Felix and the 2014 CY

[SlinkyRedfoot]

You can troll me. I don't care. I'm message board - hardened from 9 years on the CBS boards. CBS was not a place for nice people. But, this isn't a troll-tolerant place. If you need an outlet like that, you should find a second boarrd to hang out on.

Yeah, I'm not trolling anyone. I'm talking about the CY. Look at my posts except for the ones where I'm responding to the actual troll.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Fuck off and die, fool.

Hernandez had a 1.66 ERA in September. If he was tired at the end, it certainly didn't show.

 

[cezero]

Yeah, I'm not trolling anyone. I'm talking about the CY. Look at my posts except for the ones where I'm responding to the actual troll.

lots of non-trolling here

I'll remember when I come to the Mariners thread that I need to be a little more delicate with you guys.

Sorry I said something not nice about Hernandez, fanboy.

... I'm not surprised there are a lot of butthurt Mariners fans.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

lots of non-trolling here

I love how you dice up the thread and leave your trolling off the record. Pussy.

 

[cezero]

after years on the espn boards, it's been nice not having any resident shitheads like stinky on this m's board.

anyhoo, too bad for Felix, but that's the way close races go. here's to next year.

 

[cezero]

I love how you dice up the thread and leave your trolling off the record. Pussy.

love how you said you were only directing your adolescent trolling toward me

I'll remember when I come to the Mariners thread that I need to be a little more delicate with you guys.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Regardless, it looks pretty close to me and, honestly, I'm a little surprised Kluber won it. I'm not surprised there are a lot of butthurt Mariners fans.

There's the "butthurt" comment in context. Most folks without thin skin would not find that very inflammatory.

Here's your response, the first attacks directed to someone:

nobody has said kluber was undeserving, girlfriend.

if there are butthurt M's fans on here, feel free to talk to them about it. otherwise, take your trolling punk ass off of the m's board, please.

That "girlfriend" bit is still cracking me up. Do you have really long fingernails painted multi-color and bedazzled?

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

after years on the espn boards, it's been nice not having any resident shitheads like stinky on this m's board.

anyhoo, too bad for Felix, but that's the way close races go. here's to next year.

Brilliant!

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

love how you said you were only directing your adolescent trolling toward me

Seriously, would you quit trolling me? I'm here to talk about the CY Award.

 

[cezero]

There's the blah blah balh

please keep demonstrating that you're not a troll

you're doing a great job

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I'm the biggest troll on the thread, but I have wickedly thin skin, so I'm not going to leave Slinky alone. He's kinda cute, too.

Seriously, son, stick with the Cy Young Award.

 

[Dolemite censored]

Not surprisingly, Dole has made an inaccurate comment about baseball.

Shows how much I care about it.

 

[cezero]

you did as you were told

please continue

 

[blstoker]

I was surprised to see that Felix didn't get it, and I won't lie. Kluber came on late in the season, sure, but for the most part Felix had the better year (statistically). Before people get into the Cleveland being more hitter friendly than Seattle, Felix still had a 2.21 ERA on the road (still, much lower than Kluber, and still would have been a career low). In fact, Felix had 3 months this season where his ERA was sub 2.00 (Kluber 1) and even had an overall sub 2.00 going into August, and despite that aforementioned game against Toronto he still had a 1.66 ERA in September. Before people tell me that Kluber had a higher WAR, tell me how that stat is configured and why different places have different numbers for that stat.

In the end, Kluber wins, it's his award. It isn't like the 1992 ROY where someone I felt was undeserving won the award. Also, these are the same people who gave the DH of the year award to the same guy they gave the 1B gold glove to (Palmeiro, 1999).

 

[cezero]

I was surprised to see that Felix didn't get it, and I won't lie. Kluber came on late in the season, sure, but for the most part Felix had the better year (statistically). Before people get into the Cleveland being more hitter friendly than Seattle, Felix still had a 2.21 ERA on the road (still, much lower than Kluber, and still would have been a career low). In fact, Felix had 3 months this season where his ERA was sub 2.00 (Kluber 1) and even had an overall sub 2.00 going into August, and despite that aforementioned game against Toronto he still had a 1.66 ERA in September. Before people tell me that Kluber had a higher WAR, tell me how that stat is configured and why different places have different numbers for that stat.

In the end, Kluber wins, it's his award. It isn't like the 1992 ROY where someone I felt was undeserving won the award. Also, these are the same people who gave the DH of the year award to the same guy they gave the 1B gold glove to (Palmeiro, 1999).

PV shared the ERA+ stat that tries to eliminate ballpark factors. It's compelling, but I don't think enough of the BBWA care about SABR stuff for it to factor too much.

Felix set some records this year that no AL pitcher will match for a very long time. Nobody can take that away, and I have a feeling posterity will debate this one for awhile.

I like Kluber a lot, and hope to see him factor in the CY race for years to come.

I don't pretend to understand pitcher WAR.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

If Chris Sale hadn't missed 8 starts, the award would have been his. When he was on the mound, he was the best pitcher in the AL last year.

subtract any 8 starts from Felix's year, and his numbers are categorically better than sale's i'd wager.

That second bit is Dole-level craziness.

I took Hernandez' starts from 8/5, 8/11, 9/3, 6/8, 6/29, 7/19, 9/8 and 9/18 (arguably his eight best starts), and subtracted their numbers from his season totals.

FH - 26 G - 178 IP - 53 ER - 176 K - 2.68 ERA
CS - 26 G - 174 IP - 42 ER - 208 K - 2.17 ERA

It's also worth noting that of those eight starts that I selected as his best, five of them were in the second half and three are from September, when Dole was sure he was running out of gas.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I was surprised to see that Felix didn't get it, and I won't lie. Kluber came on late in the season, sure, but for the most part Felix had the better year (statistically). Before people get into the Cleveland being more hitter friendly than Seattle, Felix still had a 2.21 ERA on the road (still, much lower than Kluber, and still would have been a career low). In fact, Felix had 3 months this season where his ERA was sub 2.00 (Kluber 1) and even had an overall sub 2.00 going into August, and despite that aforementioned game against Toronto he still had a 1.66 ERA in September. Before people tell me that Kluber had a higher WAR, tell me how that stat is configured and why different places have different numbers for that stat.

In the end, Kluber wins, it's his award. It isn't like the 1992 ROY where someone I felt was undeserving won the award. Also, these are the same people who gave the DH of the year award to the same guy they gave the 1B gold glove to (Palmeiro, 1999).

I'm with you in being surprised that Kluber got it, but with the exception of March, he was good all season. It's probably just that no one took him seriously, or noticed, until the end of the season that gives the perception that he came on late.

 

[cezero]

That second bit is Dole-level craziness.

I took Hernandez' starts from 8/5, 8/11, 9/3, 6/8, 6/29, 7/19, 9/8 and 9/18 (arguably his eight best starts), and subtracted their numbers from his season totals.

FH - 26 G - 178 IP - 53 ER - 176 K - 2.68 ERA
CS - 26 G - 174 IP - 42 ER - 208 K - 2.17 ERA

It's also worth noting that of those eight starts that I selected as his best, five of them were in the second half and three are from September, when Dole was sure he was running out of gas.

I was waiting for somebody to post it.

I have no problem with admitting when I'm wrong, and I wasn't sure about this one.

It's interesting to postulate what would've happened if Sale had pitched all of those starts, too.

I'll try to control my "Dole-level craziness" in the future. Your opinion means a lot to me.

 

[cezero]

I agree 100% with you post. I think people keep pointing to that Toronto start for Felix but ignoring a start in early September where Kluber got beat up by the Tigers. I hate to think that an award that should be given for a 6 month season was decided by 1 start that happened in the final week.

I also heard some people rationalize the Kluber choice by citing ballpark metrics (Safeco vs. Progressvive), team defense and catcher's framing ability. In those cases it could be writers just trying be that "outside the box thinker."

I reiterate that Kluber was a stud this year and well deserving of the award. I just hope that he won because all of those writers thought he was the better pitcher over 6 months and not anything else.

I heard some guys on MLB network and on my way in to work today talking about all kinds of crazy things. Even the defense behind the pitchers and W/L record and stuff.

I can only imagine what the ESPN crew were talking about.

PV's data about ERA+ negates the ballpark differences statistically, but I guess that doesn't matter much.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

It's interesting to postulate what would've happened if Sale had pitched all of those starts, too.

There's that. There also that, when making this comparison, I don't think it's fair to eliminate Hernandez' eight best starts, but you said "any."

The real question now is, which team will Cleveland trade Kluber to for a half dozen Penthouse mags, a case of big league chew and a fungo bat?