Love is needed to help the Cavs get to the Finals, right?

 

[dtgold88]

Out of the top NBA players, probably half are top 5 picks.

Top 5 picks
Lebron
AD
Embiid
KD
Harden
Kyrie
Russ
KAT
Simmons

After top 5
Giannis
Steph
Kawhi
PG13
Jokic
Dame
Klay
Butler

OK, but there are only 5 top 5 picks a year compared to 55 picks that are not top 5. Thinking this proves how important it is to pick near the top.

 

[Wamu]

This would be another example where I will refute your comments with logic, facts and reason. I think it was @Wamu who asked for an example.....

The Cavs had the choice of signing Lebron's posse - you know, the guys who played a huge role in winning a title - or no one as they were way over the cap. You say letting the guys go who Lebron wants to keep and replacing them with lesser players was the way to keep him?

I have no idea what you're yapping about. Where exactly did I ever ask you for examples of the Cavs having the choice of signing LeBron's posse?

 

[dtgold88]

The actual annual salaries were pretty much a bargain for that summer.
Less years would have been better, no doubt, but its a negotiation, not whats always best for the team.

I know, you know, everyone knows that FA will come to Miami.
Not every one, not every time, but we all know its coming.
Cavs can never even think like that.
Just isn’t happening.
Wade wouldn’t even let his kids live in that hell hole when he was playing there.

you get you are just proving the job Gilbert/FO here did was superior, right? I don't think anyone believes young millionaires would choose Cleveland over Miami and even with that advantage Miami has been nothing special in luring top FAs to your team.

 

[dtgold88]

I have no idea what you're yapping about. Where exactly did I ever ask you for examples of the Cavs having the choice of signing LeBron's posse?

First, said I wasn't sure it was you to begin with. But I said I have been able to refute comments with logic, facts and reason and this was one such example. didn't have to be regarding Lebron's posse....but in this case it was.

Or do you think the cavs should have let TT, JR and Shump walk even thogh Lebron wanted them to stay...so they could sign no one.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

This would be another example where I will refute your comments with logic, facts and reason. I think it was @Wamu who asked for an example.....

The Cavs had the choice of signing Lebron's posse - you know, the guys who played a huge role in winning a title - or no one as they were way over the cap. You say letting the guys go who Lebron wants to keep and replacing them with lesser players was the way to keep him?

Lesser?
Who said that?

I see no reason to go through all of this for the 500th time.

How about this, annual results will determine which plan works out best.
Let me know when the Cavs have a better season then the Heat moving forward.

 

[dtgold88]

Its a giant circle.
There are tons more top 5 picks over the years that never played for a championship, or even came close.
Professional athletes and franchises should always have the mindset to try to win.
For what it costs to go, and what players earn, it just should be that way.
If teams want to lose on purpose, refund the cash or credit it towards next year.

There were also "tons more" players not taken top 5 who did not play for a title. Imagine that.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

Except when he was outplaying Green in the last 2 Finals.

And you get Love is needed to help the Cavs get to the Finals, right?

Getting to the Finals when you have James is like hiring a hooker and she lets you squeeze her tits.