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Suh's new contract??????

Dr. Evil-er

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No, he hasn't signed one. But it's been ask for so here it is. This is how the Lions pay him in the way he wants without destroying themselves.

The deal is 7yr/$115m. Avg. $16.43m. Guaranteed $54m. Signing bonus $30m. Other than the average amount those are better than even the Watt contract.

When the Watt deal was announced it sounded ridiculous and would therefore make it next to impossible for the Lions to be even close to competitive in what they could offer. But no one had really seen the terms yet. It's a strange structure but one that the Texans can completely walk away from after the 2018 season with no issue at all. The three years left are entirely paid as salary. At best its a 5yr deal starting here in 2014 and it would pay him $62m over those five years.

That changes things in a HUGE way. While the Lions have still dug themselves in a hole with the piss poor way that they have done things in the past this is not an overly complicated deal to get done, unless Suh simply does not want to be here.


I will make it very simple to understand with just his salary, the cap hit, the Dead $ we are carrying and the cumulative amount Suh has actually been paid as he plays through the contract. The dead $ is what you have entering the season and what it would cost to cut him then. For these purposes I am going to include the guaranteed money at first until it is fully satisfied, which comes after the third year of the deal. Don't confuse guaranteed $ and dead $, they are not the same and amortize differently.

Year 1 = Salary $2m Cap Hit $17.7m Dead $63.7m Paid to Suh $32m
Year 2 = Salary $8m Cap Hit $14m Dead $45m Paid to Suh $40m
Year 3 = Salary $8m Cap Hit $14m Dead $29m Paid to Suh $48m

You should note that after 3 years of the new Watt deal he has been paid only $41m.

Year 4 = Salary $11m Cap Hit $17m Dead $12m Paid to Suh $59m
Year 5 = Salary $11m Cap Hit $17m Dead $6m Paid to Suh $70m.

Not that is matters since they are essentially worthless but he would have a Year 6 salary of $17m plus a $3m roster bonus for a potential cap hit of $20m and a Year 7 salary of $20m and a $5m roster bonus for potential cap hit of $25m. You might ask why even both to make it a 7 year deal? Good question. The answer is all about ego, player ego. Notice how the Watt contract lists as $100m? The first defensive player to get a $100m contract. Despite the absolutely meaningless final couple years that he will never get paid. The Lions cater to Suh's ego with a $115m deal, also with meaningless years.

After 5 years JJ Watt has only been paid $62m and now both the Texans and Lions are free to walk away from these deals with no negative consequences. If The Clown Show doesn't mess around with the original structure of the deal you would never have a cap hit above $17m, other than next year because of the completely retarded $9.7m they have managed to still be carrying.

I originally thought that walking away from the table with Suh was the best option as the season began but I no longer do. This is something they need to get done right now. There is even room to reduce those numbers given that they are substantially better than the Watt contract.

This is the wrong time for LewanDUI to try and play hardball. He's been getting bitch slapped for years by every agent in the business for meaningless players and this one really matters.

Anybody dumb enough to take the position that this will actually get done despite it being pretty easy to do??
 

LPinSLC

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Suh wants to become a brand. Detroit is not the easiest place to accomplish that. However, the media attention that he would receive from such a contract would be some great advertising.

I don't know that it would have to be that much more than Watt as long as he gets the title highest paid defensive player ever. I agree that the majority of these ridiculous contracts ever get paid in full and this one can be no exception. Back end loaded with a team option of terminating the contract without any dead money.

Always interesting to get your opinion on cap issues. Welcome back.
 

broncosmitty

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Id still like to think a deal gets done. I doubt it will be that friendly to the Lions, but Im dumb enough to hope so.
 

gvsulaker82

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If the deal isnt done the lions make a huge mistake. He will be the most dominant DT for the next five years. These are the players that cannot be let go. The lions need to make the playoffs for suh to return.
 

Neb4life

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If the deal isnt done the lions make a huge mistake. He will be the most dominant DT for the next five years. These are the players that cannot be let go. The lions need to make the playoffs for suh to return.

:nod::agree:
 

Old Lion

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If the Lions decide to decline, it may have something to do with switching to a 3-4. I agree that Suh walking away from a deal like that would have more to do with not wanting to be here than the money issue.

Not willing to break the bank for a DT. Happy to keep him if the numbers work out.
 

gandydancer

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Trying to not create a ulcer...I will just let this play out.


I love Suh and want him to stay, don 't want to break the bank just because I love him. While there will be a cost savings from him leaving. I do not trust Mayhew to use money in right places, so therefore just rather keep Suh and be fucked almost.


Can not say what will happen in Allen Park with extra money. They are clueless already. prolly spend it on some top rate center...
 

gvsulaker82

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If the Lions decide to decline, it may have something to do with switching to a 3-4. I agree that Suh walking away from a deal like that would have more to do with not wanting to be here than the money issue.

Not willing to break the bank for a DT. Happy to keep him if the numbers work out.[/QUOT



If he's the main reason your team has a top five defense at years end you still wouldn't? Not saying they will finish that well, but imagine suh with a good secondary. He has turned the lions run defense into an elite force from a laughingstock
 

jdwills126

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:clap:

You have done a good job of breaking down a somewhat workable contract.

It just does not take into account Suh!

The guy seems hell bent on testing the FA market and you will find an owner as dumb as Snyder, willing to make him an outrageous offer the Lions can't match. See Albert Haynesworth.

IMO the way Suh handled his agent, the negotiations he wants out. Maybe I am wrong but if your looking out for yourself and want to be on the most competitive team you rework your deal to get some FA help. It's a business and if he wants to test those waters more power to him I just hope he realizes in the cities that can pay him the most you live under a intense microscope.
 

TrustMeIamRight

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If he's the main reason your team has a top five defense at years end you still wouldn't? Not saying they will finish that well, but imagine suh with a good secondary. He has turned the lions run defense into an elite force from a laughingstock

I would love to say is responsible for turning our defense into an elite run defense, but I can't get on board with that. The progression of Levy and the addition of Ansah and Taylor have helped the Lions become a great run defense.

Suh has been on the Lions for 5 years now. The Lions ranked in the 20's against the run and teams would simply run right at Suh. Levy becoming an outstanding LB last year and this year is the biggest transformation.
 

gandydancer

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If he's the main reason your team has a top five defense at years end you still wouldn't? Not saying they will finish that well, but imagine suh with a good secondary. He has turned the lions run defense into an elite force from a laughingstock

Is he the main reason? I would agree he is a huge part. It takes a team effort. The run defense is stout on both sides. Are you saying if Suh is gone the Lions suddenly are the bottom of barrel?

I am seeing contribution all over field stuffing the run. Not just on his side. Not seeing the wide 9 is surely a help there.
 

gandydancer

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I would love to say is responsible for turning our defense into an elite run defense, but I can't get on board with that. The progression of Levy and the addition of Ansah and Taylor have helped the Lions become a great run defense.

Suh has been on the Lions for 5 years now. The Lions ranked in the 20's against the run and teams would simply run right at Suh. Levy becoming an outstanding LB last year and this year is the biggest transformation.

Living up to your name finally IMO. Certainly one of your better thoughts in weeks.
 
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Dr. Evil-er

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You have done a good job of breaking down a somewhat workable contract.
It just does not take into account Suh!

I've taken him into account and that's why I say make the offer now. It is a better deal even than Watt's. He gets paid more, and by a fair amount. I designed it such that there was no question he was getting a better deal, it pays him $8m more over the first 5 years (which is all that matters in either contract).

If that was put on the table and he did not take it then you can conclude that without a doubt he doesn't want to play in Detroit. You can then green light his agent to find a trade partner and get a new contract done so he can be traded, which is our next best option.
 

jdwills126

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I've taken him into account and that's why I say make the offer now. It is a better deal even than Watt's. He gets paid more, and by a fair amount. I designed it such that there was no question he was getting a better deal, it pays him $8m more over the first 5 years (which is all that matters in either contract).

If that was put on the table and he did not take it then you can conclude that without a doubt he doesn't want to play in Detroit. You can then green light his agent to find a trade partner and get a new contract done so he can be traded, which is our next best option.

When I talk about taking Suh into account I mean his unpredictability. The man seems to want to be loved then just acts as if his actions shouldn't be scrutinized. Really like the stomp was just some misunderstanding?

I think he is a whole basket of crazy when it comes to expectations.
 

TrustMeIamRight

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amazing how smart you look when you dont mention a 10th pick or a TE

I so want to respond. I'm a little upset about the Tigers debacle in the 8th though. So don't have the heart.
 

TrustMeIamRight

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You guys take these teams losing to serious.

Sports are never live or die.

I said I was upset about the Tigers losing -- I didn't say I was going to jump off a bridge or anything.:pound:
 

gandydancer

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I said I was upset about the Tigers losing -- I didn't say I was going to jump off a bridge or anything.:pound:

It apparently changed your mindset enough to not comment to me...

All season the bull pen was weakest link. Why after game 164 would you ever get upset?

Shit Captain Obvious could see this shit coming.
 

TrustMeIamRight

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Because I hated seeing them pull Sanchez. Chamberlain has been terrible since the All-Star break. He wasn't good yesterday and no idea why they would bring him back out again today, when Sanchez had only thrown 28 pitches and was doing great.

It hurts now because it is the playoffs. You blow a game in the regular season -- it isn't the end of the season. Only 5 teams have come back from a 2-0 deficit to win a 5 game series. Odds aren't on the Tigers side.
 

Gulf of Brazil

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Great workup on a possible contract, Dr. Evil-er. It's very much appreciated by all on the Board.

I can see Suh receiving that type of a contract from someone. I just don't want it to be the Lions. I know many in here want him regardless and they'll state, "he's the face of this defense." Do you really want to see the ass-hat's spend that much money on a DT ? Many, I assume, will say HELL YES. I'm not sure if any of you are aware that he finally signed with Roc Nation Entertainment management company in September. Ndamukong Su signs with Roc Nation, joins Jay Z's star-studded roster - UPI.com...... This just leads me to believe two things. 1) He gave his price to stay in Detroit, probably exorbitantly high, and Lewand/Mayhew took a pass. 2) He's had plans all along to test the FA market and truly hopes to land in New York. Maybe his reasoning is all business and not about winning a championship. He has had many meetings with Warren Buffett and seems to be driven solely by the good old capitalism. Think about it for a minute. Let's say, for hypothetical purposes, he receives a contract, like Dr. Evil laid out, to play for the NYG or NYJ. If he goes to NY, he's far more likely to get a helluva lot more endorsements there than in the Big D. Jay-Z and his firm will market the shit out of Suh more than likely netting him quite a few millions of dollars per year. Fugger's in NYC would love his type of persona, especially while playing for a local team, not to mention possibly adding another 4-8 million a year in endorsements, maybe even waaaay more than that. You can't blame Suh should he choose this route.

My main obstacle is this. Stafford and CJ both will be over 21 mil per yr in cap hits for years 2016 and 2017, not to mention some pretty significant increases in many other players. Put aside cap increases for a minute. Adding Suh to Stafford and CJ, even tho Suh's cap hits are for 14 mil each of those years using Dr. Evil-er's contract, still puts us in a bind for FA signings. We already know we'll need two more CB's. Mathis is 34 and maybe get we get another year from him or not. Slay is still unproven but has shown quite a bit of progress. Many Lion's fans have clamored for that #1 CB from FA. How are you going to do that by keeping Suh, not to mention CJ Mosley and Fairley are FA's after this year. I looked at next years projected salary cap space without Suh, plus 16 other FA's, and we were about 119 mil with 36 player's signed through at least 2015. Remember, after this season, we'll need a LG, C, 3 DT's, LS, 2 FB, 2 CB's, OT, 2 QB's, S, LB, 1 WR, KR. That's 17 positions that need to be filled. Maybe the cap increases to 145 mil. Rookies will cost about 6 mil for next year.

I'm just saying, Suh is not a fit FINANCIALLY for the LIONS. JMO. Maybe this is why Mayhew is in the Win Now Mode, knowing Suh is gone. IDK, all above is merely my opinion.
 
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