What did the 82, 87, & 91 Redskins have in common?

[Caliskinsfan]

Power Ranking the NFL's Top 50 Active Offensive Linemen | Bleacher Report

Just because it is a trend doesn't mean that all or even most of the quality lineman are from the 1st or 2nd round. See the link above. Granted - this is a few years old (2012) but is probably relatively consistent with the current time in terms of where players were selected. There are several on this list that were selected high. However - there are still lots of players (including in the top 10) that were selected in later rounds or even undrafted.

Again - I would be thrilled to see the Skins draft an O-lineman in the 1st round either this year or next year. However - this idea that all/most of your O-lineman need to come in rounds 1-3 is insane. I truly believe that some future O-line stars or just major contributors are lurking out there in the later rounds or can be had as undrafted FAs. Nobody is saying that the team is searching for the next Jacoby - just that quality lineman can come from a variety of sources.

Merely pointing out there is an argument on both sides of the equation.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

While I dont disagree about great QBs and dominating defenses win championships.....however Darrell......when you have less then a great QB and less then a Dominating Defense......A solid Oline will HELP a developing QB become better with more time to make his reads and throw the ball...to BECOME a franchise qb.....I for 1 and sick and tired of seeing our QB under duress in less then 2 seconds....Brady, Manning, Brees, would all struggle with the inadequate Oline we have been putting out there.....would you not agree????

Thanks for responding. Yes I agree it's harder for a top QB to win with a bad OL. And again I am not trying to diminish how important they can be.

But again the opening post claimed offensive lines win championships and that is simply not true. I took the time to look over all the champs of our lifetime and as I said other than the Redskins, and possible the early 90 Boys teams, none of the other championship teams had the offensive line as their key. And of course the Boys had 3 HOF skill players and great defenses too. The truth is the vast majority of Super Bowl champs had average offensive lines.

I stand by my contention that Redskins fans are obsessed with having a great offensive line, at the expense of building other areas, due to our history. A dominating defense has won by far more championships than a dominating offensive line and it's really not even close. And again the Steelers OL of 2009 was as bad or worse than our current line. Nobody is calling the Niners or Pats teams that have won multiple titles teams that won because of their dominant offensive lines.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

Merely pointing out there is an argument on both sides of the equation.

No - your response just basically means that we are in agreement. A quality line (just like a quality team) comes from a variety of sources - high picks, low picks & free agents. This is especially true for O-lineman who don't depend as much on physical skills and can often be later bloomers. Coaching can also play a critical role in all of this. Somewhere along the way the Skins will develop a quality lineman who will be a player that nobody is mentioning right now. With a quality O-line coach & a good FO this is now more possible than ever.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

No - your response just basically means that we are in agreement. A quality line (just like a quality team) comes from a variety of sources - high picks, low picks & free agents. This is especially true for O-lineman who don't depend as much on physical skills and can often be later bloomers. Coaching can also play a critical role in all of this. Somewhere along the way the Skins will develop a quality lineman who will be a player that nobody is mentioning right now. With a quality O-line coach & a good FO this is now more possible than ever.

We do agree on what you've said here.

But my post was meant to point out that there is a valid argument for those who wish to see the Oline addressed in earlier rounds of the draft.

I don't believe that is the only way to have a solid Oline player myself. I believe solid talent evaluation, coaching and fit trumps the position picked in the draft.

 

[SoCalWizFan]

We do agree on what you've said here.

But my post was meant to point out that there is a valid argument for those who wish to see the Oline addressed in earlier rounds of the draft.

I don't believe that is the only way to have a solid Oline player myself. I believe solid talent evaluation, coaching and fit trumps the position picked in the draft.

Yep. If the Redskins biggest mistake over the next few years is simply picking the wrong positions (yet still picking the BPA) then in all likelihood they will be in great shape. Go back & look at their recent draft history. It stunk for the most part & was not a matter of picking the wrong positions. It was a matter of making horrible picks or having no picks.

 

[kbso83432]

Don't put words in my mouth. I never said offensive lines win championships. Brady, Ben, have done it and Luck will. However if you have an average to above average but not a great qb you will need a very good oline.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Don't put words in my mouth. I never said offensive lines win championships. Brady, Ben, have done it and Luck will. However if you have an average to above average but not a great qb you will need a very good oline.

Now wait just a goll dang minute. I clearly saw the line "offensive lines win championships", I didn't make that shit up. I was pretty sure it was you but maybe another post? Was it edited later? I know I saw it.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

And this is exactly why we must take... another pass rusher. [\end sarcasm]

Again where were you the day after the Giants sent pressure from all directions to upset the Pats not once but twice in the Big Show? Were you asking "how many pass rushers do you need anyway" that day? Do you not recognize that the bigger reason the Hawks were a yard from back to back titles was their pass rush not their OL?

 

[Sharkinva]

Again where were you the day after the Giants sent pressure from all directions to upset the Pats not once but twice in the Big Show? Were you asking "how many pass rushers do you need anyway" that day? Do you not recognize that the reason the Hawks were a yard from back to back was their pass rush not their OL?

The Giants also at least had a half assed decent O-line at the time. We have Larry and Moe on the right side and fucking Curly at QB.

 

[redskinsfan]

Again where were you the day after the Giants sent pressure from all directions to upset the Pats not once but twice in the Big Show? Were you asking "how many pass rushers do you need anyway" that day? Do you not recognize that the bigger reason the Hawks were a yard from back to back titles was their pass rush not their OL?

There are certain positions where you just can't enough players at. Pass rushing defenders is one of them.

 

[Sharkinva]

Seriously... we are guaranteeing $16 million on a fragile QB for INJURY and you think its a good move to take a pass rusher and go with the 2nd and 3rd tier O-lineman??

Thats like giving a $16 million dollar no clause insurance policy to a chain smoker that LIVES on a tobacco farm.

 

[redskinsfan]

Seriously... we are guaranteeing $16 million on a fragile QB for INJURY and you think its a good move to take a pass rusher and go with the 2nd and 3rd tier O-lineman??

Thats like giving a $16 million dollar no clause insurance policy to a chain smoker that LIVES on a tobacco farm.

It's a risk, but here's the rub: do you have a better alternative? Why are the Bears giving Cutler so much jack when he's clearly a has-been and a jackass? Because Plan B might as well be Plan ZZZZ.

Is there a risk? Sure. Can it bite us in the booty? Absolutely. But his ACL back on 2012 was initially a freak injury caused when his leg got buggy-whipped by Haloti Ngata after he was scrambling. It got worse when he didn't get the appropriate rest and culminated only after he pushed it was too much for months. His ankle injury was another freak injury that could've happened to anyone. So, despite all the talk that he's "injury prone," which is true to some extent, it's a lot more hype than truth.

 

[Sharkinva]

It's a risk, but here's the rub: do you have a better alternative? Why are the Bears giving Cutler so much jack when he's clearly a has-been and a jackass? Because Plan B might as well be Plan ZZZZ.

Is there a risk? Sure. Can it bite us in the booty? Absolutely. But his ACL back on 2012 was initially a freak injury caused when his leg got buggy-whipped by Haloti Ngata after he was scrambling. It got worse when he didn't get the appropriate rest and culminated only after he pushed it was too much for months. His ankle injury was another freak injury that could've happened to anyone. So, despite all the talk that he's "injury prone," which is true to some extent, it's a lot more hype than truth.

Yes.... put the BEST O-line we can possibly assemble in front of him and if nothing else if he still sucks, then hopefully he wont suck AND get injured. If we are going to take this option on him and continue to put sub par O-lineman in front of him, we are basically asking to swallow $16 million in cap space for a guy who is likely to get injured running for his life yet again. We can get situational pass rushers in the 3rd round. But if the draft goes as it normally does, most if not ALL of the starting caliber O-lineman will be off the board by round two much like the last three years worth of drafts. We dont need guys who MIGHT be starters in three years when we have 14% of our cap tied up in a guy who has a history of injury.

 

[redskinsfan]

Yes.... put the BEST O-line we can possibly assemble in front of him and if nothing else if he still sucks, then hopefully he wont suck AND get injured. If we are going to take this option on him and continue to put sub par O-lineman in front of him, we are basically asking to swallow $16 million in cap space for a guy who is likely to get injured running for his life yet again. We can get situational pass rushers in the 3rd round. But if the draft goes as it normally does, most if not ALL of the starting caliber O-lineman will be off the board by round two much like the last three years worth of drafts. We dont need guys who MIGHT be starters in three years when we have 14% of our cap tied up in a guy who has a history of injury.

In general, I agree with this. We need to see what this kid has. If not, we've got to start making future plans. However, McCloughan seems to have faith in him, and I'm not talking some fake talk about how he views him. And, if you listen to some outsiders, you'd be pretty surprised to hear their view on how much talent he's got and how much they believe he can still be a franchise QB.

 

[Sharkinva]

In general, I agree with this. We need to see what this kid has. If not, we've got to start making future plans. However, McCloughan seems to have faith in him, and I'm not talking some fake talk about how he views him. And, if you listen to some outsiders, you'd be pretty surprised to hear their view on how much talent he's got and how much they believe he can still be a franchise QB.

MAybe SMGM is right, and RGknee can become RG3 again. But lets face it, if he is constantly running for his life, we are asking for trouble. We need to put the great wall of China in front of him... and that means Chester SHOULD NOT be starting at this point. We need to upgrade over Compton who is basically a backup. We can go and get a pass rusher, but long run even if we trade down and take some developmental O-lineman... I see this ending badly.

 

[Caliskinsfan]

The pick up of the option is not going to give Griffin the luxury of many games to show he's improved. They'll most likely bench him earlier than they normally would if he's not getting it done. It doesn't help that he faces 2 tough DEfenses right out of the gate either.

 

[redskinsfan]

MAybe SMGM is right, and RGknee can become RG3 again. But lets face it, if he is constantly running for his life, we are asking for trouble. We need to put the great wall of China in front of him... and that means Chester SHOULD NOT be starting at this point. We need to upgrade over Compton who is basically a backup. We can go and get a pass rusher, but long run even if we trade down and take some developmental O-lineman... I see this ending badly.

In general again, I agree with this. We need a line not only to block for Robert but for Alf as well. Robert is the bigger issue, though, because he's still learning to become a pocket passer. In order to ease that transition, he'll need an o-line and to run some version of the read-option, 50-series offense that worked so well in 2012. That's not ideal, but it's unfortunately the reality.

And Chester blows. Not sure what anyone sees in him. Maybe his play suffered because he played next to a bigger stiff than him in Polumbus. But the guy kept getting blown up. I can say that for Lauvao too. You should've mentioned him as well.

 

[redskinsfan]

The pick up of the option is not going to give Griffin the luxury of many games to show he's improved. They'll most likely bench him earlier than they normally would if he's not getting it done. It doesn't help that he faces 2 tough DEfenses right out of the gate either.

Three words: bubble screens galore.

 

[Sharkinva]

You realize you are simply pointing out that we need two, possibly three starters on the O-line... yet people are saying that we should draft a pass rusher.

 

[redskinsfan]

You realize you are simply pointing out that we need two, possibly three starters on the O-line... yet people are saying that we should draft a pass rusher.

I've always said that. The issue that most of us have been pointing out, however, is value at number five. An OLB like Fowler matches that value and a need.

I've also always said we need to use our second rounder on an o-lineman. But, my ideal scenario is to trade down with Giants and take Scherff with the ninth overall pick and pick an OT with our second rounder. If we get another second rounder from the Giants, we can get an OG like Tomlinson.