The John Stockton Thread

[MHSL82]

John Stockton: He Giveth and He Taketh Away

 

[Sackataters]

As I mentioned before, he just looks like some random guard in the league who is out of it in 5-6 years. I don't see one thing he does that another team would.

Everyone is lauding him, even tonight. 3 assists, 4 TOs, I think 9 points. So, so to me. He is funny in the post game, just because he obviously hates to be interviewed. Worse than Stockton as presentation goes.

 

[nuraman00]

Everyone is lauding him, even tonight. 3 assists, 4 TOs, I think 9 points. So, so to me. He is funny in the post game, just because he obviously hates to be interviewed. Worse than Stockton as presentation goes.

Who is everyone?

 

[Sackataters]

Few players are durable.

Some of the top PFs -- Aldridge, Randolph, Love, also miss a decent amount of games every year.

Most players in most sports get hurt, it's just the way sports are.

Jefferson may be healthy now, but it won't last. Odds are that he'll get injured.

There really doesn't seem to be a rhyme or reason why the few durable players are the way they are. Russell Westbrook takes as much contact as anyone, but has never missed a game, not even in HS.

Probably 0.1% of all athletes are durable, in sports.

And it's not about salary either. Minimum salary players have season ending injuries the same as max players.

What are the odds that you get a Stockton and a Malone on the same team then? Or, maybe it was just a different era. If you read the Sloan thread, there was a story about Jerry playing with broken ribs.

 

[nuraman00]

What are the odds that you get a Stockton and a Malone on the same team then? Or, maybe it was just a different era. If you read the Sloan thread, there was a story about Jerry playing with broken ribs.

I don't think it was a different era. You have to think about all of the players in that era that weren't healthy, not just the few that were.

Look at the rosters and games played from other teams.

Here's New Jersey from 1985.

1984-85 New Jersey Nets Roster and Stats | Basketball-Reference.com

Birdsong played 56, games, King played 42, Darryl Dawkins played 39.

 

[MHSL82]

If you get the Jazz telecast, you should watch the halftime summary of the 1993 All-Star game. I like how Stockton and Malone got the MVP and how Malone blocked then-rookie Shaq's dunk.

 

[nuraman00]

If you get the Jazz telecast, you should watch the halftime summary of the 1993 All-Star game. I like how Stockton and Malone got the MVP and how Malone blocked then-rookie Shaq's dunk.

Halftime is blacked out on LP Broadband.

For games on NBA TV, they cut to studio halftime shows.

 

[MHSL82]

I'm just tired of seeing a lack of toughness. Even in recent years, like game 5 @ SA in 2007, or game 5 @ Houston in 2008.

I want to see someone like Carroll, but the talent to be a starter, and someone other GMs would actually want. Like Matt Barnes or Tony Allen or Sefolosha, etc.

Or AK, with an affordable contract and more consistency.

If Tinsley was in his prime, he would have satisfied it from the PG.

But given this team's roster, I think there needs to be more toughness from the SG/SF.


Favors and Kanters could bring it, if they ever prove to be heavy minute starters. (Which might not happen.)

Jerry Sloan. John Stockton. Karl Malone. Greg Ostertag. Just kidding, but he did respond well to Shaq's slap. He fought back and did a generally good job against him.

 

[nuraman00]

Jerry Sloan. John Stockton. Karl Malone. Greg Ostertag. Just kidding, but he did respond well to Shaq's slap. He fought back and did a generally good job against him.

I'm talking about all season long, not individual moments.

 

[nuraman00]

Jerry Sloan. John Stockton. Karl Malone. Greg Ostertag. Just kidding, but he did respond well to Shaq's slap. He fought back and did a generally good job against him.

Plus, many of those teams didn't rank as well defensively as the New Orleans Jazz teams, so something was missing.

And I liked Ostertag.

But apparently, there needed to be even more.

 

[MHSL82]

I'm talking about all season long, not individual moments.

Me too. I was mentioning season long guys. and then Ostertag was a joke. But then I felt that it was harsh to say him as a joke when he has been tough before. And that was for a playoff series, so it's a bit more than a moment. And we won (mostly because of Sloan, Malone, and Stockton, but still). Kobe and Shaq weren't clicking. And wasn't as tough as our two, three if you include Sloan. The Jazz were a tougher team of the two.

 

[nuraman00]

Me too. I was mentioning season long guys. and then Ostertag was a joke. But then I felt that it was harsh to say him as a joke when he has been tough before. And that was for a playoff series, so it's a bit more than a moment. And we won (mostly because of Sloan, Malone, and Stockton, but still). Kobe and Shaq weren't clicking.

When Ostertag was on the Kings, and the Kings were getting blown out by Seattle in the 2005 series, someone dubbed Ostertag the nickname OsterShaq, because he looked like the only player with some toughness.

I do agree with Ostertag's general complaint, that he got in the doghouse faster than Malone, for committing the same mistakes.

 

[MHSL82]

LeBron James of Miami Heat says it's unfair to judge players based on titles won

It doesn't seem like LeBron James gets what Jordan is saying. Jordan said that Kobe and James are so close, like tied, and the titles is the tie-breaker. James responds that some role players have more rings than Charles Barkley and Patrick Ewing but he would say they're better. But Jordan was talking about two relatively equal players.

I guess someone could say Russell and Jordan were relatively equal, but I wouldn't. That's the main example LeBron cited. He said he wouldn't take Russell over him because he had 11 versus Jordan's 6.

But I do like his argument that could be applied to Stockton and Malone. Duncan has more rings than Malone, but you know how I feel about that. People could take Jordan's argument and say they are relatively equal and rings win out. I respect that opinion, but it isn't going to change mine. You could say Duncan had a better career, but I feel that if you switched to two, Malone would have a ring or four. Wow, Tony Parker was Finals MVP in 2007, didn't remember that.

I did.

 

[MHSL82]

Check out JJ Hickson's streak.

He's shooting 108-164 (65.9%) in the last 18 games (consecutive over 50%)(still going). Dwight Howard holds the record for consecutive 50% or above games since 1986 at 31.

Stockton had 24 from 2/17/1988 - 04/05/1988.

LeBron has a 12-game streak going. Tyson Chandler has a lot of these streaks, his current is 21.

 

[MHSL82]

Check out JJ Hickson's streak.

He's shooting 108-164 (65.9%) in the last 18 games (consecutive over 50%)(still going). Dwight Howard holds the record for consecutive 50% or above games since 1986 at 31.

Stockton had 24 from 2/17/1988 - 04/05/1988.

LeBron has a 12-game streak going. Tyson Chandler has a lot of these streaks, his current is 21.

 

[MHSL82]

Loving this streak-finder thing - Rajon Rondo matched Stockton's record of 37 games in a row with at least 10 assists. Both players did it bridging two seasons. Stockton had more at the end of 1988-89 season (27) and Rondo had more at the start of 2013. Rondo's streak ended well before his injury and Rondo's last game this season was a triple double. Magic had 20, all in one season. Stockton had 27 in one season, three years in a row (but one was in the previous 37 game streak).

Rondo had 28 of 11+ in a row and Stockton had 27. (Magic had 12).
Stockton had 15 games in arrow with 12+ and Rondo had 11.(Magic had 11).
Stockton had 14 games in a row with 13+ and Rondo had 5.(Magic had 11).
Stockton had 14 games in a row with 14+ and Rondo had 3 (Magic had 11).
Stockton had 12 games in a row with 15+ and Rondo had 3 (Magic had 6).
Stockton had 9 games in a row with 16+ and Rondo had 2 (Magic had 3).
Stockton had 5 games in a row with 17+ and Rondo had 2 (Magic had 3).
Stockton had 5 games in a row with 18+ and Rondo had 0 (Magic had 2).
Stockton had 4 games in a row with 18+ and Rondo had 0 (Magic had 0). Deron Williams had 2.
Stockton has had consecutive 20+ games 7 different times.
Stockton has had consecutive 21+ games 3 different times.

Stockton has had 24 games of 20 or more assists. He's had one game of 28, 27, and 26 assists. The record is 30 by Scott Skiles.

 

[MHSL82]

Loving this streak-finder thing - Rajon Rondo matched Stockton's record of 37 games in a row with at least 10 assists. Both players did it bridging two seasons. Stockton had more at the end of 1988-89 season (27) and Rondo had more at the start of 2013. Rondo's streak ended well before his injury and Rondo's last game this season was a triple double. Magic had 20, all in one season. Stockton had 27 in one season, three years in a row (but one was in the previous 37 game streak).

Rondo had 28 of 11+ in a row and Stockton had 27. (Magic had 12).
Stockton had 15 games in arrow with 12+ and Rondo had 11.(Magic had 11).
Stockton had 14 games in a row with 13+ and Rondo had 5.(Magic had 11).
Stockton had 14 games in a row with 14+ and Rondo had 3 (Magic had 11).
Stockton had 12 games in a row with 15+ and Rondo had 3 (Magic had 6).
Stockton had 9 games in a row with 16+ and Rondo had 2 (Magic had 3).
Stockton had 5 games in a row with 17+ and Rondo had 2 (Magic had 3).
Stockton had 5 games in a row with 18+ and Rondo had 0 (Magic had 2).
Stockton had 4 games in a row with 18+ and Rondo had 0 (Magic had 0). Deron Williams had 2.
Stockton has had consecutive 20+ games 7 different times.
Stockton has had consecutive 21+ games 3 different times.

Stockton has had 24 games of 20 or more assists. He's had one game of 28, 27, and 26 assists. The record is 30 by Scott Skiles.

 

[MHSL82]

Stockton also has the record of 29 and 26 consecutive games of 2+ steals.

Alvin Robertson is the Stockton of Steals, though.
He had 105 games in a row with at least one steal. Chris Paul had 104 and 84. Jordan was fourth with 77 games. Stockton was 16th with 41.
He had 15 games of 3+ and 11 games of 4+ and 6 of 5+ and 6+.

He and Stockton have consecutive games of 7+ (a few others do too). He also has 2 games in a row of 8+. Michael Ray Richardson is the only one else to have done that.

 

[MHSL82]

Stockton also has the record of 29 and 26 consecutive games of 2+ steals.

Alvin Robertson is the Stockton of Steals, though.
He had 105 games in a row with at least one steal. Chris Paul had 104 and 84. Jordan was fourth with 77 games. Stockton was 16th with 41.
He had 15 games of 3+ and 11 games of 4+ and 6 of 5+ and 6+.

He and Stockton have consecutive games of 7+ (a few others do too). He also has 2 games in a row of 8+. Michael Ray Richardson is the only one else to have done that.

 

[nuraman00]

MHSL82, didn't you post streaks about Stockton's shooting? Such as he never had more than X many bad games in a row?

Can you bump that post? The robot can't remember where it was.