Short yardage question

[Breed]

Some key points here on the short yardage failure during Sunday's game with the Saints. We lack a strong power running game especially on short yardage situations. Next the Saints if I recall had no time outs left. Our def is helpless against Brees. They allowed Brees to drive 90 to 80 yds in what 3 or 4 plays, seem like 2 to me LOL. Our D certainly should get the blame but the coach gets most the blame here b/c he made the call on 3rd and one. You should know if you line up in a very tight run formation, the Saints will have all 11 men in the box. They will be in sell out mode to stop the run. Hell they just said screw defending the pass. A boot leg to run or pass would have been my call. Beside this is a play we seem to run well and the wr on the opposite side would have been open or KC would have slid for the first down. Now I know there's alot of if's and but's however this would have been my call.

Yeah, a read option for Kirk with Vernon Davis or Sprinkle running a safety valve route or an out n up depending on coverage. Line CT in the slot or out wide, pisses me off it took the Skins till the Vikes game to send CT down the field like a wide out. I remember the first time the Skins ran that play. A Thursday night game against the Giants back in 2015. CT picked up an easy 25+ yards, but a penalty negated it. That play told me CT could be a baller as well. I'm glad we didn't 86 him like so many wanted to back then. If/when CT gets back is up to speed. We need to make that look and that play a staple of the offense.

 

[skinsdad62]

the next step in the growth of this team is learning how to win these games . put teams away early and make the "must " plays at the end

 

[SoCalWizFan]

the next step in the growth of this team is learning how to win these games . put teams away early and make the "must " plays at the end

Help me out here. For the past several seasons we have seen a disturbing trend for the Redskins defense that continued on Sun. The defense does very well & appears to be holding the other team in check & quite often winning the game by a decent margin. Then quite often the offense will do well enough to maintain or improve on the lead. Then somehow it all falls apart. At the end of the game they just don't appear to be able to stop anyone. No rush D, no pass rush, no coverage, etc, etc.

I realize that this is somewhat dependent on the other teams & injuries. However we have seen this numerous times under different circumstances against teams of various talent levels. Why can't the team at least play to their ability late in a game? Against the Saints all that they needed to do was slow down the team - not be dominant & they didn't come close. It is as if they become a much worse defense late in most games. Just frustrating.

 

[skinsdad62]

Help me out here. For the past several seasons we have seen a disturbing trend for the Redskins defense that continued on Sun. The defense does very well & appears to be holding the other team in check & quite often winning the game by a decent margin. Then quite often the offense will do well enough to maintain or improve on the lead. Then somehow it all falls apart. At the end of the game they just don't appear to be able to stop anyone. No rush D, no pass rush, no coverage, etc, etc.

I realize that this is somewhat dependent on the other teams & injuries. However we have seen this numerous times under different circumstances against teams of various talent levels. Why can't the team at least play to their ability late in a game? Against the Saints all that they needed to do was slow down the team - not be dominant & they didn't come close. It is as if they become a much worse defense late in most games. Just frustrating.

its part of the learning process

all i can say , right now we can compete with most NFL teams but now we have to learn to win these games

i think lack of depth kills us at the end

 

[j_y19]

Help me out here. For the past several seasons we have seen a disturbing trend for the Redskins defense that continued on Sun. The defense does very well & appears to be holding the other team in check & quite often winning the game by a decent margin. Then quite often the offense will do well enough to maintain or improve on the lead. Then somehow it all falls apart. At the end of the game they just don't appear to be able to stop anyone. No rush D, no pass rush, no coverage, etc, etc.

I realize that this is somewhat dependent on the other teams & injuries. However we have seen this numerous times under different circumstances against teams of various talent levels. Why can't the team at least play to their ability late in a game? Against the Saints all that they needed to do was slow down the team - not be dominant & they didn't come close. It is as if they become a much worse defense late in most games. Just frustrating.

Part of the issue with the defense in the closing minutes is depth. Especially across the line. By the end of the game, they are worn out. So they get no pressure. But that doesn't explain all of it. It appears we just aren't prepared. Communication breaks down. Not all players on same page, etc. That goes to Coaching. I mean, my god, how many times do you get burned by a TE over the middle between the LBs and the Safeties before you change something up? But we do not coach or play well in 2 minute situations on defense. Manusky and Gruden have to be held accountable for this breakdown.

 

[skinsdad62]

Part of the issue with the defense in the closing minutes is depth. Especially across the line. By the end of the game, they are worn out. So they get no pressure. But that doesn't explain all of it. It appears we just aren't prepared. Communication breaks down. Not all players on same page, etc. That goes to Coaching. I mean, my god, how many times do you get burned by a TE over the middle between the LBs and the Safeties before you change something up? But we do not coach or play well in 2 minute situations on defense. Manusky and Gruden have to be held accountable for this breakdown.

injuries could factor in here as perhaps the BU's arent up to that level yet . not saying you are wrong , just throwing it out there

 

[SoCalWizFan]

its part of the learning process

all i can say , right now we can compete with most NFL teams but now we have to learn to win these games

i think lack of depth kills us at the end

I appreciate the optimism, but you & even me have been saying things like this for quite a while. When exactly will they turn the corner? I am just afraid they we might be saying the same thing 2-3 years from now. At times the offense has had even worse injury issues but manages to tough it out to a degree. The defense appears to be in this situation quite often & this didn't just start this season. I also understand the injury factor.

I agree about depth, but I believe it goes much deeper. No way any team should have laid down like the Redskins did on Sun - regardless of depth. It is not as if the Saints had the ball for an inordinate amt of time (Skins actually had the ball longer). Sure - part of this is physical & perhaps depth related, but it also appears to be mental & coaching related. Redskins really need to look at this closely over the offseason. This is very disturbing.

One thing for sure - D Hall has to be gone - he embarrassed himself against the Saints - age is catching up to him.

 

[skinsdad62]

I appreciate the optimism, but you & even me have been saying things like this for quite a while. When exactly will they turn the corner? I am just afraid they we might be saying the same thing 2-3 years from now. At times the offense has had even worse injury issues but manages to tough it out to a degree. The defense appears to be in this situation quite often & this didn't just start this season. I also understand the injury factor.

I agree about depth, but I believe it goes much deeper. No way any team should have laid down like the Redskins did on Sun - regardless of depth. It is not as if the Saints had the ball for an inordinate amt of time (Skins actually had the ball longer). Sure - part of this is physical & perhaps depth related, but it also appears to be mental & coaching related. Redskins really need to look at this closely over the offseason. This is very disturbing.

One thing for sure - D Hall has to be gone - he embarrassed himself against the Saints - age is catching up to him.

you have followed me for some time , i think one more good draft should do it . it would have happened this year if the injury bug didnt derail us

what would this d/line be like with allen ionman and taylor ? foster compton and brown , nicholson healthy and norman healthy ? , you add a good draft to that and we have something .

and you know about the o/line pryor's health , kelley CT , reed paul quick and grant . . i see a team on the cusp and one more good draft and we should have something . the depth to have our best players rested at crunch time

i dont think the defense laid down , i believe they were totally gassed with guys like hall who are done

 

[Breed]

guys overall our play calling has been pretty good execution however is wanting . on the 3rd down play paul missed a block . it doesnt mean the call sucked

here is an experiment , go back to our beginning days on SportsHoopla , and look at every game thread and post game reaction

i bet playing calling is mentrioned 10000 times

good teams dont slip on pass routes for open TDs they dont miss key blocks in key situations , they dont miss open wrs often , they dont let RBs juggled a ball into the end zone and miss a key tackle

yes some play calls are BS but the majority of the time the call is usually right

Hmmm, beginning days of the hoop eh. That sounds like it could be time consuming and rather unfruitful. I think I'm gonna keep rollin wit Jay Gruden is a shitty ass HC in the last 2 minutes of the first half and last 2 minutes of the game. He's put quite a bit of effort and work into it. I'm just letting him know we've noticed, lawdy dawdy, have we noticed that bitch. How can you not?

 

[Breed]

I appreciate the optimism, but you and me have been saying things like this for quite a while. When exactly will they turn the corner? I am just afraid they we might be saying the same thing 2-3 years from now. At times the offense has had even worse injury issues but manages to tough it out to a degree. The defense appears to be in this situation quite often & this didn't just start this season. I also understand the injury factor.

I agree about depth, but I believe it goes much deeper. No way any team should have laid down like the Redskins did on Sun - regardless of depth. It is not as if the Saints had the ball for an inordinate amt of time (Skins actually had the ball longer). Sure - part of this is physical & perhaps depth related, but it also appears to be mental & coaching related. Redskins really need to look at this closely over the offseason. This is very disturbing.

One thing for sure - D Hall has to be gone - he embarrassed himself against the Saints - age is catching up to him.

Not that anyone is counting mind you, but yeah, we're in year 3 of the 5 year rebuild and y''all are still using year 1 sayings. We've been in year one, learning how to win games against good teams mode for a minute now. And even worse, the squad continues to make year one fuck ups.

I'm not saying the Skins need to start playing for 2018 draft status mode, but we should start taking serious looks at some youngsters. Like Sprinkle, Harris, Everett, Moreau etc.

And age isn't catching up with Hall. Its already bagged n tagged him. He can't run, cover or tackle any more. His angles and anticipation are non-existent and yep. Safety is still a significant issue that needs to be addressed. We need a safety capable of legitimate pass coverage. Hall may be the worst safety we've had since the death of ST and that's saying a whole lot, way too much actually.

And how could anyone tell Niles Paul didn't block his man on the 3rd dn run by Perine? It looked like 3 dudes could've made a play on Perine for a loss.

And aside from Fuller's INT which was negated by an unfortunate and unintentional hands to the face penalty. WTF do they even have helmets, stop calling that ticky tack hands to the face bullshit. The Redskins defense was embarrassingly bad.

 

[skinsdad62]

my first year is assessment , year 2 you start getting the players you want , by year 3 you start to compete . i think we are at yr 3 stage however injuries really torpedoed it in yr 4 which i thought we could be contenders . i have maintained since gruden was hired we would need several good drafts to get to be what we want to be .

another good defensive draft and i think we can be there