Game Thread: Wild Card: Packers @ Redskins

[redskinsfan]

Guys... might I suggest we ease up on the veiled personal attacks. We are all Skins fans here and want whats best for the team.

At the end of the day, we wont all agree.

But all that Bittermuch beer shit needs to stay where it belongs right now.... and i think we all know where that is as I "hear" they just opened a new production plant in Texas.

Yeah, stop those attacks, shark.

 

[Sharkinva]

Yeah, stop those attacks, shark.

Fuckin Lawyers. LOL

 

[redskinsfan]

Fuckin Lawyers. LOL

 

[Sharkinva]

A smart man avoids situations where he needs a good lawyer, a dumb coach gets himself into a position where he NEEDS a good kicker.

 

[redskinsfan]

A smart man avoids situations where he needs a good lawyer, a dumb coach gets himself into a position where he NEEDS a good kicker.

Can we forward this to Mike Zimmer? I'm sure he'd agree.

 

[j_y19]

I can respect this opinion, but I'm hardly alone in wanting Barry gone. I can reluctantly have him for one more year, but my thinking on Barry is this: I never thought he was good to begin with and didn't want him hired in the first place. Indeed, the reasons why a lot of us were skeptical with Barry from the get go began to manifest themselves early on. While he did do some good things, it just appeared that he'd be the same guy a lot suspected him to be and many were calling for his head during the season. Thus, far from this past game constituting an overreaction regarding Barry, it was, in fact, a punctuating point with respect to his lack of coordinating skills that built up during the season.

I thought the same thing about Spurrier. Never wanted him hired in the first place, saw a bunch of red flags right afterwards (e.g., when he was trying to get the Florida Gator band back together,) and witnessed him do some insane things like leaving Pat Ramsey without any pass pro to take hits because that's what his system dictated. To me, we didn't need another season to see what Spurrier was about. Same thing with Barry. Unfortunately, he's probably going to be around for another season. I just hope we get him more players and that he's able to adapt his scheme to them and, more importantly, adjustments offenses make during the game.

I too was skeptical of the Barry hiring. But I also think his responsibility for Detroit going 0-16 was way over blown. That team sucked. And it wasn't just the defense. He was there one year as the DC. With absolutely no talent. Do you really think he got a chance to implement his scheme with his type of players? I don't.
Probably the timing of your post help fuel the flames. We had just lost in the playoffs but overall had a very good year. So, for me and I suspect others, to call for a coach firing right after the game hit a nerve. IF you would have waited a few weeks, my guess the emotions would not have been so raw. Not sure you wouldn't have had the same response from us, but probably less emotions in the back and forth. Lets just agree that we disagree but we both want whats best for the team.

 

[redskinsfan]

I too was skeptical of the Barry hiring. But I also think his responsibility for Detroit going 0-16 was way over blown. That team sucked. And it wasn't just the defense. He was there one year as the DC. With absolutely no talent. Do you really think he got a chance to implement his scheme with his type of players? I don't.
Probably the timing of your post help fuel the flames. We had just lost in the playoffs but overall had a very good year. So, for me and I suspect others, to call for a coach firing right after the game hit a nerve. IF you would have waited a few weeks, my guess the emotions would not have been so raw. Not sure you wouldn't have had the same response from us, but probably less emotions in the back and forth. Lets just agree that we disagree but we both want whats best for the team.

I completely agree on the Detroit thing. He got a bad rap for that. All you need to do is look at the no-names he had and how they didn't end up doing anything afterwards. While he's certainly not an 0-16 d-coor, he's still far less than a middling one.

I didn't realize the issue of timing, but I've been pining to dump Barry for a while. This latest gaffe really hit a nerve with me. And a large part of it had to do with all those I heard (e.g., Demovsky) suggesting how they'd attack the GB offense. I normally don't bother following those talking heads, but given that this was a playoff game I thought we could win, I really started reading and listening to all those GB (and other) commentators en masse. And they all had one clear message: stack the box since the Pack had no one to beat you deep. When Barry didn't do that, that was the last straw.

Having said that, we've got to move on knowing he'll still be here. Time to start figuring out drafting a franchise DT and a DE. The better players we get, the less Barry's gameplans will matter.

 

[skinsdad62]

I understand the point you're making. I can't tell you how many times when economists with Ph.Ds I'm cross-examining have told me I don't know what I'm talking about because I don't possess their level of economic expertise. The answer to that is simple: while that might be true, I know enough for any one particular case to impeach the testimony they're giving. However, there are instances where their substantive expertise clearly preempts any knowledge I'd have on an issue. The key is to understand the difference between the two.

The Scherff example you're citing isn't on point. Ron Wolfe and Charley Casserly's expertise lies in personnel assessments and doesn't turn on projecting where certain individuals will be drafted. As to the former, they and countless other draft pundits predicted that Scherff would be a guard rather than a tackle. They were right and so were the many posters here that agreed with them. Why? Because personnel calls like that are truly their bailiwick and fit more in the latter situation I referenced above where you're now trying to call into question core expertise those guys have. Projecting where people are drafted, on the other hand, would fall into the former example because neither of those guys are psychics that can truly predict what any team will draft.

Thus, when I'm citing people like Rob Demovsky, he's a guy that not only knows his football stuff, but also is the guy on the ground that's familiar with the Pack's daily operations. That's why the opinions he and others like him carry far more weight.

i dont care who you site , their opinion isnt any better then mine ron wolfe and charlie casserly ARE PAID NOW to predict where certain players go they missed , werent even close , why ? i submit they arent up on the skins team and get most of their information from national sources

i have the advantage of sole focus , they dont ron wolfe , charlie casserlie and rob demovsky are pundits now . they make mistakes, some huge ,

all i know is i am mostly right on the position we draft , usually where , and sometimes the person

me and shark spent almost all of the last off season listening to people tell us how pundits KNOW MORE then we do blah blah blah and in the end we were right on that and on many other things when pundits were wrong

if you want to hitch your wagon to pundits you go on ahead i will think for myself

 

[Sportster 72]

Here's a not so veiled attack .... FUCK YOU!!!

I like that!!!

 

[Sharkinva]

Here's a not so veiled attack .... FUCK YOU!!!

I like that!!!

What the fuck did I do to deserve that??

 

[Sportster 72]

Wasn't meant for you Shark, sorry if you interpreted it that way.

 

[Sportster 72]

I'm good, arguing is over. You are correct Shark. No one here or hear wants to read this crap. I should have let it go much earlier.

 

[Sharkinva]

Sportster.. its all good. Just checking.

I still say we all need to calm down, take a deep breath, and be thankful we arent in the situation of the other three teams in the NFCEast right now.

 

[Sportster 72]

All done.

Putting on my John Lennon album .... "all we are saying is give peace a chance." Hereing his music soothes the savage beast in me.

 

[redskinsfan]

Here's a not so veiled attack .... FUCK YOU!!!

I like that!!!

Classy.

 

[redskinsfan]

i dont care who you site , their opinion isnt any better then mine ron wolfe and charlie casserly ARE PAID NOW to predict where certain players go they missed , werent even close , why ? i submit they arent up on the skins team and get most of their information from national sources

i have the advantage of sole focus , they dont ron wolfe , charlie casserlie and rob demovsky are pundits now . they make mistakes, some huge ,

all i know is i am mostly right on the position we draft , usually where , and sometimes the person

me and shark spent almost all of the last off season listening to people tell us how pundits KNOW MORE then we do blah blah blah and in the end we were right on that and on many other things when pundits were wrong

if you want to hitch your wagon to pundits you go on ahead i will think for myself

Whether you care to admit it or not, some opinions are better / more informed than others. Wolfe and Casserly are paid to assess draft prospects and have been doing this for decades. Please don't tell me you're even close to knowing what they know. To be sure, they make mistakes. But every expert makes mistakes. The point here is that while you can form your own opinions, you've got to acknowledge that theirs are better than yours or mine.

And their expertise is not one predicting where people will land in the same way that reporters don't get paid to pick games. They often will, and their predictions are often wrong, but that's not what their expertise embraces.

On Scherff, the issue with Casserly and Wolfe was that they accurately predicted he'd be a guard. I'm not sure if you were one of those claiming he'd be a tackle, but this is one example of how those experts' opinions are better than any of ours here.

 

[redskinsfan]

Sportster.. its all good. Just checking.

I still say we all need to calm down, take a deep breath, and be thankful we arent in the situation of the other three teams in the NFCEast right now.

Now, that's a thread I wanted to start (regarding the NFC East teams). But I thought it might invite trolls galore "hear." I'll say this about Philly. They missed out on their first choice (Adam Gase), missed out on what should've been their second (Hue Jackson), and now are groveling to see whomever else is out there. Whomever they hire, the pickings are pretty slim. And if Pat Shurmur isn't around, you can kiss Sam Bradford goodbye, who might be gone anyways. If that's the case, they may very well be stuck with Butt Fumble as their starting QB next year.

 

[Sharkinva]

Whether you care to admit it or not, some opinions are better / more informed than others. Wolfe and Casserly are paid to assess draft prospects and have been doing this for decades. Please don't tell me you're even close to knowing what they know. To be sure, they make mistakes. But every expert makes mistakes. The point here is that while you can form your own opinions, you've got to acknowledge that theirs are better than yours or mine.

And their expertise is not one predicting where people will land in the same way that reporters don't get paid to pick games. They often will, and their predictions are often wrong, but that's not what their expertise embraces.

On Scherff, the issue with Casserly and Wolfe was that they accurately predicted he'd be a guard. I'm not sure if you were one of those claiming he'd be a tackle, but this is one example of how those experts' opinions are better than any of ours here.

Sorry.. .but Im going to step in here a little. Most of the Pundits are forming opinions not only on what the Skins might do, but also 31 other teams. They also try and look at who might be the best fight for 32 teams total in seven rounds. Yes they are a bit more informed because they have insider info in some cases.

But the flip side of that is that an informed individual, with a set focus on a particular team does likely have a better read on what that particular team

1. Needs.
2. Would be the best fit for said named team.
3. Most of the pundits tend to repeat the party line of thinking. Which is why you get one or two guys that come out and say shit like Leonard Williams is the best player in the 2015 draft and no way does he drop past the 3rd pick and Washington would run to the podium to select him.

Reality is, once you got past the talking heads, quite a few focused Skins followers had Scherff as our pick. Based on his ability, team need and actual value.

 

[redskinsfan]

Sorry.. .but Im going to step in here a little. Most of the Pundits are forming opinions not only on what the Skins might do, but also 31 other teams. They also try and look at who might be the best fight for 32 teams total in seven rounds. Yes they are a bit more informed because they have insider info in some cases.

But the flip side of that is that an informed individual, with a set focus on a particular team does likely have a better read on what that particular team

1. Needs.
2. Would be the best fit for said named team.
3. Most of the pundits tend to repeat the party line of thinking. Which is why you get one or two guys that come out and say shit like Leonard Williams is the best player in the 2015 draft and no way does he drop past the 3rd pick and Washington would run to the podium to select him.

Reality is, once you got past the talking heads, quite a few focused Skins followers had Scherff as our pick. Based on his ability, team need and actual value.

That wasn't my point, which is limited solely to Casserly, Wolfe and others as talent evaluators. I'm removing things like what they feel are team needs, where certain picks will land, and anything other than how they view the merit of the draft prospects talent and his ability to succeed in the NFL. The latter takes a unique talent and it usually requires that you serve in some capacity as a personnel guy in the league before. As I noted before, they aren't experts anything more than those issues. If I want to know where a draft pick will land, I'm going to rely on people like Adam Schefter, who's obviously not a talent evaluator but has sources he relies on to report what each team's interests is.

 

[Sharkinva]

That wasn't my point, which is limited solely to Casserly, Wolfe and others as talent evaluators. I'm removing things like what they feel are team needs, where certain picks will land, and anything other than how they view the merit of the draft prospects talent and his ability to succeed in the NFL. The latter takes a unique talent and it usually requires that you serve in some capacity as a personnel guy in the league before. As I noted before, they aren't experts anything more than those issues. If I want to know where a draft pick will land, I'm going to rely on people like Adam Schefter, who's obviously not a talent evaluator but has sources he relies on to report what each team's interests is.

OK... but then I have to call into question Wolfe, Casserly and a few of these other talent experts based on the fact that I doubt many of them have actually GONE to a combine or pro day in years. While they might get a little of the film that the average fan cant get, and while they have actually at some point gotten paid for their opinion... fact remains that most of them are making a slightly more informed guess on the guys based on how they see the entire league. Not a particular team. Once again who saw us passing on Williams for Scherff?? Not many. Hell how many of these guys were totally stunned when Manziel fell out of the top ten?? I give them credit for having more resources, and for actually getting paid for their opinion. But at the end of the day, I question if they know the 32 teams and what would be best for them based on the fact that the sheer number of players they have to look at makes it almost impossible for them to do anything more than basically guess to a degree.