Game Thread: Wisconsin vs. Kentucky

[TrollyMcTroller]

Shank-a-Frank™ ALT0153
Shank-a-Frank® ALT0174
Shank-a-Frank© ALT0169

not positive, but I believe © would have been more appropriate than ™...even better would be a "pat.pend" on the process.

I'm pretty sure trademark is most appropriate.

Three-peat is a portmanteau of the words three and repeat, which has been trademarked for commercial use by retired basketball coach Pat Riley; the active trademarks in force are registered under numbers 1552980, 1878690, and 1886018. (A fourth registration, #1977620, expired in 2003.) It is used either as a verb or noun used in American sports to refer to winning a third championship in a row.

But thanks for the Alt Codes.

 

[Runeman]

Yeah, that's good stuff Trolley; we all have our slant on how things will work out.. One thing for sure, this is a final 4 game and both teams are there to win. I love this match up because it's so different than the Wisconsin/ Arizona game and kaminski will have to play a different game. As I mentioned before, can the Harrisons contain Brust, Gasser, Jackson and Dekker...I think not and also don't think Wisconsin deals with Johnson, Lee, Randle, and Poythress down low....and the X factor just might be James Young. What a great match up.

 

[BigAppleBadger]

If Kentucky plays man then Wisconsin's guards are going to need to be able to take what they're given, either outside shots or get around defenders with some penetration if the Wildcats' bigs want to play on the perimeter. Does Kentucky ever play zone? The Badgers did well against Baylor's, but Kentucky has more length which past Wisconsin teams have struggled against (i.e., Syracuse).

Dekker needs to have a big night along with Nigel Hayes, they're the only other guys Wisconsin has with size that can handle the ball.

 

[Codaxx]

Yeah, that's good stuff Trolley; we all have our slant on how things will work out.. One thing for sure, this is a final 4 game and both teams are there to win. I love this match up because it's so different than the Wisconsin/ Arizona game and kaminski will have to play a different game. As I mentioned before, can the Harrisons contain Brust, Gasser, Jackson and Dekker...I think not and also don't think Wisconsin deals with Johnson, Lee, Randle, and Poythress down low....and the X factor just might be James Young. What a great match up.

I have said that Young is the X factor. He can fill it up and he is a mismatch in this game, but he can be streaky. I fully expect Wisconsin to pack it in similar to Michigan. They left UK free all game at the 3pt line, except on the last 3. UK will have a lot of open looks outside, but they need to be patient. Wisconsin was a poor rebounding team this year, they finished 111th in rebounding percentage at 51%. UK was #2. Wisky has done better in the tourney. UK will play man in this game mostly. 6'6" guards will be tough for Wisconsin to shoot over. If UK is disciplined and stays with their man they should be fine on defense. Perhaps the biggest key will be the first 10 minutes. UK has been thoroughly out-played in the opening 10 minutes the last 3 games falling behind 10 pts or more in each. That is like 20 pts vs the snail paced Badgers.

 

[Codaxx]

If Kentucky plays man then Wisconsin's guards are going to need to be able to take what they're given, either outside shots or get around defenders with some penetration if the Wildcats' bigs want to play on the perimeter. Does Kentucky ever play zone? The Badgers did well against Baylor's, but Kentucky has more length which past Wisconsin teams have struggled against (i.e., Syracuse).

Dekker needs to have a big night along with Nigel Hayes, they're the only other guys Wisconsin has with size that can handle the ball.

Neither Dekker or Hayes will have much of a size advantage. The smallest starter for UK is 6'6", Dekker and Hayes are 6'7". Dekker does wiegh in at 250. UK has more of an issue with quick guards, especially if Cauley Stein is not playing.

 

[BigAppleBadger]

Neither Dekker or Hayes will have much of a size advantage. The smallest starter for UK is 6'6", Dekker and Hayes are 6'7". Dekker does wiegh in at 250. UK has more of an issue with quick guards, especially if Cauley Stein is not playing.

I didn't say they'd have a size advantage, just that they've got better size than Jackson, Brust or Gasser. But I'm glad to hear they have a problem with quick guards.

Hayes also weighs 250, btw... he's pretty strong.

 

[Codaxx]

I didn't say they'd have a size advantage, just that they've got better size than Jackson, Brust or Gasser. But I'm glad to hear they have a problem with quick guards.

Hayes also weighs 250, btw... he's pretty strong.

Harrison twins are both 6'6", so they pretty much always have a height advantage. They do give up some quickness, especially vs quick PGs. Russ Smith was a prime example, even if there are few that can match his speed with the ball. Wisconsin will win if this game is going to be about discipline and patience. If it is a referendum on athletic ability, Wisconsin is done. One thing not mentioned is the pace and either teams ability to control it. UK wants this game in the 70s. I have a feeling Wisconsin will get their pace, which is why I am worried about a slow start

 

[Runeman]

Harrison twins are both 6'6", so they pretty much always have a height advantage. They do give up some quickness, especially vs quick PGs. Russ Smith was a prime example, even if there are few that can match his speed with the ball. Wisconsin will win if this game is going to be about discipline and patience. If it is a referendum on athletic ability, Wisconsin is done. One thing not mentioned is the pace and either teams ability to control it. UK wants this game in the 70s. I have a feeling Wisconsin will get their pace, which is why I am worried about a slow start

Yeah, Pace of play has not been discussed. I'm not sure what the pace will be as it seems that both teams are content to causally take the ball down the court and both teams seem reluctant to press a lot. I don't think the Harrisons are very good at pressing smaller guards and I'm not sure Wisconsin wants to have their two guards at half court with the ball inside. This is another facet of this game that will be interesting to see play out.

 

[Smart]

So because the Harrison twins are 6'6, it by definition makes them better athletes? Th Harrison twins have combined for 6.0 RPG. Ben Brust, by himself, has averaged 4.9 RPG the last two years. Josh Gasser and Jackson combine for almost 8 RPG. It's not because of alertness alone. It's because they're fucking fast and have the ability to leap with a group of big men and come down with the ball.

I'm not one to scream racism, but the only way this Kentucky is "way more athletic" than we are is by only focusing on skin color. Our eight-man rotation is every bit as strong and fast as they are.

 

[Codaxx]

So because the Harrison twins are 6'6, it by definition makes them better athletes? Th Harrison twins have combined for 6.0 RPG. Ben Brust, by himself, has averaged 4.9 RPG the last two years. Josh Gasser and Jackson combine for almost 8 RPG. It's not because of alertness alone. It's because they're fucking fast and have the ability to leap with a group of big men and come down with the ball.

I'm not one to scream racism, but the only way this Kentucky is "way more athletic" than we are is by only focusing on skin color. Our eight-man rotation is every bit as strong and fast as they are.

First off, I said they were 6'6", because of that size they give up some speed. Your rebounding stats are meaningless. Harrison dont rebound a lot, because they are not asked to rebound. UK finished #2 in rebound percentage. WIsconsin was 111. Glad Wisky guards rebound a little better, imagine where if they didnt?

 

[Smart]

First off, I said they were 6'6", because of that size they give up some speed. Your rebounding stats are meaningless. Harrison dont rebound a lot, because they are not asked to rebound. UK finished #2 in rebound percentage. WIsconsin was 111. Glad Wisky guards rebound a little better, imagine where if they didnt?

We've also outrebounded Baylor and Zona (two of the best rebounding teams in America) in our last two games. The reason isn't the guards...it's because Frank Kaminsky has stepped up. For all the talk about our lack of atheticism, Frank and Dekker just haven't been that smart in seeking out rebounds. Frank turned it around towards the end of the year after slumping for much of the season. Sam is still slumping and hasn't played anywhere near his best.

None of it has anything to do with athleticism. Both Sam and Frank will be drafted. Blaming it on athleticism is just the easy way out.

 

[Codaxx]

We've also outrebounded Baylor and Zona (two of the best rebounding teams in America) in our last two games. The reason isn't the guards...it's because Frank Kaminsky has stepped up. For all the talk about our lack of atheticism, Frank and Dekker just haven't been that smart in seeking out rebounds. Frank turned it around towards the end of the year after slumping for much of the season. Sam is still slumping and hasn't played anywhere near his best.

None of it has anything to do with athleticism. Both Sam and Frank will be drafted. Blaming it on athleticism is just the easy way out.

You didnt outrebound Zona, but it was pretty much a stand still. If if none of this has to do with athleticism, than what the hell was your last post about?

 

[Runeman]

So because the Harrison twins are 6'6, it by definition makes them better athletes? Th Harrison twins have combined for 6.0 RPG. Ben Brust, by himself, has averaged 4.9 RPG the last two years. Josh Gasser and Jackson combine for almost 8 RPG. It's not because of alertness alone. It's because they're fucking fast and have the ability to leap with a group of big men and come down with the ball.

I'm not one to scream racism, but the only way this Kentucky is "way more athletic" than we are is by only focusing on skin color. Our eight-man rotation is every bit as strong and fast as they are.

I think what was meant was the inside strength and athletic ability of Kentucky is the best in the country. Doesn't mean Wisconsin is not strong inside. Kaminski showed us all he is some kind of player.

I think your race comment is completely unwarranted. Dakari Johnson is 7-0 and 265, Randle is 6-9 245 Cauley-Stein is 7-0 250, Lee is 7-0 230, Poythress is 6-9 225. These are big men and they are physical. The Harrisons are 6-6. Kentucky is one very large team and for Wisconsin to win, Wisconsin has to figure a way to out play that team; not out pound on them. I believe Wisconsin has to do something other than think Kaminski is going to have any kind of a game he had against the much weaker inside team of Arizona. I'm sure Bo Ryan has a plan; I just don't know what it is. Again, for me the two guys that can be the X factors are Young and Dekker.

 

[Smart]

You didnt outrebound Zona, but it was pretty much a stand still. If if none of this has to do with athleticism, than what the hell was your last post about?

It's all about athleticism. The point is that our guards are just as athletic as theirs, if not more. Anybody who's ever seen them play knows they often go up into crowds against bigger, "more athletic" guys and they come away with it. Your counterpoint was rebounding percentage (which is in itself biased, since we played have played the #2 hardest schedule, but I'll let that go). And as I said, that has to do with Frank and Sam misplaying balls and just not playing smart. It has nothing to do with athleticism. Dekker was projected as a potential lottery pick despite not even starting last year. Why is that? Athleticism. And do I really need to tell you why Frank has plenty of athleticism after he made the best defensive team in America look like mincemeat?

Can we quit the "Kentucky is more athletic" shit? Again, it's not grounded in reality. Kentucky has a freakish talent in Randle. He's the best player on the floor, and mainly based on savvy. Our guards are just as athletic as theirs. Dekker is just as athletic as Young. Frank is as more athletic than Culley-Stein or Dakari, and Nigel is even with Poythress. If we lose, it'll because their big men are more technically sound or they shot better. It'll have nothing to do with athleticism.

 

[Codaxx]

It's all about athleticism. The point is that our guards are just as athletic as theirs, if not more. Anybody who's ever seen them play knows they often go up into crowds against bigger, "more athletic" guys and they come away with it. Your counterpoint was rebounding percentage (which is in itself biased, since we played have played the #2 hardest schedule, but I'll let that go). And as I said, that has to do with Frank and Sam misplaying balls and just not playing smart. It has nothing to do with athleticism. Dekker was projected as a potential lottery pick despite not even starting last year. Why is that? Athleticism. And do I really need to tell you why Frank has plenty of athleticism after he made the best defensive team in America look like mincemeat?

Can we quit the "Kentucky is more athletic" shit? Again, it's not grounded in reality. Kentucky has a freakish talent in Randle. He's the best player on the floor, and mainly based on savvy. Our guards are just as athletic as theirs. Dekker is just as athletic as Young. Frank is as more athletic than Culley-Stein or Dakari, and Nigel is even with Poythress. If we lose, it'll because their big men are more technically sound or they shot better. It'll have nothing to do with athleticism.

How is rebounding percentage more biased? I used percentage to counteract the obvious differences in pace. It is about a fair of a stat as possible. It has much more relevance than sayign "our guards rebound more, so they are more athletic." Cauley Stein is twice the athlete, that Frank is. Frank is a better basketball player. I really dont understand why you are jousting windmills, with this athletic nonsense. WOuld be like me complaining about people saying Louisville is faster than UK. They are, but that is just one aspect of basketball. Wisconsin shoots better. They move the ball better. I am sorry, but if this was a NFL combine contest Kentucky wins. Does that matter? Wisconsin destroyed Baylor, who might have been the most athletic team in the tourney. Luckily for you, it is a basketball game.

 

[Codaxx]

Again, for me the two guys that can be the X factors are Young and Dekker.

Here is the interesting match-ups. Everyone is talking about Kaminsky, but they are some interesting match-ups on the other side.

Dekker will be on Randle. Randle should be able to take that match-up. Would love to see Dekker sitting with foul trouble.

Who guards Young? WIsconsin is basically a 3 guard team. One of them will have to cover a much larger player. The tallest is Gasser at 6'3" v 6'7" Young. Hayes is a guy with the size and athletic ability to do that, but he is a bench guy.

 

[dcZONAfan]

It's all about athleticism. The point is that our guards are just as athletic as theirs, if not more. Anybody who's ever seen them play knows they often go up into crowds against bigger, "more athletic" guys and they come away with it. Your counterpoint was rebounding percentage (which is in itself biased, since we played have played the #2 hardest schedule, but I'll let that go). And as I said, that has to do with Frank and Sam misplaying balls and just not playing smart. It has nothing to do with athleticism. Dekker was projected as a potential lottery pick despite not even starting last year. Why is that? Athleticism. And do I really need to tell you why Frank has plenty of athleticism after he made the best defensive team in America look like mincemeat?

Can we quit the "Kentucky is more athletic" shit? Again, it's not grounded in reality. Kentucky has a freakish talent in Randle. He's the best player on the floor, and mainly based on savvy. Our guards are just as athletic as theirs. Dekker is just as athletic as Young. Frank is as more athletic than Culley-Stein or Dakari, and Nigel is even with Poythress. If we lose, it'll because their big men are more technically sound or they shot better. It'll have nothing to do with athleticism.

you have left this universe with that statement. I'm not sure you know what athletic means if you truly believe that.

 

[rmilia1]

Id think we could safely assume that every team that reaches the Final 4 is athletic enough to win a game... LOL. Teams that win titles do so because they have guys that step up huge, guys that outplay their regular season performance and guys that hit big shots. I can 100% promise you it doesnt have anything to do with a team not having good enough athletes because those teamws dont make Final 4's.

 

[Runeman]

Id think we could safely assume that every team that reaches the Final 4 is athletic enough to win a game... LOL. Teams that win titles do so because they have guys that step up huge, guys that outplay their regular season performance and guys that hit big shots. I can 100% promise you it doesnt have anything to do with a team not having good enough athletes because those teamws dont make Final 4's.

While all that is true; teams have to respect the strengths and exploit the weaknesses of their opponents. Just don't think Wisconsin is going to have the inside success against Kentucky as they did against Arizona. I think the Harrisons are the folks that can be exploited. Louisville did a good job of trapping them and taking the ball away. Wisconsin can win this game; they aren't going to do it by beating up the inside guys.

 

[Codaxx]

Id think we could safely assume that every team that reaches the Final 4 is athletic enough to win a game... LOL. Teams that win titles do so because they have guys that step up huge, guys that outplay their regular season performance and guys that hit big shots. I can 100% promise you it doesnt have anything to do with a team not having good enough athletes because those teamws dont make Final 4's.

the athlete thing is way overplayed. Kevin McHale could barely jump over a doormat, but he had great footwork, moves, and understood positioning.