Top 25 teams of the CFP era

[Wamu]

They’re #22

My bad. I missed that.

 

[DeafOranguntan]

That's fine. Clemson scored more points than OSU did that weren't stolen by the refs. That's why you won. That's not even including the rest of the officiating fuckery. Give us a 100% Fields and give Clemson Lawrence running on a sprained MCL and OSU wins by 20+. No questions asked.

All I know is what we saw on the field. You hit Clemson in the mouth and took a quick lead because they hadn't played a team on your level. Then Clemson took over and dominated the last three quarters. Excuses are very unbecoming. But don't worry sport, one of these days you'll beat a team from South Carolina. I mean, probably not Clemson, but you have a shot to beat the Gamecocks next time you meet in the Outback Bowl. Or you could schedule The Citadel to get that monkey off your back.

 

[Deep Creek]

That Baylor team didn't crack the top 35.

Yeah, after I saw the criteria you used I knew they wouldn't have made it.

 

[ericd7633]

As everyone else said, tremendously stupid list. Whatever metrics you used were garbage. First, Clemson beat their playoff opponents in 2018 by a larger margin of victory against better opponents than LSU did last year. Clemson lost what was likely the greatest defensive line ever and the rest of their front 7 and Venables was just trying to disguise it all season with Simmons. Second, how do you have 2016 Alabama over 2016 Clemson? Clemson beat Alabama. Same for 2019. Clemson beat Ohio State and dominated the last 3 quarters once they settled down. 2017 Alabama wasn't phenomenal. Clemson just sucked with Kelly Bryant or they would have won that game (and 2017 Clemson is overrated too). And 2014 Ohio State is rated too low. I don't know what metrics you used, but this list is stupid. If I were estimating a top 25, I'd have something like (I could be forgetting somebody and you could argue a few, but this is just off the top of my head, not relying on dumb "metrics"):

1. 2018 Clemson - Best defense, phenomenal offense, beat their opponents by 28 points missing 3 key starters
2. 2019 LSU - Maybe the most impressive offense ever, good defense
3. 2016 Clemson - Great defense (held a good Ohio State to nothing), and Deshaun Watson/Mike Williams
4. 2015 Alabama - One of Saban's most loaded teams in history behind Derrick Henry, weakest position was QB
5. 2014 Ohio State - One of the best defenses on this list (Bosa, Lee, and Apple), Zeke, played best in big games
6. 2018 Alabama - There's a reason people said this was the best team in history, most dominant team in SEC play ever
7. 2016 Alabama - Fantastic team, very similar to the squad in 2015, Clemson basically just exhausted them
8. 2015 Clemson - First time in the spotlight playing #4, Saban had to resort to crazy calls to win
9. 2019 Clemson - There was a ton of talent on this team, but something just wasn't right. The new defensive line killed them and Trevor Lawrence was too in his head that season, but Clemson had great WRs, RB, and an offensive line
10. 2019 Ohio State - probably the second best defensive line on this list, along with a phenom QB and RB
11. 2017 Alabama (I think this was probably the weakest national champion, but they were national champion)
12. 2014 Oregon - Mariota was just a generational player playing in the perfect system for him
13. 2017 Georgia - Good all around team behind a phenomenal rushing attack (second best UGA team since '80)
14. 2018 Notre Dame - Probably the least talented unit in this list, but they had a lot of heart and challenged #1 more than #6. Very good in the trenches with excellent corners
15. 2017 Oklahoma - Mayfield played the best game Oklahoma's had in decades, but just came up short
16. 2016 Washington - Similar to #14. Played with a lot of heart and while #7 controlled the game, never went away
17. 2014 Alabama - The running backs were phenomenal with a good line, but defense couldn't handle Zeke and Sims was Sims
18. 2017 Clemson - ton of talent, similar defense to #1, but horrendous, vanilla offense run by pick machine
19. 2018 Oklahoma - Kyler Murray and good receivers/linemen, worst defense in history

Honestly, I don't think it's worth discussing any more teams. I could argue Florida State's 59-20 loss was better than Ohio State's 31-0 loss, Michigan State's 38-0, or Oklahoma's 37-17 loss. That might be true. But most years, we get matchups between teams that shouldn't be there and powerhouses. I think there's a big dropoff after #10 and another one at maybe 15...

There was a significant drop off after 10 using my metrics. The difference between #2 and #10 was smaller than the difference between #10 and #11.

 

[ericd7633]

As everyone else said, tremendously stupid list. Whatever metrics you used were garbage. First, Clemson beat their playoff opponents in 2018 by a larger margin of victory against better opponents than LSU did last year. Clemson lost what was likely the greatest defensive line ever and the rest of their front 7 and Venables was just trying to disguise it all season with Simmons. Second, how do you have 2016 Alabama over 2016 Clemson? Clemson beat Alabama. Same for 2019. Clemson beat Ohio State and dominated the last 3 quarters once they settled down. 2017 Alabama wasn't phenomenal. Clemson just sucked with Kelly Bryant or they would have won that game (and 2017 Clemson is overrated too). And 2014 Ohio State is rated too low. I don't know what metrics you used, but this list is stupid. If I were estimating a top 25, I'd have something like (I could be forgetting somebody and you could argue a few, but this is just off the top of my head, not relying on dumb "metrics"):

1. 2018 Clemson - Best defense, phenomenal offense, beat their opponents by 28 points missing 3 key starters
2. 2019 LSU - Maybe the most impressive offense ever, good defense
3. 2016 Clemson - Great defense (held a good Ohio State to nothing), and Deshaun Watson/Mike Williams
4. 2015 Alabama - One of Saban's most loaded teams in history behind Derrick Henry, weakest position was QB
5. 2014 Ohio State - One of the best defenses on this list (Bosa, Lee, and Apple), Zeke, played best in big games
6. 2018 Alabama - There's a reason people said this was the best team in history, most dominant team in SEC play ever
7. 2016 Alabama - Fantastic team, very similar to the squad in 2015, Clemson basically just exhausted them
8. 2015 Clemson - First time in the spotlight playing #4, Saban had to resort to crazy calls to win
9. 2019 Clemson - There was a ton of talent on this team, but something just wasn't right. The new defensive line killed them and Trevor Lawrence was too in his head that season, but Clemson had great WRs, RB, and an offensive line
10. 2019 Ohio State - probably the second best defensive line on this list, along with a phenom QB and RB
11. 2017 Alabama (I think this was probably the weakest national champion, but they were national champion)
12. 2014 Oregon - Mariota was just a generational player playing in the perfect system for him
13. 2017 Georgia - Good all around team behind a phenomenal rushing attack (second best UGA team since '80)
14. 2018 Notre Dame - Probably the least talented unit in this list, but they had a lot of heart and challenged #1 more than #6. Very good in the trenches with excellent corners
15. 2017 Oklahoma - Mayfield played the best game Oklahoma's had in decades, but just came up short
16. 2016 Washington - Similar to #14. Played with a lot of heart and while #7 controlled the game, never went away
17. 2014 Alabama - The running backs were phenomenal with a good line, but defense couldn't handle Zeke and Sims was Sims
18. 2017 Clemson - ton of talent, similar defense to #1, but horrendous, vanilla offense run by pick machine
19. 2018 Oklahoma - Kyler Murray and good receivers/linemen, worst defense in history

Honestly, I don't think it's worth discussing any more teams. I could argue Florida State's 59-20 loss was better than Ohio State's 31-0 loss, Michigan State's 38-0, or Oklahoma's 37-17 loss. That might be true. But most years, we get matchups between teams that shouldn't be there and powerhouses. I think there's a big dropoff after #10 and another one at maybe 15...

Also, just to retort what you said. I had an idea about what my top 5 would be going in just basing things off the top of my head. Gun to head I would have had 2019 LSU, 2018 Clemson, 2018 Alabama, 2016 Clemson and 2016 Alabama in that order as my top 5. I was surprised 2016 Clemson rated where it did, but they were hurt by efficiency metrics. My methodology has always been to include more metrics because the more data points the more accurate it can be. It's fine if you disagree, that's just where I'm coming from.

 

[Kaplony]

Fair enough. I'd be curious what you disagree with?

It's ATF. You didn't fondle Suckeye cock enough.

 

[ralphiewvu]

Fair enough. I'd be curious what you disagree with? I'm not of the thinking that just because you've won a title or made the CFP, you're automatically better than teams that did. Even though I did weigh in those factors.

Seriously??? You don’t think that? lol

 

[OregonDucks]

Good opinion man. I guess sometimes we all must share ours.

 

[WhoWasBert]

I know people like to shit on 2018 Clemson because of the teams they played before Notre Dame and Alabama... but that team was so damn good. You had

2019 3(!) 1st Round Defensive Lineman

2020 1st Round Linebacker
2020 1st Round Cornerback
2020 33rd Overall Wide Receiver

2021 1st Overall Quarterback
2021 1st Round Wide Receiver
2021 1st-2nd Round Running Back

I feel like they could have dropped another 14 on Alabama if they had wanted to.

 

[DeafOranguntan]

I know people like to shit on 2018 Clemson because of the teams they played before Notre Dame and Alabama... but that team was so damn good. You had

2019 3(!) 1st Round Defensive Lineman

2020 1st Round Linebacker
2020 1st Round Cornerback
2020 33rd Overall Wide Receiver

2021 1st Overall Quarterback
2021 1st Round Wide Receiver
2021 1st-2nd Round Running Back

I feel like they could have dropped another 14 on Alabama if they had wanted to.

After Lawrence took over, they beat their opponents by an average score of 48-10. That includes the ACC championship and both playoff games. That was also with Dabo pulling the first string on average with 12:32 left in the third quarter and playing the highest number of players per game in history (I believe they averaged 75.8 players a game. Alabama was second with 55.7). And they definitely could have put up at a couple more scores. Bama was great in 2018, but were gassed by the fourth. Tua had taken some really nasty shots and Saban put in Jalen at the start of the fourth with the score 44-16. Jalen got destroyed and then Clemson went on an 11 minute drive using Chase Brice (I hope he kills it at Duke this year) and the backup running backs Tavien Feaster and Adam Choice, and they kneeled it at the Alabama 5 with a minute left. That was a guaranteed 7, but I feel comfortable they would have put up some more points if Dabo didn't sub out the first string and do 14 straight runs to kill the clock. Clemson probably would have won that game about 58-16 if Dabo were more like Spurrier or Meyer.

But since people were talking about the 2016 Clemson-Bama game, Dabo got all the players together in a virtual watch party of that game yesterday. That and 2005 championship are the two best games in history. I was honestly a Dabo doubter back when he was hired. But that's a pretty amazing culture he's made, that they're still that close.

 

[WhoWasBert]

After Lawrence took over, they beat their opponents by an average score of 48-10. That includes the ACC championship and both playoff games. That was also with Dabo pulling the first string on average with 12:32 left in the third quarter and playing the highest number of players per game in history (I believe they averaged 75.8 players a game. Alabama was second with 55.7). And they definitely could have put up at a couple more scores. Bama was great in 2018, but were gassed by the fourth. Tua had taken some really nasty shots and Saban put in Jalen at the start of the fourth with the score 44-16. Jalen got destroyed and then Clemson went on an 11 minute drive using Chase Brice (I hope he kills it at Duke this year) and the backup running backs Tavien Feaster and Adam Choice, and they kneeled it at the Alabama 5 with a minute left. That was a guaranteed 7, but I feel comfortable they would have put up some more points if Dabo didn't sub out the first string and do 14 straight runs to kill the clock. Clemson probably would have won that game about 58-16 if Dabo were more like Spurrier or Meyer.

But since people were talking about the 2016 Clemson-Bama game, Dabo got all the players together in a virtual watch party of that game yesterday. That and 2005 championship are the two best games in history. I was honestly a Dabo doubter back when he was hired. But that's a pretty amazing culture he's made, that they're still that close.

That’s what I always tell people. Imagine if Dabo hadn’t played the whole roster most games and actually ran the score up just a little?

 

[cwalke3408]

2016 Clemson blowing out Ohio State 31-0 and sending their football program into a recession for years alone should push them up a couple of spots