Time to get wise: EXPAND

[GoldRusher]

Until WV becomes an AAU school this will never happen..Only one school in the Big10 that does not meet the criteria and that is Nebraska...and they just lost that designation..

The same AAU that has UNC as a member?

 

[bbwvfan]

I truly appreciate how perception plays a role in deciding between 12-1 and 11-1.

However, if I am to take the CFP committee at their word...SOS is a major factor when they plug it into their metrics for evaluation.

If this is true, a strong SOS in the OOC coupled with the SOS from the round robin should be enough to cement a one loss team in the final 4. The Big 12 has been one of the top 3 conferences annually since TCU and WVU joined. Playing 9 IC games plus 1-2 other P5 schools...one of which is top top 40 or better would be difficult for a team from one of the other P5 conferences to overcome...even with a CCG.

One of the concerns I have with adding weaker teams is the hit the SOS would take. An undefeated FSU kept falling in the CFP rankings last year. A 12-1 record with a weakened SOS in the Big 12 would likely fall behind that of the SEC and Pac 12 with similar records...and would fight B1G and ACC if they had similar records.

Had BU played a tough OOC last year, they would have been one of the 4 in the CFP.

 

[GoldRusher]

I truly appreciate how perception plays a role in deciding between 12-1 and 11-1.

However, if I am to take the CFP committee at their word...SOS is a major factor when they plug it into their metrics for evaluation.

If this is true, a strong SOS in the OOC coupled with the SOS from the round robin should be enough to cement a one loss team in the final 4. The Big 12 has been one of the top 3 conferences annually since TCU and WVU joined. Playing 9 IC games plus 1-2 other P5 schools...one of which is top top 40 or better would be difficult for a team from one of the other P5 conferences to overcome...even with a CCG.

One of the concerns I have with adding weaker teams is the hit the SOS would take. An undefeated FSU kept falling in the CFP rankings last year. A 12-1 record with a weakened SOS in the Big 12 would likely fall behind that of the SEC and Pac 12 with similar records...and would fight B1G and ACC if they had similar records.

Had BU played a tough OOC last year, they would have been one of the 4 in the CFP.

Agree, If Notre Dame has a good year with their 12 game slate and gets left out then.... maybe we worry but we all know that wont happen.

 

[Mac_Bridger]

Any business model, to get richer, requires investment. Now, the choice is what is the wisest investment? I don't think Boise St. or BYU are. What growth potential do they bring? Little. What recruiting base to they bring? Little. What TV markets do they bring? Salt Lake City and Boise. USF/UCF? Tampa and Orlando. (Can you say Disney?)

You do realize that BYU is "Mormon U"? I know RABID Cougar fans that live in Morgantown. The Mormon church has missionaries across the world and they take their love of BYU with them. BYU gets you a WORLDWIDE TV market. It may not be Notre Dame, but it is large. I think you need to do more research into BYU...

If the Big XII were to expand, BYU makes a lot of sense to me. UCF or USF would be fine as a dancing partner. But BYU is more attractive than either to me.

As far as market goes, his is a few years old but check out this excerpt from http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/20...ege-football-fans-and-realignment-chaos/?_r=0

"Brigham Young, as we mentioned, would be an attractive-enough addition for a conference like the Big 12. With about 700,000 fans, it ranks behind 42 automatic-qualifier schools — but ahead of 27 of them.

But it may instead be the case that the ranks of independent schools will expand rather than contract. West Virginia, for instance, was an independent for most of its history until 1990 and if it were an odd-team-out under realignment it could look toward that option again."

 

[CoolBeans]

You do realize that BYU is "Mormon U"? I know RABID Cougar fans that live in Morgantown. The Mormon church has missionaries across the world and they take their love of BYU with them. BYU gets you a WORLDWIDE TV market. It may not be Notre Dame, but it is large. I think you need to do more research into BYU...

BYU does bring a rabid fan base. What they do not bring to the table is the ability to draw other big name schools. I think once the Big 12 becomes 12... I truly think two of the following three schools would consider the BIg 12 a viable option to join.

Florida St., Miami, LSU

I think LSU is a long shot, but I read an article about it fairly recently that they feel they are not getting a fair shake in the SEC. My point is GET TO TWELVE with the FOCUS of getting to 14 and them 16.

Now, there is one scenario that would change my mind. There is one school as a dancing partner that BYU could draw, and that would be Notre Dame. If that happened, I am all for it. But, as expansion plans go, I would think BYU later on down the road, to expand from 14 to 16, seems the best viable option.

 

[mad2mc]

I do not believe that LSU would ever leave the SEC. If that were the case, teams like Vandy would have left a long time ago. Conference recognition and money is doing Vandy a lot of good. Every so often, they throw out a good football or hoops team and everybody is content. You would have a better chance of grabbing an unhappy ACC team before pulling a SEC team. It appears aTm and Mizzou are happy with their move.

 

[Anotherwvufan]

BYU does bring a rabid fan base. What they do not bring to the table is the ability to draw other big name schools. I think once the Big 12 becomes 12... I truly think two of the following three schools would consider the BIg 12 a viable option to join.

Florida St., Miami, LSU

I think LSU is a long shot, but I read an article about it fairly recently that they feel they are not getting a fair shake in the SEC. My point is GET TO TWELVE with the FOCUS of getting to 14 and them 16.

Now, there is one scenario that would change my mind. There is one school as a dancing partner that BYU could draw, and that would be Notre Dame. If that happened, I am all for it. But, as expansion plans go, I would think BYU later on down the road, to expand from 14 to 16, seems the best viable option.

I can agree with that expansion plan...Clemson could be in the mix also. I would be happy to trade the yearly Texas game with FSU ND, Miami, LSU or Clemson. Nobody from BYU would want to travel to a heathen state like West by God.

 

[Bat 20]

WVU AD in favor of Big 12 expansion if 'right' teams
WVU AD in favor of Big 12 expansion if 'right' teams | Dr. Saturday - Yahoo Sports

 

[CoolBeans]

Great Article Bat

 

[GoldRusher]

I don't think it will happen but could change the dynamics just a bit...

Mike Aresco still stumping for AAC in Power 5 conversation | CollegeFootballTalk

 

[Mac_Bridger]

I can agree with that expansion plan...Clemson could be in the mix also. I would be happy to trade the yearly Texas game with FSU ND, Miami, LSU or Clemson. Nobody from BYU would want to travel to a heathen state like West by God.

My step-mother is a mormon from Salt Lake City, and lives in Morgantown...

 

[Anotherwvufan]

My step-mother is a mormon from Salt Lake City, and lives in Morgantown...

I stand corrected... Other than Mac Bridgers" Mom, Nobody from BYU would want to travel to a heathen state like West by God.

 

[CoolBeans]

The Big 12 Will Expand and WVU May Lead the Charge

Posted by C. Austin Cox on Thursday, 04 June 2015 in Big 12 Conference Blog

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Shane Lyons, the athletic director at West Virginia, has made it known that he wants the Big 12 to expand and start adding the right teams to the league. The Mountaineer AD didn't define what the criteria is or who the right teams are, but it isn't hard to figure out.

The topic has been discussed several times before here on the Big 12 blog. We covered why Boise State and BYU won't be added. We talked about the possibility of UConn and other prospects joining the Big 12 a year before that. The whole time we've been speculating about the league adding more teams, the overall strength of the conference has been called into question. But a couple bad bowl seasons will do that. Just ask the Big East.

So who will the Big 12 add if it adds anyone? The answer is still as simple as it was before West Virginia's AD spilled the beans that they want more teams. It's going to be between Cincinnati, Memphis, UCF along with long shots UConn, USF and ECU.

To be blunt, only a complete fool thinks the Big 12 will remain at ten teams. It's just not feasible when every other power conference has worked to get to 12 and 14 teams (ACC: 14, Big Ten: 14, SEC: 14, PAC: 12, Big 12: 10). The Big 12 isn't just the league with the fewest teams. It has become the punching bag of the power conferences with the Pac-12, Big Ten and SEC each raiding the Big 12 for teams. Meanwhile, the only conference the Big 12 has been able to poach is the Big East / American, a former power conference that looked very similar to the Big 12 in its final days as a power.

The Big 12 doesn't have any weight to throw around. It can't poach an ACC team because it simply can't afford to pay $50 million per team (ACC exit fees) and even then the ACC Grant of Rights would give the TV rights of those teams to the ACC for a certain number of years. It can't poach the Pac-12, SEC or Big Ten because those leagues have already proven more appealing by taking teams away from the Big 12.

On the other hand, if the Big 12 were to lose two or more teams, its own Grant of Rights likely wouldn't hold up in court and it would become the next WAC or Big East - a power conference that waited too long to expand and was muscled out. That would be the perfect scenario for the other power conferences. There are only four spots in the playoffs - that's the thing the Big 12 was left out of last season with its Two One True Champions - and many speculate the ACC, Pac-12, Big Ten and SEC all want four power conferences with 16 teams each. The Pac-12 would consider throwing Boise State and BYU a bone if that were the case (after poaching the Big 12 of course), leaving many current Big 12 teams to question the future of their own programs.

So while it's nice to put on a brave face and stand behind Bob Bowlsby as he double-talks out the side of his face saying, "We're not going to be reactionary and expand", the simple truth is there is no choice in the matter if the Big 12 wants to survive. The league will expand or die. And that isn't the worst thing in the world for big time brands like Oklahoma and Texas, but others are relying on the league to survive. If the Big 12 gets raided again and falls apart, you can expect to see Texas Tech hosting New Mexico and Utah State in Mountain West conference matchups while Iowa State gets familiar with its new rivals in the American Athletic Conference.

Which teams will the Big 12 take? We know they will be east of the Mississippi river because FOX Sports has enough programming (games to air) in central, mountain and pacific time zones with the Big 12 and Pac-12. West Virginia is the only program that is in the Eastern time zone and under first tier rights for FOX Sports. And we all know that West Virginia wants closer conference mates since Iowa State is 880 miles away with the rest of the league sitting well over 1000 miles away from Morgantown. Memphis, Cincinnati, UCF, USF, UConn and even ECU are viable options.

UCF and USF provide a footprint in the middle of ACC and SEC country while giving the Big 12 a chance to showcase brands like Texas and Oklahoma in the Sunshine State to Florida recruits. Memphis is basically a logistical dream for WVU, sitting halfway between the Mountaineers and the rest of the Big 12. Cincinnati is in a similar boat, while also sitting in the fertile Ohio recruiting grounds currently dominated by the Big Ten. And one thing everyone in business knows is that it helps to weaken your competitors if you want to get stronger. That's why you see a CVS sitting across the street from most Walgreens.

More teams mean more games to air on FOX Sports and for FOX to sell to other networks. The network will pay for that of course. It's not a question of money. The Big 12 needs to get stronger and it needs to expand. West Virginia knows this and so does the rest of the conference. The only question is how long Bowlsby and Texas can keep the league from strengthening and solidifying its future.

 

[bbwvfan]

This blog writer left out the part where Lyons acknowledged the 'right school' would have to bring $50 million dollars worth of interest to the Big 12 before they'd seriously be considered at this point.

None of the schools he listed as possibilities can provide this.

The Big 12 will not be expanding unless it is locked out of the CFP a few more times...

 

[mad2mc]

The Big 12 will not be expanding unless it is locked out of the CFP a few more times...

By then, it may be too late.

 

[bbwvfan]

What would make a difference in when expansion occurs?

 

[GoldRusher]

The Big 12 will not be expanding unless it is locked out of the CFP a few more times...

So, if a Big12 team makes the playoff and/or wins the NC this year...then what?

 

[bbwvfan]

So, if a Big12 team makes the playoff and/or wins the NC this year...then what?

Then it's too late...

 

[GoldRusher]

Longhorn Network doomed? Texas' TV money stacking up fine against SEC's - SBNation.com

 

[CoolBeans]

I have no problem with U-Texas making money. We will, too. Bottom line, IMHO, is Texas and WVu and Oklahoma and anyone else in the Big 12 will make MORE with a conference title game AND adding two schools. UCF and USF would make more from Big 12 scraps than the AAC, and the Big 12 will be worth a lot more. A guarantee of five conference games for TV each week, Orlando and Tampa eyeballs watching the games, recruiting pipelines into Florida, a chance to get FSU and Miami... I like it.