The first deflate gate - AZ Cardinals, 2003

[Rock Strongo]

Would you agree that anyone that doesn't pass a pee test shouldn't be banned either because they should be able to do what they want as well. What about players who hit their wives/girlfriends/children. Free country?

yeah, why not?

it made baseball billions. please stick on on-field related issues as a football has no bearing on child abuse.

 

[Rock Strongo]

What if an offensive lineman wants to hold on a particular play? Should that flag never be thrown? Its commonly said that a ref can find holding on every play, so should that flag NEVER be thrown then and simply let offensive linemen do what they want?

those are penalties, not equipment.

you arent too good at this.

 

[cdumler7]

those are penalties, not equipment.

you arent too good at this.

Ok so sticking with equipment then do you think one team in the league should be allowed to use stick'um for their gloves but nobody else? I mean that is an equipment issue. Or how about players to use Vaseline as OL so defenders can't use their hands very well?

 

[Wolverine830872]

those are penalties, not equipment.

you arent too good at this.

a rule's a rule. If you break it and you are caught, you should be penalized. Or do you fundamentally disagree with that statement?

 

[Rock Strongo]

Ok so sticking with equipment then do you think one team in the league should be allowed to use stick'um for their gloves but nobody else? I mean that is an equipment issue. Or how about players to use Vaseline as OL so defenders can't use their hands very well?

stickum has been replaced by gloves.

ask odell beckam

 

[cdumler7]

stickum has been replaced by gloves.

ask odell beckam

Then why did the Chargers get in trouble for it just a couple of years ago? Did I miss something and gloves only came into the league in the last year?

 

[Rock Strongo]

a rule's a rule. If you break it and you are caught, you should be penalized. Or do you fundamentally disagree with that statement?

again

penalties regulate in game play.

equipment doesnt. its equipment.

do YOU fundamentally disagree with this?

 

[Rock Strongo]

Then why did the Chargers get in trouble for it just a couple of years ago? Did I miss something and gloves only came into the league in the last year?

new gloves were approved by the NFLPA in the last CBA...so...yes.

 

[Wolverine830872]

again

penalties regulate in game play.

equipment doesnt. its equipment.

do YOU fundamentally disagree with this?

I'm not talking about broken equipment. I'm talking about broken rules

 

[cdumler7]

again

penalties regulate in game play.

equipment doesnt. its equipment.

do YOU fundamentally disagree with this?

How does equipment not regulate the game? If one team has inferior equipment doesn't that automatically put them at a disadvantage? I mean if I am using golf clubs from the 80's compared to another using equipment from today how is that fair?

Same with using equipment that is outside the parameters set by the league. Pretty sure science has shown that an underinflated football is an advantage in the in-game play.

 

[cdumler7]

new gloves were approved by the NFLPA in the last CBA...so...yes.

Right but players have been using gloves for quite some time. Newer gloves with better grip have been approved as of late but what the Chargers did was then add stick'um to the gloves they were already wearing.

 

[Rock Strongo]

How does equipment not regulate the game? If one team has inferior equipment doesn't that automatically put them at a disadvantage? I mean if I am using golf clubs from the 80's compared to another using equipment from today how is that fair?

Same with using equipment that is outside the parameters set by the league. Pretty sure science has shown that an underinflated football is an advantage in the in-game play.

its equiment

not a penalty

a penalty regulates in game play. footballs dont.

seriously...im ashamed i have to explain this.

 

[Manster7588]

deflate?

NO Deflect, deflect, deflect.

 

[Rock Strongo]

Right but players have been using gloves for quite some time. Newer gloves with better grip have been approved as of late but what the Chargers did was then add stick'um to the gloves they were already wearing.

they were, but not the design they swiped from FIFA. you can catch wind with those things.

the chargers were also wiping those towels on their DB's arms. it worked for lester hayes.

 

[cdumler7]

its equiment

not a penalty

a penalty regulates in game play. footballs dont.

seriously...im ashamed i have to explain this.

Seriously when the ball is the most important piece of equipment in the game how does it not regulate the game? The word regulate means to control and how the football is does change how the game is controlled. For a quarterback it allows them better grip for those with smaller hands, for a WR it makes the ball a bit softer making the bounce back less when the ball hits their hands, for a RB it makes it easier to hold onto the ball because of a tighter grip on the ball while running. So again how does all of that not amount to a person better being able to control the game?

 

[Rock Strongo]

Seriously when the ball is the most important piece of equipment in the game how does it not regulate the game? The word regulate means to control and how the football is does change how the game is controlled. For a quarterback it allows them better grip for those with smaller hands, for a WR it makes the ball a bit softer making the bounce back less when the ball hits their hands, for a RB it makes it easier to hold onto the ball because of a tighter grip on the ball while running. So again how does all of that not amount to a person better being able to control the game?

but if you let the QB's do what they want with them, it levels the playing field for everyone. its why brady and forehead wnet to the league in 07.

 

[cdumler7]

but if you let the QB's do what they want with them, it levels the playing field for everyone. its why brady and forehead wnet to the league in 07.

At this point Brady is the only one that has been shown to be doctoring the balls outside of the parameters set up by the league. yes they allow them to doctor the balls but only to a certain point. They still have to meet certain criteria and at this point Brady has shown he went beyond what was allowed and was trying to get an extra advantage that no other QB in the league was getting. Now you can say "everybody was doing it" but at this point we only have proof that one QB was doing it.

This is like the rule of speeding on the highway. You can argue with the cops that everybody is doing it but if you are the one caught then you are still held responsible for your own actions. You might not agree with the rules but they are there and you are expected to abide by them. If you don't then you better be ready to man up to the consequences. AT this point Brady and it seems many Patriot fans are not willing to do that.

 

[Rock Strongo]

At this point Brady is the only one that has been shown to be doctoring the balls outside of the parameters set up by the league. yes they allow them to doctor the balls but only to a certain point. They still have to meet certain criteria and at this point Brady has shown he went beyond what was allowed and was trying to get an extra advantage that no other QB in the league was getting. Now you can say "everybody was doing it" but at this point we only have proof that one QB was doing it.

This is like the rule of speeding on the highway. You can argue with the cops that everybody is doing it but if you are the one caught then you are still held responsible for your own actions. You might not agree with the rules but they are there and you are expected to abide by them. If you don't then you better be ready to man up to the consequences. AT this point Brady and it seems many Patriot fans are not willing to do that.

how do you KNOW its 'outside the parameters" intentionally?

i think that gets lost on everyone.

you REALLY think its not possible brady asked these guys to take the approved, harder balls and quickly drop them to the 12.5 min...and they fucked it up horribly?

you should try it at home. take a needle to a hard football, release air and gauge it over and over til you hit 12.5. then try doing it without a gauge.

thats what these idiots did IMO.

 

[cdumler7]

how do you KNOW its 'outside the parameters" intentionally?

i think that gets lost on everyone.

you REALLY think its not possible brady asked these guys to take the approved, harder balls and quickly drop them to the 12.5 min...and they fucked it up horribly?

you should try it at home. take a needle to a hard football, release air and gauge it over and over til you hit 12.5. then try doing it without a gauge.

thats what these idiots did IMO.

I love that you say this is your opinion but then so many times you like to make the claim of this being fact. First off these guys are trained professionals. I mean these guys have made a true living by doing this for the Patriots so to say they were idiots is just flat out wrong. There are only 32 official main equipment guys in the entire world. These guys are the best at what they do and McNally knowing the Patriots is probably top-5 in the world at what he does. Throw in he doesn't do anything to that ball that Brady doesn't want him to do. You can't seriously think these guys acted without Brady knowing as the quickest way to get fired is piss off the most important player on the team.

Throw in if they messed it up as you put it then this was the 3rd game they messed up on the season. 3 teams complained about the balls the Patriots were using. How in the world does this guy still have a job unless this is being done on purpose? Throw in they can get every single one of these balls down to 12.5 before they hand them over the officials. They can use official gauges to make sure they are just perfect right on the edge. They work for a billion dollar company. Are they really going to skimp on getting a proper gauge for these guys to work with? Come on Rock use some common sense.

 

[Rock Strongo]

I love that you say this is your opinion but then so many times you like to make the claim of this being fact. First off these guys are trained professionals. I mean these guys have made a true living by doing this for the Patriots so to say they were idiots is just flat out wrong. There are only 32 official main equipment guys in the entire world. These guys are the best at what they do and McNally knowing the Patriots is probably top-5 in the world at what he does. Throw in he doesn't do anything to that ball that Brady doesn't want him to do. You can't seriously think these guys acted without Brady knowing as the quickest way to get fired is piss off the most important player on the team.

Throw in if they messed it up as you put it then this was the 3rd game they messed up on the season. 3 teams complained about the balls the Patriots were using. How in the world does this guy still have a job unless this is being done on purpose? Throw in they can get every single one of these balls down to 12.5 before they hand them over the officials. They can use official gauges to make sure they are just perfect right on the edge. They work for a billion dollar company. Are they really going to skimp on getting a proper gauge for these guys to work with? Come on Rock use some common sense.

can you just answer with a yes or no, or do you go off on a diatribe for every response?