The Wide-9 nickel as a base defense

[Old Lion]

I have noticed that we play a lot of nickel, bringing in Carey as a third safety. What I also noticed is that we have been surprising good against the run with it too.

I think with a few adjustments that this could be a very effective base. Play the corners off most of the time (why the hell not, they are playing 15 yards off anyway) and roll the 2 safeties up more and underneath. This gives us 8 in the box against the run if we want it, but also 5 DBs that can drop back against the pass instead of 4 and a LB. It also allows Quin to play center field.

I think with our size at DL that we can do a lot of different things with the 2 LBs depending on the situation and it also gives us the ability to show many different looks. We are just too vanilla nad predictable on defense regardless of how much talent we get.

What do you guys think?

 

[broncosmitty]

Nickel is our base defense OL. We're in it much more than we are three backer sets.

 

[jdwills126]

IMO the Lions are just using Carey as a more athletic LB. It makes sense to have that type of guy on the field as more teams are utilizing the TE as a real down field weapon.

I would not be surpassed if the Lions try to find a LB/SS type of guy in the draft. Funny thing I remember Urlacher played that type of position at New Mexico (I think NM).

 

[tpaulus_2]

I agree with Smitty- the nickel is our base D since that's what we play the most.

In theory our base is the 4-3-4, but in reality it's a 4-2-5.

 

[Old Lion]

Nickel is our base defense OL. We're in it much more than we are three backer sets.

We still need to make adjustments in the way we are playing though. If we are using nickel as our base and are still 30th in the league against the pass then we are doing something very wrong.

 

[Old Lion]

IMO the Lions are just using Carey as a more athletic LB. It makes sense to have that type of guy on the field as more teams are utilizing the TE as a real down field weapon.

I would not be surpassed if the Lions try to find a LB/SS type of guy in the draft. Funny thing I remember Urlacher played that type of position at New Mexico (I think NM).

I was pushing for Alec Ogletree last year. He was perfect for this.

 

[themuzzer]

We still need to make adjustments in the way we are playing though. If we are using nickel as our base and are still 30th in the league against the pass then we are doing something very wrong.

We've been doing something wrong on Pass defense for quite a while....I don't care if we run a 3-4, 4-3, 4-2-5 or for god sakes Rich Rods 3-3-5......If the talent isn't there in the back 7 and the coach and scheme doesn't fit, it doesn't matter.

This team isn't ready for the playoffs defensively......Maybe Xanders can hit gold again this up coming draft .....

We are not a bad team.....We just don't have what it takes this year.

 

[tpaulus_2]

We still need to make adjustments in the way we are playing though. If we are using nickel as our base and are still 30th in the league against the pass then we are doing something very wrong.

We're not unique with the nickel being our base defense. Given how often teams are going with 3 or 4 wide sets now, the nickel is most teams' base defense by default.

 

[gandydancer]

Anybody miss this yet? At least as a base D..

 

[jdwills126]

With the 3 WR sets and the athletic TEs I think the nickel is going to be the base for 4-3 defenses.

I see the 3-5 defenses being the route to go in the future as an athletic SS or light fast OLB will have the same effect and give defenses more flexibility.

 

[gandydancer]

With the 3 WR sets and the athletic TEs I think the nickel is going to be the base for 4-3 defenses.

I see the 3-5 defenses being the route to go in the future as an athletic SS or light fast OLB will have the same effect and give defenses more flexibility.

That 3-5 style makes me wonder about Suh even more. He will still demand double team inside, but is he the right guy.

Was not sure you meant Lions moving to that direction or league per say?

I have always like the 3-4 better. Seems more faster athletes in the scheme.

 

[jayfan]

We still use nickel a lot. It was our base defense in game 1, where a third linebacker only took 8 snaps, and game 3, where a third linebacker only took 1 snap. Game 2 was more balanced, but we were still in nickel over 50% of the time.

 

[gandydancer]

We still use nickel a lot. It was our base defense in game 1, where a third linebacker only took 8 snaps, and game 3, where a third linebacker only took 1 snap. Game 2 was more balanced, but we were still in nickel over 50% of the time.

That is why I am not so worried about of visions of Palmer

 

[broncosmitty]

Said it before, but ill say it again...... Three safeties are better than one Palmer.

 

[gandydancer]

Are three bitches better than on skanky whore?

I like just a touch of skank...

 

[gandydancer]

Speaking of safeties, is Don Carey okay? Never saw update but thought he left Sundays game.

 

[tpaulus_2]

Said it before, but ill say it again...... Three safeties are better than one Palmer.

That all depends on what the offense puts out there.

I'd still like to know why all the hate from Palmer? Everyone acts as if he was terrible last year, when in reality he was perfectly adequate in his role.

Is it the lack of stats he posted that's causing this animosity towards him? Because that's purely a function of him having a limited role last year. On a per snap basis he was our most effective run defender in the LB corps last year.

I'm honestly open to feedback here, not trying to be a rainbow-riding dickhole. I just didn't see what you guys saw. I see Palmer as a limited player in a limited role. He's got the skills to be an effective part-time, 2 down OLB, which happens to be what we need with Tully's injury forcing either Whitehead or Levy inside.

For as little as teams stay in a base 4-3 look anymore he's plenty adequate, imo.

 

[tpaulus_2]

I didn't catch the date at first and thought this was a new thread. I was reading Old Lion's OP and was like "what the fuck are you seeing out there?!" but then I realized he was talking about last year's defense, and then it made waaaaaay more sense, lol.

 

[jdwills126]

That 3-5 style makes me wonder about Suh even more. He will still demand double team inside, but is he the right guy.

Was not sure you meant Lions moving to that direction or league per say?

I have always like the 3-4 better. Seems more faster athletes in the scheme.

I think the league as a whole having 5 guys with 1-2 lb/safties being a hybrid to support the run or cover a TE. As teams keep trying to get big physical receivers and big fast TEs the defense will need to keep pace somehow.

As for Suh I think he is a DE trapped in a DT body. As an outside down lineman in a 3-4 style I think he would be pretty formidable. Fairley seems like a natural Nose tackle as well.

 

[gandydancer]

I think the league as a whole having 5 guys with 1-2 lb/safties being a hybrid to support the run or cover a TE. As teams keep trying to get big physical receivers and big fast TEs the defense will need to keep pace somehow.

As for Suh I think he is a DE trapped in a DT body. As an outside down lineman in a 3-4 style I think he would be pretty formidable. Fairley seems like a natural Nose tackle as well.

Hmmmm...

You had me at DE

I do think that would be more productive sack wise, just not against the run.