Front Office decisions

[deanpet21]

Dude, KC is gone. He's gone, skinsdad. Gone. G-O-N-E gone, and it's debateable if he even wanted to be here to begin with. He isn't worth $30 million. That's not really debateable either. He isn't.

You discount the redskins injuries. They had the makings of a fairly complete team before injuries decimated the roster.

We didn't lose both starting cb's b/c Norman is still here. You have no idea how good Moreau is going to be, and neither do I. The facts are that the redskins have addressed the secondary for multiple years in a row in the draft. Off the top of my head, I list the following drafted or undrafted players signed by the skins in recent memory:

fuller, richardson, moreau, hosley, cravens, everett, dumbar. They just resigned everett, who did VERY well at FS for two years and $2.6 million.

You are whining about moves a competent front office makes when faced with a difficult decision.

In fact, the signing of Alex Smith, while not "Sexy" is also not as bad as you think. It isn't. Sorry.

I cant see how any Skins fan could be anti Alex Smith right now. In the situation we were in he was the best option IMO.

 

[gkekoa]

I cant see how any Skins fan could be anti Alex Smith right now. In the situation we were in he was the best option IMO.

That is because you are a dumb ass.

 

[skinsdad62]

Dude, KC is gone. He's gone, skinsdad. Gone. G-O-N-E gone, and it's debateable if he even wanted to be here to begin with. He isn't worth $30 million. That's not really debateable either. He isn't.

You discount the redskins injuries. They had the makings of a fairly complete team before injuries decimated the roster.

We didn't lose both starting cb's b/c Norman is still here. You have no idea how good Moreau is going to be, and neither do I. The facts are that the redskins have addressed the secondary for multiple years in a row in the draft. Off the top of my head, I list the following drafted or undrafted players signed by the skins in recent memory:

fuller, richardson, moreau, hosley, cravens, everett, dumbar. They just resigned everett, who did VERY well at FS for two years and $2.6 million.

You are whining about moves a competent front office makes when faced with a difficult decision.

In fact, the signing of Alex Smith, while not "Sexy" is also not as bad as you think. It isn't. Sorry.

dude we all know he is gone . alex smith the fa signing would be a decent move , alex smith the trade is a fiasco

now let catch up on how the nfl is played today . a slot cb is now considered a starter do to the proliferation of the passing game . losing one starter BB and fuller means 2 starters .

i expect FM to be as good as fuller however depth , took a huge hit hosley has played 5 nfl snaps

cravens is out the door most likely , everette is a BU

who is richardson ?

but again if winding up in 3rd place in the NFC east is your standard , so be it

 

[gkekoa]

dude we all know he is gone . alex smith the fa signing would be a decent move , alex smith the trade is a fiasco

now let catch up on how the nfl is played today . a slot cb is now considered a starter do to the proliferation of the passing game . losing one starter BB and fuller means 2 starters .

i expect FM to be as good as fuller however depth , took a huge hit hosley has played 5 nfl snaps

cravens is out the door most likely , everette is a BU

who is richardson ?

but again if winding up in 3rd place in the NFC east is your standard , so be it

So I take it you believe we beat the NYG? I think you are crazy.

 

[Sleepy T]

yes and that should speak volumes about what KC did , and about the lack of depth on our defense

now if this makes me a hater , then so be it , but the eagles have us outclassed , and we were broomed by dallas . the giants had a butt ton of injuries as well so i dont know how saying we are 3rd in our division is somehow , short sighted

now we are older at qb , we lost both our startings cbs our ILB is on the verge of walking and i am to think we are making progress ? . now free agency and the draft will change things but i am not sure we closed the ground much on philly for sure or dallas (although were are close )

Well, the Iggles have hit paydirt with the roster they have. Gonna be really hard for us (and a lot of other teams) to match up with them the next couple years.

 

[Sportster 72]

You are whining about moves a competent front office makes when faced with a difficult decision.

That is the move of a competent FO to make a guy prove it for two years instead of finding a way to make a deal? It was widely reported Cousin's would have signed for $16 million during his first year as a starter but Scot and the FO didn't want to over pay. Cousin's is leaving because of BA's arrogance.

Do you remember in Cousin's and Griffin's first year when Cousin's led the team to a win over Cleveland. Did you know that DS and BA ran to RG's locker to make sure he was okay because Cousin had played well? They said nothing to Cousin's. shark pointed this out to you three years ago but you all just kept moving the bar. $10 million was too much, $20 million was too much, $24 million was too much, insert present number here is too much. It NEVER had to get to this point but the FO and many of you didn't want to sign him when it made sense.

 

[Sharkinva]

That is the move of a competent FO to make a guy prove it for two years instead of finding a way to make a deal? It was widely reported Cousin's would have signed for $16 million during his first year as a starter but Scot and the FO didn't want to over pay. Cousin's is leaving because of BA's arrogance.

Do you remember in Cousin's and Griffin's first year when Cousin's led the team to a win over Cleveland. Did you know that DS and BA ran to RG's locker to make sure he was okay because Cousin had played well? They said nothing to Cousin's. shark pointed this out to you three years ago but you all just kept moving the bar. $10 million was too much, $20 million was too much, $24 million was too much, insert present number here is too much. It NEVER had to get to this point but the FO and many of you didn't want to sign him when it made sense.

Well brother, now the bar is being moved the other way. Apparently while for the past three years the QB needed to be able to carry the team and win games for the team in the clutch. Now folks are perfectly content if the QB isnt the reason we lose games. And this will be seen as an improvement.

 

[Sportster 72]

Well brother, now the bar is being moved the other way. Apparently while for the past three years the QB needed to be able to carry the team and win games for the team in the clutch. Now folks are perfectly content if the QB isnt the reason we lose games. And this will be seen as an improvement.

And of course you know as well as I do that it is all about justification for their opinions of the past three years.

We can all hash this out from now until Sept. Proof is in the pudding in three years.

 

[Breed]

There were certainly some windows there when Kirk could have...should have been traded. However... during the time periods he was under the tag (which was most of the time in the last couple years), he didn’t have to accept a trade from anyone...am I correct in saying that? Dude was very quick to sign the tag every time. Do you not think it is debatable as to whether played us like a fiddle as well??

The FO did what they had to do to acquire an above average starting QB. Take a look at what Cleveland gave up for TT, SF gave up for Grap, and it’s quite obvious to me that Washington did not give up much more for Smith than many other teams would have. Not necessarily a pimp move, but a necessary move if we want to have any chance of staying relevant over the next few years. Anyone that doesn’t realize that is a fucking idiot.

This fanboy article is spot on. It’s what many, not all, folks..media, fans, players have been echoing all along... that Kirk Cousins is not without fault here. Sure, BA and the FO have to take some of the blame too.

Writer also made some great points about what this front office has done wrt FA signings in the last several years. That not everyone in the entire building is stupid. Hey, No one is perfect, but that article shows proof that our FO has been pretty damned good with FA signings and drafting players. Not perfect, but plenty good.

Funny, I don’t see any of the Doom Crew disputing any of those facts. Just still crying about KC being gone...

No one is disputing the facts this writer is using and apparently gave you a woody. He's using said facts though to support, wait for it, his own fuckin opinion. Or do you not see that?

Here's an unmitigated fact for his ass that needs no op-ed spin. Alex Smith has never ever ever been an All Pro QB.

And as Alex has been dumped for what his HC thought was a better option......twice now in his career. I'd opine that he's no franchise QB either.

When all the fuck you can do is use prudent cap management for a one team. Terrible cap management for other teams and speak on how drafts are now different/better than 3-5 years ago. In a conversation about a game where wins and losses on the field are all that really matter. Your argument is at best misplaced and at worst ass backwards and nonsensical.

I didn't read the whole thing. Tell me, did the writer ever mention the Skins W/L record since Allen joined the FO? If he didn't I suspect that's cuz its an undisputed fact of suckitude. That could very easily lead the reader to form a very strong opinion that as a football GM. Bruce Allen sucks swollen blue whale nuts. See what I did there?

Peace

 

[Stymietee]

Are you guys still debating Kirk fuckin' Cousins? Why?

With him we were 9-7, 8-7-1 and 7-9, end of story.

Yes injuries hurt this team last year, yes, he had no supporting defense, yes they got rid of two 1,000 yard receivers and no Kirk is not what some are making him out to be nor as weak as others view him. QB is no more than 1 of 11 on offense, the NFL doesn't mimic Motown, where there's an "&" to describe the other 10 after spouting his name.

Tell you guys something else too, a whole lot of credit for finishing as well as we did after all of those injuries goes to J. Gruden and his coaching staff for not having guys quit on them, and taking the healthy, and, putting them in position to compete and win.

What might have happened with good health, who knows? In fact, it's not worth debating unless there's some small print in the NFL rule book that gives extra credit to teams with guys that SHOULD have played, except for injury, they couldn't.

Dumb trade or not, Alex Smith, now has his turn here in this meat grinder, and, just like he did with Kirk, Gruden will game plan to his strengths, with the hope of winning as many games as he can. We can all project based upon this thing or that thing, but believing that we've been more than an 8-8 type team with Kirk, and, in 2018 we would have gone to the playoffs is without merit.

Using historical stats, this team is destined to win 9 or 10 games this year, without mentioning who's at QB. Stats as everyone knows can be used to justify and refute almost anything. Even these historical ones, when matched against the last three seasons, shows us, a trend towards a 6 win season following seasons of 9, 8, and 7 wins. No matter who the QB happens to be, whether we get 10 or 6 wins this year, will largely fall upon the HC and his staff to game plan our team towards them.

 

[j_y19]

It amazes me that there are some still defending this FO. Cousins is GONE. That is a fact. This debate isn't about if Cousins should still be here or not. Its about how this FO could let the most valuable asset in the NFL this offseason walk without receiving any compensation to really speak of. That is complete mismanagement.

I also find it laughable that the ones that were so critical of KC and never gave him any credit for his play on a team full of injuries last year are now offering those injuries as an excuse as to why this FO shouldn't be held accountable for our record last year. That is the definition of hypocrisy.

The bottom line is that this FO fucked up this entire situation since the drafting of RG3 and KC. Every move they have made to address this position was the wrong move. EVERY SINGLE ONE. They bet that KC would fail. They expected to be able to sign him on the cheap after he stumbled. They lost that bet because he never did. Once they understood that KC wasn't going to stay here long term, their primary focus should have turned to maximizing the return for the team when he left. As Dad stated, they had no foresight. They could have traded him to SF, LA or a few other teams last offseason and KC would have welcomed those trades.

 

[Sleepy T]

It amazes me that there are some still defending this FO. Cousins is GONE. That is a fact. This debate isn't about if Cousins should still be here or not. Its about how this FO could let the most valuable asset in the NFL this offseason walk without receiving any compensation to really speak of. That is complete mismanagement.

I also find it laughable that the ones that were so critical of KC and never gave him any credit for his play on a team full of injuries last year are now offering those injuries as an excuse as to why this FO shouldn't be held accountable for our record last year. That is the definition of hypocrisy.

The bottom line is that this FO fucked up this entire situation since the drafting of RG3 and KC. Every move they have made to address this position was the wrong move. EVERY SINGLE ONE. They bet that KC would fail. They expected to be able to sign him on the cheap after he stumbled. They lost that bet because he never did. Once they understood that KC wasn't going to stay here long term, their primary focus should have turned to maximizing the return for the team when he left. As Dad stated, they had no foresight. They could have traded him to SF, LA or a few other teams last offseason and KC would have welcomed those trades.

The Cousins situation wasn’t handled properly. It’s easy to see that now. He should have been traded last offseason. Obviously there were some “mixed signals” there. I think if KC truly wanted out of here, he wasn’t willing to go out on a limb and say that. Do you folks honestly think the FO doesn’t try to move him last off-season if KC asks for a trade or gives any sort of indication he absolutely does not want to be here?

Why? Because he was perfectly fucking fine getting paid huge $$$ on the tag so he could kick the can down the road again, setting up him up for an even BIGGER tag or payday. I think he would have listened to our FO if we were willing to pay him $100 million over the next few years.

 

[Sleepy T]

No one is disputing the facts this writer is using and apparently gave you a woody. He's using said facts though to support, wait for it, his own fuckin opinion. Or do you not see that?

Here's an unmitigated fact for his ass that needs no op-ed spin. Alex Smith has never ever ever been an All Pro QB.

And as Alex has been dumped for what his HC thought was a better option......twice now in his career. I'd opine that he's no franchise QB either.

When all the fuck you can do is use prudent cap management for a one team. Terrible cap management for other teams and speak on how drafts are now different/better than 3-5 years ago. In a conversation about a game where wins and losses on the field are all that really matter. Your argument is at best misplaced and at worst ass backwards and nonsensical.

I didn't read the whole thing. Tell me, did the writer ever mention the Skins W/L record since Allen joined the FO? If he didn't I suspect that's cuz its an undisputed fact of suckitude. That could very easily lead the reader to form a very strong opinion that as a football GM. Bruce Allen sucks swollen blue whale nuts. See what I did there?

Peace

Umm Ok. So what is your point? Neither was Kirk? Only a couple handfuls of guys have been “All Pro” since Smith has been in the league. Most of those spots were tied up by the best QBs of this generation, Brady, Brees, Manning, and Rodgers. Throw in a Newton here, and a Big Ben there. No one has ever tried to put Dmith in the same class as those guys..

As far as wins and losses... yeah, we haven’t any better much with Bruce in the drivers seat. Not saying I love the guy or the job that he has done. Wouldn’t mind seeing someone new in there myself making personnel decisions. Just pointing out that he hasn’t done nearly as bad as some of you claim. Everyone is quick to blame him %100 for the KC situation when that simply isn’t true. Sometimes it goes beyond wins and losses.

 

[Sharkinva]

Are people seriously suggesting Bruce Allen is Competent as a GM??

Fact, his record as GM for the Bucs 38-42

His record as GM for the Raiders... an astounding 64-64

And we all know what we have with the Redskins..... .396

So IM going to use a term I saw thrown around on this board entirely too often over the past three years...

Bruce Allen is at best a MEDIOCRE individual when it comes to General manager competence.

 

[j_y19]

Are people seriously suggesting Bruce Allen is Competent as a GM??

Fact, his record as GM for the Bucs 38-42

His record as GM for the Raiders... an astounding 64-64

And we all know what we have with the Redskins..... .396

So IM going to use a term I saw thrown around on this board entirely too often over the past three years...

Bruce Allen is at best a MEDIOCRE individual when it comes to General manager competence.

You are being very generous to Bruce. There is nothing he has done to actually classify him as mediocre. Maybe his fans can actually point to any accomplishments he was directly responsible for to make him mediocre?

 

[Sharkinva]

You are being very generous to Bruce. There is nothing he has done to actually classify him as mediocre. Maybe his fans can actually point to any accomplishments he was directly responsible for to make him mediocre?

Yes but it has been made very clear to me that to hate Bruce is to hate the Redskins. Thus after a week off Fishing the outer Banks, Im feeling a bit more relaxed and generous... I figure it will last until at least next Monday.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Yes but it has been made very clear to me that to hate Bruce is to hate the Redskins. Thus after a week off Fishing the outer Banks, Im feeling a bit more relaxed and generous... I figure it will last until at least next Monday.

Eh - life is too short. Plenty of other things to enjoy regardless of the fate of the Redskins. In terms of who is or is not a fan - IMO you can certainly hate Snyder/Allen & still be a huge fan of the Redskins. I pretty much fall into that category.

The issue I have is if any fans are actually hoping for moves to fail or not supporting certain players (e.g. Alex Smith) who currently play for the Skins. I could be wrong, but I get the feeling that some folks will be happy if these moves fail simply so that they can say "I told you so" as if validation from a forum likes this means anything at all.

Let's just wait & see how these moves pan out until completely badmouthing them. I seem to recall some folks here completely trashing Doctson before he made some contributions (when his only real fault was being injured - not sure how a human being can control that). I realize that a lot of folks here believe that they know just about everything, but in reality that is far from the truth.

HTTR

 

[gkekoa]

Eh - life is too short. Plenty of other things to enjoy regardless of the fate of the Redskins. In terms of who is or is not a fan - IMO you can certainly hate Snyder/Allen & still be a huge fan of the Redskins. I pretty much fall into that category.

The issue I have is if any fans are actually hoping for moves to fail or not supporting certain players (e.g. Alex Smith) who currently play for the Skins. I could be wrong, but I get the feeling that some folks will be happy if these moves fail simply so that they can say "I told you so" as if validation from a forum likes this means anything at all.

Let's just wait & see how these moves pan out until completely badmouthing them. I seem to recall some folks here completely trashing Doctson before he made some contributions (when his only real fault was being injured - not sure how a human being can control that). I realize that a lot of folks here believe that they know just about everything, but in reality that is far from the truth.

HTTR

Nobody is not supporting of Alex Smith. We are not supportive of the trade that landed him here.

As for not cheering for Alex...let me make sure my position is fully known. I hope we win the SB. Now, if we are set to win only eight games, I hope we win only two games so maybe Bruce Allen can be fired because I truly believe that IS what is best for this team.

 

[skinz2winz]

That is the move of a competent FO to make a guy prove it for two years instead of finding a way to make a deal? It was widely reported Cousin's would have signed for $16 million during his first year as a starter but Scot and the FO didn't want to over pay. Cousin's is leaving because of BA's arrogance.

Do you remember in Cousin's and Griffin's first year when Cousin's led the team to a win over Cleveland. Did you know that DS and BA ran to RG's locker to make sure he was okay because Cousin had played well? They said nothing to Cousin's. shark pointed this out to you three years ago but you all just kept moving the bar. $10 million was too much, $20 million was too much, $24 million was too much, insert present number here is too much. It NEVER had to get to this point but the FO and many of you didn't want to sign him when it made sense.

Cousins is leaving because he will not be part of anything BA is part of. In essence, he took his ball and went home. Can't say I disagree with Cousins but, none the less he didn't want to be here, period. I'm not making excuses for anyone, the FO or Cousins. Divorce was imminent and its time to move on for everyone involved. All the speculation, KC said, FO said, offer, no offer, diminished offer, WTF cares anymore.

 

[Sharkinva]

Eh - life is too short. Plenty of other things to enjoy regardless of the fate of the Redskins. In terms of who is or is not a fan - IMO you can certainly hate Snyder/Allen & still be a huge fan of the Redskins. I pretty much fall into that category.

The issue I have is if any fans are actually hoping for moves to fail or not supporting certain players (e.g. Alex Smith) who currently play for the Skins. I could be wrong, but I get the feeling that some folks will be happy if these moves fail simply so that they can say "I told you so" as if validation from a forum likes this means anything at all.

Let's just wait & see how these moves pan out until completely badmouthing them. I seem to recall some folks here completely trashing Doctson before he made some contributions (when his only real fault was being injured - not sure how a human being can control that). I realize that a lot of folks here believe that they know just about everything, but in reality that is far from the truth.

HTTR

I totally get what you are saying, but here is the thing.

If I wasnt a fan of Smith before we made the trade, and I thought he was a bad idea then. Why should my opinion of him magically change because the Redskins made the trade for him. By the converse, if I was a fan of Cousins, and I thought he was a very good QB while he was here, again why should that change??

DO I hope it fails? Not really.

Do I expect Smith to be the guy to get us a SUper Bowl.... again not really. I think we downgraded at the QB spot, and it will be interesting to see if they manage to upgrade the rest of the team enough to compensate. But at the end of the day, I do expect it to fail. It will be entertaining, and I expect Dan and Bruce to drum up alot of interest to get butts in the seats early on. But I dont expect this to be a happy place come November.