Redskins' Kirk Cousins: Still far apart on extension terms

[gkekoa]

So....once again. Anything short of .... rather, not exceeding the Luck contract and it's an insult.
For a guy who isn't "all about the money" that 45 million guaranteed is a slap in the face. Lol. So much for taking a more than fair deal. Oh...that's right. We hurt his feelings so we should give him more just out of principle. Lmao.

Starting to hope we just go ahead and pay the guy. Let's just keep our fingers crossed and hope he is the next Drew Brees/Russell Wilson and not the next Tony Romo/Alex Smith (sitting here 3-4 years from now starting over...again).

Follow me here. He is making 24 million guaranteed this season. Why would he accept less than 50 million guaranteed, which is two years guaranteed salary? This number doesn't even include a signing bonus.

 

[Sportster 72]

It's a pretty simple formula, if KC kicks ass, gets us into the playoffs, wins some playoff games, eventually goes deep and maybe gets us into the NFCCG/SB then we won't be settling for anything. We won't be as you put it "chasing elite", we will have ELITE. If a good portion of the fan base and FO is looking for an out...or reason to dumb him, then you know what KC dies..he puts the team on his back, plays his ass off like the best QB in the game and makes himself irreplaceable. Then the FO can't do anything but pay the dude.

Sheesh, a TEAM makes the playoff. Not ONE player. I am so tire of these moronic statements.

 

[deanpet21]

OK First off, Dean wanted to Off Cousins for MONTHS leading up to the draft. SO I give his opinion about as much weight as fairy dust.

Secondly, put yourself in Kirk's Shoes for a moment. If he has the type of year it would require to convince you, Dean and the front office... WHY would he want to resign here??

Playing him on the tag again is hedging your bet that he will fail. Counting on next years QB class to be awesome is more than likely just going to piss Kirk off more, and personally I hope they do play him on the tag. Because I think if they do, he lights it up. But i also think that if he does that, he leaves. Think about that for a moment, Kirk would be the first Elite QB to hit FA when he is under the age of 30. He would be stupid to NOT test the market at that point.

I said off him if we were offered two first round picks by the 49ers. big difference Dr. Doom. Plus I was responding to the rumors that he wants 30m per season. I like how you forget to mention this Dr. doom. lol

 

[deanpet21]

Follow me here. He is making 24 million guaranteed this season. Why would he accept less than 50 million guaranteed, which is two years guaranteed salary? This number doesn't even include a signing bonus.

That is why there would be no long term deal this year.

 

[gkekoa]

That is why there would be no long term deal this year.

Now put yourself in KC's shoes. Why accept a cheap deal, when you can get another 50 mil guaranteed next season at a minimum? There is no reason for him to sign a cheap long term deal on a team that refuses to commit to him. There is little risk for KC considering he is behind a very good OL and playing in an offense he totally fits and has been very successful in for the last two seasons.

 

[deanpet21]

Now put yourself in KC's shoes. Why accept a cheap deal, when you can get another 50 mil guaranteed next season at a minimum? There is no reason for him to sign a cheap long term deal on a team that refuses to commit to him. There is little risk for KC considering he is behind a very good OL and playing in an offense he totally fits and has been very successful in for the last two seasons.

I understand that. Money wise it doesn't make sense for KC is sign now.

 

[Sportster 72]

I just don't get the "slap in the face" and the "we hurt his feelings" comment. When did he say that?

 

[Sharkinva]

I said off him if we were offered two first round picks by the 49ers. big difference Dr. Doom. Plus I was responding to the rumors that he wants 30m per season. I like how you forget to mention this Dr. doom. lol

Always an out with you Dean?? You started with we should trade him to the Niners, then hedged your bet from there. Its no wonder you are one of Bruce Allen's biggest fans.

 

[Sleepy T]

Why accept a cheap deal, when you can get another 50 mil guaranteed next season at a minimum? There is no reason for him to sign a cheap long term deal on a team that refuses to commit to him.

I was referencing that article gk. I was talking about basically giving KC at or slightly less than the Luck deal, APY, Signing bonus, length of contract, the whole package. Only difference is the 3rd year wasn't completely (or at all) guaranteed. That gives us an out after 2018 if he doesn't perform. If he performs, he gets that 3rd year anyways right?? That's far from a cheap LTD. That makes him one of the highest paid players in the game. Obviously that's what it's going to take. I get it....what's an extra year and 25 million... I guess not much to us, be we arent signing the checks. Doesn't that show some sign of commitment??? And sure, there is a reason to sign that deal. It's called 80 millish if he plays the first 3 years of his contract. 140-150 if he turns into that guy we hope he can be.

I just don't get the "slap in the face" and the "we hurt his feelings" comment. When did he say that?

KC nor his camp has said that. They have been total professionals about the situation and I commend him for that. That was honestly more of a smart ass comment for some of the fanbase that is acting like he is being treated like a 2nd class citizen because the FO isn't ready to throw the bank at him over a couple of good seasons. Maybe if Dak has another great season Big D should go ahead and forego the rest of his rookie contract and sign him LT to a $150 million contract. That is the equivalent of this situation...

 

[Sharkinva]

I was referencing that article gk. I was talking about basically giving KC at or slightly less than the Luck deal, APY, Signing bonus, length of contract, the whole package. Only difference is the 3rd year wasn't completely (or at all) guaranteed. That gives us an out after 2018 if he doesn't perform. If he performs, he gets that 3rd year anyways right?? That's far from a cheap LTD. That makes him one of the highest paid players in the game. Obviously that's what it's going to take. I get it....what's an extra year and 25 million... I guess not much to us, be we arent signing the checks. Doesn't that show some sign of commitment??? And sure, there is a reason to sign that deal. It's called 80 millish if he plays the first 3 years of his contract. 140-150 if he turns into that guy we hope he can be.

Please explain to me how $20M less in guaranteed money, and 2 years less of guaranteed employment is slightly less than what Luck got?? The Skins could give Kirk a $180M contract, and if the deal only included $3M more than he would get from playing on the tag, and was basically a one year guarantee, everyone would know it was a joke of a contract. Again, those numbers had ONE year of guaranteed salary, plus the Signing bonus. So in real numbers it was at best a Two year contract with an average yearly value of $13.5M. Also giving the Skins an out after year one where they would actually have more cap space by cutting him than keeping him. so year two in no way shape or form was guaranteed.

 

[deanpet21]

Always an out with you Dean?? You started with we should trade him to the Niners, then hedged your bet from there. Its no wonder you are one of Bruce Allen's biggest fans.

No I said that when his rumored contract demands were posted. Like other people

 

[skinsdad62]

Would you sign Alex Smith to this deal??

How well has that worked for us in the past? I see your your point sdad but are you prepared to be mediocre or even below average for the next 5-6 years because we jumped the gun on giving this guy a big $$$ LTD?? It's a possibility.

first off putting KC in the class of smith is foolish . we havent jumped any gun . the guy proved what he could do . why would you prefer a rookie and set us back 5-6 yrs to find elite ? KC isnt going to regress

 

[Sleepy T]

Please explain to me how $20M less in guaranteed money, and 2 years less of guaranteed employment is slightly less than what Luck got?? .

Well I would defer to you Shark. You are the resident contract/cap expert. But this is what I read, correct me where I am wrong...

KC gets $45 million guaranteed at signing, probably a 30ish signing bonus. Basically 2 years of salary. If he is still on the roster in 2019....throw him some more guaranteed money.

Lucks contract got the same signing bonus and guaranteed at signing. If he is on the roster in 2017 he gets more. They could cut him loose after that (obviously they won't) for minimal loss.

KCs contract would look similar but guaranteed money spread out over a longer period of time. After year two, yes, we could cut him loose if we are ready to move on with minimal loss.

That sound right??

 

[skinsdad62]

I said off him if we were offered two first round picks by the 49ers. big difference Dr. Doom. Plus I was responding to the rumors that he wants 30m per season. I like how you forget to mention this Dr. doom. lol

show me any offers from a credible source that said 30 mil per season . and it doesnt matter about what the price was you wanted him gone

 

[Sleepy T]

first off putting KC in the class of smith is foolish . we havent jumped any gun . the guy proved what he could do . why would you prefer a rookie and set us back 5-6 yrs to find elite ? KC isnt going to regress

You keep pointing to KC being a Top 85 player (as voted by the players). Smith is not far behind him on that list. Is KC a better player? Yes probably so. But I'm not sure the gap is all that great. I don't disagree with you, I'm not sure KC will regress, but I'm not sure he wasn't made somewhat better by the players around him, the system, and a lack of running game and defense that inflated his numbers. We've all argued this before. And some of the "so called experts" are in agreement with that. So it's not like a huge portion of the media and fanbase think KC is undoubtedly a future elite QB.

 

[Sharkinva]

Well I would defer to you Shark. You are the resident contract/cap expert. But this is what I read, correct me where I am wrong...

KC gets $45 million guaranteed at signing, probably a 30ish signing bonus. Basically 2 years of salary. If he is still on the roster in 2019....throw him some more guaranteed money.

Lucks contract got the same signing bonus and guaranteed at signing. If he is on the roster in 2017 he gets more. They could cut him loose after that (obviously they won't) for minimal loss
After that.

KCs contract would look similar but guaranteed money spread out over a longer period of time. After year two, yes, we could cut him loose with minimal loss.

That sound right??

That sounds like the adjustments they would need to make to get this deal to be fair.

But the original offer from the article was this...


The contract would have $27 million fully guaranteed at signing. That seems low but we’ll look at that in a minute. Cousins would get a $15 million signing bonus along with a $12 million fully guaranteed salary. The first-year cap hit would be $15 million, saving the team nearly $9 million in 2017 cap space. As it is, all of Cousins’ $23.94 million franchise tag salary counts against the 2017 cap.

Year 1 likely would be acceptable to Cousins. But what happens after that probably would not work for him but is not difficult to correct it. Cousins would get a salary of $18 million but the team could avoid that by releasing him prior to March. Their cap hit for walking away after one season would be $12 million. That would sting but it would be manageable.



The two bolded portions are the deal breakers. If all he is getting is $3M more than he currently has on the cap, and the team could walk away from the deal in year two and actually save $6M in cap space, why would Kirk or any one do the team a favor like that??


The over all numbers look OK, but the guaranteed money and years are deal breakers.

Now Im thinking $55M Fully guaranteed, would actually get it done. But again I dont think Kirk is going to risk taking a low guarantee and giving the team the ability to say... well we want to move in a different direction, lets hold Kirk til after the draft, make him a June 1st cut. Because IF he is going to be a Free agent in 2018, he wants to hit it when the market opens, not after the draft and mid way through OTAs.

 

[Sharkinva]

You keep pointing to KC being a Top 85 player (as voted by the players). Smith is not far behind him on that list. Is KC a better player? Yes probably so. But I'm not sure the gap is all that great. I don't disagree with you, I'm not sure KC will regress, but I'm not sure he wasn't made somewhat better by the players around him, the system, and a lack of running game and defense that inflated his numbers. We've all argued this before. And some of the "so called experts" are in agreement with that. So it's not like a huge portion of the media and fanbase think KC is undoubtedly a future elite QB.

Again, thats the real problem. You are willing to risk losing, or in the case of some are hoping we get rid of, a GOOD QB because it would likely prevent us from continuing the quest for an elite QB. Not for nothing, but I think you put Brady on this roster the last two years and we are still a 7-9 team.

 

[deanpet21]

show me any offers from a credible source that said 30 mil per season . and it doesnt matter about what the price was you wanted him gone

you still are clueless. I said I responded to the RUMORS not offers. Jesus Christ dude. read my posts before commenting.

 

[deanpet21]

Again, thats the real problem. You are willing to risk losing, or in the case of some are hoping we get rid of, a GOOD QB because it would likely prevent us from continuing the quest for an elite QB. Not for nothing, but I think you put Brady on this roster the last two years and we are still a 7-9 team.

lol. you still don't get the point. The Brady comment is just laughable. You actually think Brady would lose to the Giants at home to get into the playoffs? lol

 

[Sharkinva]

lol. you still don't get the point. The Brady comment is just laughable. You actually think Brady would lose to the Giants at home to get into the playoffs? lol

I think Brady looks real good when he has a defense that gives up an average of 16 points a game. Wonder how Cousins would look with a defense that good??

But yes I get it, Cousins isnt elite, so it makes perfect since to continue to chase after elite in the minds of some. The Patriots went 3-1 without Brady... so something tells me that the team around Tommy terrific has a bit more to do with it that the chasing elite crowd would ever admit to.