Which of these stats justify an MVP QB

[Tharvot]

If that was the sole metric, then Kaep would have been in the running in '12/'13, and he wasn't.

It's not the sole metric but it plays a huge part. If QBs have fairly even stat lines, their win totals will be the separating factor. End of season awards always seem to go to the best player (or most visible player) on the best team, not necessarily the "most valuable" player in the league.

 

[Wolverine830872]

Week 17, with 8 minutes left in the game Carolina is up 31-10. They've locked up the #1 seed. They decide to keep passing with Cam to butter up his stats. Cam is a paper tiger of an "MVP" candidate

 

[Broncos6482]

Week 17, with 8 minutes left in the game Carolina is up 31-10. They've locked up the #1 seed. They decide to keep passing with Cam to butter up his stats. Cam is a paper tiger of an "MVP" candidate

The guy with the most touchdowns is a "paper tiger."

 

[ducky]

It was simply an argument comparing Cam's numbers to Kaep's. Obviously Cam is better. But a lot of Cam's stats are tied to the sheer number of times that he threw/ran. Even with his inflated attempts, he finished behind multiple QB's in yards.

Not only was Cam not very efficient, he did it against subpar opponents. Cam's number are much more impressive.

If the MVP is the most valuable player, then remove Cam and Carson from their respective teams to be replaced by an average replacement. Which team would do without their services? I think the Panthers would easily.

His "inflated" attempts only happened because of all the first downs that offense was getting in large part because of Cam.

Go look at those Kaep stats again. He ran for the same amount of yards in the season you listed as Cam did.....but Cam ran for 56 1st downs where Kaep only ran for 28 that year. That's because Newton was grinding out 1st downs after 1st down making his offense more efficient series after series, play after play. All the way to the highest scoring team in the league.

It's not only the threat of running....but the threat of a designed run anywhere on the field on any play that made Cam and that offense so efficient and made it the highest scoring team in the league.

Let me say that again: THE HIGHEST SCORING TEAM IN THE LEAGUE. And he did that with below average WR's and an average at best RB. 3 years ago if I would have told you that Tedd Ginn would be the #1 WR on the highest scoring team in the league, you would have laughed. Especially if I told you that the #1 RB was a plugger RB who is at best average.

Palmer put up his numbers with a plethora of WR and RB's around him. In fact it might be one of the deepest skill position teams we have seen in a long time in this league.

Honestly there is only one type of person who wouldn't vote for Cam for MVP: Those that didn't watch the games. Cam WAS the Carolina offense. You could plug and play virtually anyone around him and he would have kept that thing rolling with the way he played this year. He was working with WR's that had zero business starting in the NFL and making them part of high octane offense. You give Carson Palmer the terrible WR corp and pass blocking OL that Newton had and he is once again thinking about retirement. That is why Newton is the unquestioned MVP this year. He not only was great himself....but he was so good that he made the completely average players around him (and that is being generous) good too.

 

[The Q]

Week 17, with 8 minutes left in the game Carolina is up 31-10. They've locked up the #1 seed. They decide to keep passing with Cam to butter up his stats. Cam is a paper tiger of an "MVP" candidate

Funny considering no one pads their stats more than Brady.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

His "inflated" attempts only happened because of all the first downs that offense was getting in large part because of Cam.

Go look at those Kaep stats again. He ran for the same amount of yards in the season you listed as Cam did.....but Cam ran for 56 1st downs where Kaep only ran for 28 that year. That's because Newton was grinding out 1st downs after 1st down making his offense more efficient series after series, play after play. All the way to the highest scoring team in the league.

It's not only the threat of running....but the threat of a designed run anywhere on the field on any play that made Cam and that offense so efficient and made it the highest scoring team in the league.

Let me say that again: THE HIGHEST SCORING TEAM IN THE LEAGUE. And he did that with below average WR's and an average at best RB. 3 years ago if I would have told you that Tedd Ginn would be the #1 WR on the highest scoring team in the league, you would have laughed. Especially if I told you that the #1 RB was a plugger RB who is at best average.

Palmer put up his numbers with a plethora of WR and RB's around him. In fact it might be one of the deepest skill position teams we have seen in a long time in this league.

Honestly there is only one type of person who wouldn't vote for Cam for MVP: Those that didn't watch the games. Cam WAS the Carolina offense. You could plug and play virtually anyone around him and he would have kept that thing rolling with the way he played this year. He was working with WR's that had zero business starting in the NFL and making them part of high octane offense. You give Carson Palmer the terrible WR corp and pass blocking OL that Newton had and he is once again thinking about retirement. That is why Newton is the unquestioned MVP this year. He not only was great himself....but he was so good that he made the completely average players around him (and that is being generous) good too.

If people could take their personal feelings and biases out of the decision making process and simply judge this season on the performance and the results of that performance...Cam is the clearcut MVP this season.

 

[ducky]

If people could take their personal feelings and biases out of the decision making process and simply judge this season on the performance and the results of that performance...Cam is the clearcut MVP this season.

Yep. I am not even the biggest Carolina fan. In week 8 I would have laughed at the idea of Cam winning the MVP. But performance is performance. And getting that talent starved offense to put up the most points in the league is nothing short of amazing.

 

[Money]

If people could take their personal feelings and biases out of the decision making process and simply judge this season on the performance and the results of that performance...Cam is the clearcut MVP this season.

You are asking an awful lot.

BTW..."clear cut" is an understatement.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

You are asking an awful lot.

BTW..."clear cut" is an understatement.

Yep...that's why you get many of the same Pro Bowlers every year when sometimes a lessor known player actually performed better.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

Yep. I am not even the biggest Carolina fan. In week 8 I would have laughed at the idea of Cam winning the MVP. But performance is performance. And getting that talent starved offense to put up the most points in the league is nothing short of amazing.

I'm in the camp with most of the people that think Cam's antics are OTT, but hey, it's a different era, different time...Cam is part showman...I get it even if it's not my style, but I can separate that from the talent and performance on the field.

 

[dkmightyhammer]

I'm in the camp with most of the people that think Cam's antics are OTT, but hey, it's a different era, different time...Cam is part showman...I get it even if it's not my style, but I can separate that from the talent and performance on the field.

That's part of it with many people. If Cam didn't showboat so much I don't think this would even be a debate. I really dislike the guy but there is no question he would receive my vote for MVP if I had one.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

That's part of it with many people. If Cam didn't showboat so much I don't think this would even be a debate. I really dislike the guy but there is no question he would receive my vote for MVP if I had one.

At least you can do it...some of us...not really.

The reason I can overlook it to a degree...there are some truly bad (Greg Hardy types) people in the NFL that people talk bad about all week and deservedly so, but some of the same people turnaround cheer for the guy on Sundays.

Cam got over his little misbehaving spell in college and has really been a model citizen off the field, does a lot in the community etc.

Him being a clown when he scores...I can tolerate it.

 

[flyerhawk]

Sometimes it's hard work, sometimes it's easy work but that's determined by the QB and the defense. A lot of Ted Ginn's yards were pretty easy trotting into the endzone after catching it behind the defense.

Did Cam Newton make Ted Ginn get wide open?

 

[Money]

Did Cam Newton make Ted Ginn get wide open?

Ted Ginn has gotten wide open his entire career. Problem is that's only part of his job.

 

[Money]

 

[The Q]

So that's 2 TDs already. Two really easy TDs he cost Cam.

 

[dkmightyhammer]

I think in any future MVP race if two QB's are close to a tie in the voting then the shorter one should win.

 

[flyerhawk]

Ted Ginn has gotten wide open his entire career. Problem is that's only part of his job.

Oh no doubt. He's a real life Featherstone.

But enut was suggesting that Newton was somehow helping Ginn get open.

 

[johnson]

QB A
QB rating - 3rd in league
Completion Percentage - 16th in league
Passing Yards - 4th in league
Passing TD - tied for 2nd

QB B
QB rating - 4th
Completion Percentage - 12th
Passing Yards - 3rd
Passing TD - 1st

QB C
QB rating - 1st
Completion Percentage - 3rd
Passing Yards - 12th
Passing TD - 6th

QB D
QB rating - 8th
Completion Percentage - 28th
Passing Yards - 16th
Passing TD - tied for 2nd

None of them. I think you need to look at their performance week by week and give it to the guy who played the most consistently...the guy who was a major contributor week in and week out...the guy who was a reason they were winning games....and the more wins, the more credit he should get.

Who is more worthy of MVP? The guy that accumulated his stats playing at an elite level almost every game? Or a guy that went nuts for about 40% of it? Both are going to have similar overall stats. Easy answer for me.

 

[eaglesnut]

Ah, all the sites I looked up showed total fumbles for passing stats, and then a different subset of fumbles for their running stats, both total and lost. I wasn't sure which of the passing fumbles were actually turnovers so I didn't include them

"Fumbles lost" would be the stat to look for. That will cover them all I believe. I've used this link previously when looking for QB fumbles. NFL Football Player Stats & Stats Leaders - Fumbles Lost. I think it's accurate, I checked a couple of them against my yahoo fantasy football league stats a couple months ago.