Series Thread: tOfficial Mariners 2019 Season Thread

[mcnabb7542]

Yeah but at the end of the day these guys are "professional athletes" they shouldn't need a never amounted to shit as a player to give them words to pick their game up. ( I can't believe I'm speaking up for the tool)

Here is a prime example of how this front office works, pitching staff sucked last year, Stottlemeyer was the escape goat, they go out and hire a new pitching coach, guess what pitching staff still sucks!
Players need to press themselves, their never going to get that guide from the front office nor the coaching staff!



Oh another point, how about all the talk about the new infield coach at the beginning of the season and how he's a "gold glove whisper" yeah that's worked out really really well for the team leading the league in errors

 

[wazzu31]

Yeah but at the end of the day these guys are "professional athletes" they shouldn't need a never amounted to shit as a player to give them words to pick their game up. ( I can't believe I'm speaking up for the tool)

Here is a prime example of how this front office works, pitching staff sucked last year, Stottlemeyer was the escape goat, they go out and hire a new pitching coach, guess what pitching staff still sucks!
Players need to press themselves, their never going to get that guide from the front office nor the coaching staff!



Oh another point, how about all the talk about the new infield coach at the beginning of the season and how he's a "gold glove whisper" yeah that's worked out really really well for the team leading the league in errors

Totally understand they are professionals, but baseball isn’t like most other sports. Coaches are critical to helping players through rough patches as it’s just another pair of eyes. And since Jerry and Scott have arrived they have been nothing but critical of Felix in public. Not saying Felix hasn’t deserved some criticism because those two arriving and his talent falling off a cliff coincided.

To contradict myself I don’t think an infield coach is even remotely a real coach or to anywhere near a insert word whisperer. You can hit grounders, pop ups and all that until the cows come home but you can’t teach the mental stuff which seems to be the problem with the defense. It’s not like the defense is Vogelbach where they just don’t have the athletic ability to be good defenders.

 

[Duders]

I am so disappointed with this "rebuild" so far. I don't have much faith in the Dipoto regime. I think he's a dude with a great ability to "spin" things to cover his ass. As far as Servais goes, well, I'm pretty sure he's a decent guy but 4 years in and I still have ZERO respect for him as a manager. The fact Dipoto hired him and keeps him on tells me a lot about Dipoto and his objective ability to access talent. Servais was his assistant GM with the Angels and had ZERO managerial experience- he was just Dipoto's top scout guy. In my opinion it all comes down to ownership. They bought into Dipoto's "bill of goods" and then they give him an extended contract?? Then Dipoto in turn gave his BFF an extended contract?? Bottom line, until ownership's baseball smarts change, we can expect the SOS. Things won't change until the owners start feeling it in their pocketbooks OR they sell to investors who REALLY WANT a winning team and are willing to do what it takes to make that happen. I personally have some friends who had been long term hard core fans and now have pretty much given up hope for the Mariners and they rag on me for talking about this team and hanging on and still giving a shit for this team/organization. The Seattle fanbase is great and they deserves so much more than what they've been given for decades now. The Mariner addiction is super hard for me to break away from but current ownership and the Dipoto/Servais duo are probably making it less painful I guess. What ripped me this year was how cool if felt those first few weeks where it was a blast to watch our guys kicking ass. Oh well, so it goes I guess.

 

[SeattleCoug]

I bash Servais plenty but good on him for sticking with Elias last night. Guy was pitching well and in the zone so he rode the hot hand. Its that kind of out of the box thinking that I like to see from a manager occasionally. Not this 8th inning guy, 9th inning guy stuff; especially when you have no one you can trust in your pen.

 

[Duders]

I bash Servais plenty but good on him for sticking with Elias last night. Guy was pitching well and in the zone so he rode the hot hand. Its that kind of out of the box thinking that I like to see from a manager occasionally. Not this 8th inning guy, 9th inning guy stuff; especially when you have no one you can trust in your pen.

If is ain't broke.....don't fix it. Finally

 

[seahawksfan234]

Yeah but at the end of the day these guys are "professional athletes" they shouldn't need a never amounted to shit as a player to give them words to pick their game up. ( I can't believe I'm speaking up for the tool)

Here is a prime example of how this front office works, pitching staff sucked last year, Stottlemeyer was the escape goat, they go out and hire a new pitching coach, guess what pitching staff still sucks!
Players need to press themselves, their never going to get that guide from the front office nor the coaching staff!



Oh another point, how about all the talk about the new infield coach at the beginning of the season and how he's a "gold glove whisper" yeah that's worked out really really well for the team leading the league in errors

For what it's worth, I'm not sure what the issue is with all of the errors. Domingo Santana already has 6 errors in his 43 games. He had 6 errors in his previous 199 games.

Ryon Healy is no surprise since he's playing a position he hasn't played in years and as never good there to begin with, which is why he was moved to 1B with Oakland.

Right now we're on pace for 169 errors which would be the most by a team since 1992.

I think most of the blame goes to the players, not the coaches. I suppose you could blame the team for having Healy at 3B, but there really isn't room for him at DH/1B with Jay Bruce, Daniel Vogelbach and Edwin Encarnacion on the team.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I am so disappointed with this "rebuild" so far. I don't have much faith in the Dipoto regime. I think he's a dude with a great ability to "spin" things to cover his ass. As far as Servais goes, well, I'm pretty sure he's a decent guy but 4 years in and I still have ZERO respect for him as a manager. The fact Dipoto hired him and keeps him on tells me a lot about Dipoto and his objective ability to access talent. Servais was his assistant GM with the Angels and had ZERO managerial experience- he was just Dipoto's top scout guy. In my opinion it all comes down to ownership. They bought into Dipoto's "bill of goods" and then they give him an extended contract?? Then Dipoto in turn gave his BFF an extended contract?? Bottom line, until ownership's baseball smarts change, we can expect the SOS. Things won't change until the owners start feeling it in their pocketbooks OR they sell to investors who REALLY WANT a winning team and are willing to do what it takes to make that happen. I personally have some friends who had been long term hard core fans and now have pretty much given up hope for the Mariners and they rag on me for talking about this team and hanging on and still giving a shit for this team/organization. The Seattle fanbase is great and they deserves so much more than what they've been given for decades now. The Mariner addiction is super hard for me to break away from but current ownership and the Dipoto/Servais duo are probably making it less painful I guess. What ripped me this year was how cool if felt those first few weeks where it was a blast to watch our guys kicking ass. Oh well, so it goes I guess.

Overall I agree with your post, but what I bolded is what I'll somewhat play Devil's Advocate on just for the purpose of conservation.

I don't see a reason for ownership to suddenly spend a bunch of money. The future core of this team is in the minors right now unfortunately. I agree with prudent decisions in free agency, but I don't see how giving Dipoto carte blanche in the offseason would've changed the direction of the team. If they gave a monster contract to Bryce Harper or Manny Machado, that makes us better for the next few years, but it would've been a massive financial contribution that wouldn't make us playoff contenders and would just push us down the draft board.

This is my personal opinion, but I believe that the best bet is to develop young players, retain them and make wise free agency signings without giving out a Robinson Cano type contract.

Acquisitions like Kikuchi are the type of wise free agency signings I like. I don't think it's wise to give a bunch of money to a vet unless he's someone that will make an immediate contribution on a team that is going to contend.

We all knew this wouldn't be pleasant, but there's no way to avoid the fact that the future of the Mariners is contingent on the development of our farm system. It sucks, but the Mariners are not making the playoffs in 2019 or 2020 and I don't think that showering money on the issue will make a difference.

TLDR: The franchise is fucked and there's not really much the owners can do about it.

 

[seahawksfan234]

I am so disappointed with this "rebuild" so far. I don't have much faith in the Dipoto regime. I think he's a dude with a great ability to "spin" things to cover his ass. As far as Servais goes, well, I'm pretty sure he's a decent guy but 4 years in and I still have ZERO respect for him as a manager. The fact Dipoto hired him and keeps him on tells me a lot about Dipoto and his objective ability to access talent. Servais was his assistant GM with the Angels and had ZERO managerial experience- he was just Dipoto's top scout guy. In my opinion it all comes down to ownership. They bought into Dipoto's "bill of goods" and then they give him an extended contract?? Then Dipoto in turn gave his BFF an extended contract?? Bottom line, until ownership's baseball smarts change, we can expect the SOS. Things won't change until the owners start feeling it in their pocketbooks OR they sell to investors who REALLY WANT a winning team and are willing to do what it takes to make that happen. I personally have some friends who had been long term hard core fans and now have pretty much given up hope for the Mariners and they rag on me for talking about this team and hanging on and still giving a shit for this team/organization. The Seattle fanbase is great and they deserves so much more than what they've been given for decades now. The Mariner addiction is super hard for me to break away from but current ownership and the Dipoto/Servais duo are probably making it less painful I guess. What ripped me this year was how cool if felt those first few weeks where it was a blast to watch our guys kicking ass. Oh well, so it goes I guess.

The reason all of my friends ask my opinion on the Mariners is because they know I'm the last person in the city who can name every player on the team.

People from Seattle always ask me why I care about the Mariners because they suck. Unfortunately for me, I'm only able to care about Seattle based teams. I don't really care about a team unless I have some sort of personal connection to them.

 

[Duders]

Overall I agree with your post, but what I bolded is what I'll somewhat play Devil's Advocate on just for the purpose of conservation.

I don't see a reason for ownership to suddenly spend a bunch of money. The future core of this team is in the minors right now unfortunately. I agree with prudent decisions in free agency, but I don't see how giving Dipoto carte blanche in the offseason would've changed the direction of the team. If they gave a monster contract to Bryce Harper or Manny Machado, that makes us better for the next few years, but it would've been a massive financial contribution that wouldn't make us playoff contenders and would just push us down the draft board.

This is my personal opinion, but I believe that the best bet is to develop young players, retain them and make wise free agency signings without giving out a Robinson Cano type contract.

Acquisitions like Kikuchi are the type of wise free agency signings I like. I don't think it's wise to give a bunch of money to a vet unless he's someone that will make an immediate contribution on a team that is going to contend.

We all knew this wouldn't be pleasant, but there's no way to avoid the fact that the future of the Mariners is contingent on the development of our farm system. It sucks, but the Mariners are not making the playoffs in 2019 or 2020 and I don't think that showering money on the issue will make a difference.

TLDR: The franchise is fucked and there's not really much the owners can do about it.

I hope I didn't imply that ownership needs to spend a ton of money to make things right. We've seen what happens when they spend and lock up big bucks for dudes who have a big name and have peaked in their performance. Personally I think guys like Cano etc. were really all for show anyway. I totally agree the Mariners need to focus on getting youth that show real potential and build on that. More energy and effort need to go into the farm system and building for the future. I feel ownership has, for years, been doing a half ass job of trying to bring in a couple ringers hoping a winning team would gel from that instead of focusing on building a solid team including vets and youth. My main issue is, and has been, with the front office. I am not impressed with many of Dipoto's wheeling and dealings, particularly trading off some of our current as well as up and coming talent. His choice for manager is a real disappointment and just irks me that he puts so much stock in Servais and doesn't act on his obvious lack of experience and confidence that are such important assets for a manager. It just makes me question Jerry's ability to assess necessary talent in general.

 

[wazzu31]

Overall I agree with your post, but what I bolded is what I'll somewhat play Devil's Advocate on just for the purpose of conservation.

I don't see a reason for ownership to suddenly spend a bunch of money. The future core of this team is in the minors right now unfortunately. I agree with prudent decisions in free agency, but I don't see how giving Dipoto carte blanche in the offseason would've changed the direction of the team. If they gave a monster contract to Bryce Harper or Manny Machado, that makes us better for the next few years, but it would've been a massive financial contribution that wouldn't make us playoff contenders and would just push us down the draft board.

This is my personal opinion, but I believe that the best bet is to develop young players, retain them and make wise free agency signings without giving out a Robinson Cano type contract.

Acquisitions like Kikuchi are the type of wise free agency signings I like. I don't think it's wise to give a bunch of money to a vet unless he's someone that will make an immediate contribution on a team that is going to contend.

We all knew this wouldn't be pleasant, but there's no way to avoid the fact that the future of the Mariners is contingent on the development of our farm system. It sucks, but the Mariners are not making the playoffs in 2019 or 2020 and I don't think that showering money on the issue will make a difference.

TLDR: The franchise is fucked and there's not really much the owners can do about it.

Quit hiring GM’s that nobody wants or has utterly failed?

Bavasi and Jack Z were guys nobody in baseball wanted to run their organization and Jerry failed with a blank check and the best player in the world. But I am bias against him as has been stated several times. Just as a fan, I hate seeing my favorite team run as a guinea pig to see if this self proclaimed genius can reinvent the wheel. Though I do have hope for the offense in the future, pitching as a whole still looks bleak from all of that I’ve read.

 

[Cloud]

Nice 2 games series against the A's.

Now back to your regular ass whooping? Twins coming into town for 4 and they are a good team with 27 wins trailing only behind the Dodgers and Astros for best record in terms of winning percentage.

Will be a tough series and a split here will be considered a win.

Former M's Pineda makes his return to Seattle for the Twins. I might catch first couple of innings to see Pineda.
We will also get a chance to see Nelson Cruz and expect to get a nice ovation for him. He's hurt though (wrist) so don't know if he'll be in the lineup tonight. Cruz done OK so far batting .270 with 7 HR and 22 RBI's.

Swanson (1-4, 6.35 ERA) vs. Pineda (2-3, 5.85 ERA) @ 7:10PM.

^^^^^^
Base on this? It could be a high scoring game. Lol.

M's: 22-23 (9-11 H)
Twins: 27-15 (12-7 R)

 

[seahawksfan234]

I hope I didn't imply that ownership needs to spend a ton of money to make things right. We've seen what happens when they spend and lock up big bucks for dudes who have a big name and have peaked in their performance. Personally I think guys like Cano etc. were really all for show anyway. I totally agree the Mariners need to focus on getting youth that show real potential and build on that. More energy and effort need to go into the farm system and building for the future. I feel ownership has, for years, been doing a half ass job of trying to bring in a couple ringers hoping a winning team would gel from that instead of focusing on building a solid team including vets and youth. My main issue is, and has been, with the front office. I am not impressed with many of Dipoto's wheeling and dealings, particularly trading off some of our current as well as up and coming talent. His choice for manager is a real disappointment and just irks me that he puts so much stock in Servais and doesn't act on his obvious lack of experience and confidence that are such important assets for a manager. It just makes me question Jerry's ability to assess necessary talent in general.

I suppose I misinterpreted what you were saying as I thought you were insinuating that the ownership not spending more is why we're in this place right now.

When it comes to Dipoto, he has had his hits and his misses. Servais should've never been the manager in the first place. I think that Dipoto's biggest fuck-up was not recognizing that last year's start was a fluke. If we would've moved Paxton, Segura, Diaz, etc. last year we would've received a lot more. Although hindsight is always 20/20.

I do believe that Dipoto took the right approach by selling off our best assets during the offseason though. Obviously we can argue over the value we received, the trades were the right thing to do.

This rebuild should've taken place years ago.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Quit hiring GM’s that nobody wants or has utterly failed?

Bavasi and Jack Z were guys nobody in baseball wanted to run their organization and Jerry failed with a blank check and the best player in the world. But I am bias against him as has been stated several times. Just as a fan, I hate seeing my favorite team run as a guinea pig to see if this self proclaimed genius can reinvent the wheel. Though I do have hope for the offense in the future, pitching as a whole still looks bleak from all of that I’ve read.

I know I'm going a bit far back in history, but you're right with Jack Z and Bavasi. I think our shitty situation stems from the fact that both of them kept trying to build a winning team that needed a lot more than just an Erik Bedard or Robinson Cano to push us over the top.

As I said in my last post, this rebuild should've taken place a long time ago.

 

[Cloud]

I know I'm going a bit far back in history, but you're right with Jack Z and Bavasi. I think our shitty situation stems from the fact that both of them kept trying to build a winning team that needed a lot more than just an Erik Bedard or Robinson Cano to push us over the top.

As I said in my last post, this rebuild should've taken place a long time ago.

But they have been rebuilding since 1977.

 

[wazzu31]

But they have been rebuilding since 1977.

The biggest mistake the franchise really has made is not do a full rebuild when they traded Lou. Nearly everyone outside of Ichiro was either on the decline of their career or realistically done with being a full time player. They had the brand new ballpark to draw fans for a few years while the team sucked but they chose not to and it has crippled the franchise since. Instead of building the farm system they kept dealing prospect after prospect. Had they done that logical formula Felix would’ve been the ace on a few playoff teams.

 

[wazzu31]

I know I'm going a bit far back in history, but you're right with Jack Z and Bavasi. I think our shitty situation stems from the fact that both of them kept trying to build a winning team that needed a lot more than just an Erik Bedard or Robinson Cano to push us over the top.

As I said in my last post, this rebuild should've taken place a long time ago.

I know it’s not popular but the Bedard deal is really only bad in hindsight to me. Sure the previous year obviously was a fluke but had they Bedard the previous year they were a playoff team. Obviously it became a terrible trade much like Varitek and Lowe even though at the time Varitek had no path to the big leagues and Lowe would’ve been a bullpen arm for the Mariners with how loaded the farm system was with pitchers.

 

[Msfann]

I haven't been watching the games but that Swanson guy looks cooked.

1-5 with an era over 8.

 

[SeattleCoug]

Quit hiring GM’s that nobody wants or has utterly failed?

Bavasi and Jack Z were guys nobody in baseball wanted to run their organization and Jerry failed with a blank check and the best player in the world. But I am bias against him as has been stated several times. Just as a fan, I hate seeing my favorite team run as a guinea pig to see if this self proclaimed genius can reinvent the wheel. Though I do have hope for the offense in the future, pitching as a whole still looks bleak from all of that I’ve read.

The main reason is their criteria for hiring a GM is incredibly flawed. I've stated countless times they need a buffer(baseball guy) between the ownership group and the GM but they just refuse to go that route. That's why they keep hiring the wrong guy and not only that they hold onto to that guy and dont hold him accountable because they dont want egg on their face after 4/5 years. So yeah this rebuild will buys a few more years until we get to the 6/7 year tenure and start over with the next guy

 

[SeattleCoug]

I know I'm going a bit far back in history, but you're right with Jack Z and Bavasi. I think our shitty situation stems from the fact that both of them kept trying to build a winning team that needed a lot more than just an Erik Bedard or Robinson Cano to push us over the top.

As I said in my last post, this rebuild should've taken place a long time ago.

Erik Bedard and Robinson Cano happen when you hold onto a GM longer then you should which causes them to make job saving moves that hold a lot of risk. Both those moves likely set the franchise back a couple years in each case. The solution is, like i said in my previous post, when you dont have the guy don't compound the problem. And if you keep hiring the wrong guy, then you yourself are the problem.

 

[Cloud]

Yup, so last night's game was expected to be a high scoring affair... unfortunately for them they're on the wrong end again.