Robinson Cano's struggles

[seahawksfan234]

I've been quite busy lately so I haven't had time to be on the forum as frequently, but scrolling through the threads I don't see any mention of this.

I feel like Robbie is given a lot of slack because of his ridiculously impressive credentials, but let's be honest here, he is struggling.

Last year, he had an impressive year at the plate by most standards, but we saw a serious regression in his home run totals. USSMariner did a piece that showed his average fly ball was significantly shorter than it was the year previously, the decline in HR totals was not a huge deal due to his offsetting BA/OBP numbers and his solid defense.

But this year, the drop in HRs has continued, and now his BA/OBP is significantly lower and his strikeout rate has increased as well. Shouldn't having Cruz behind him be beneficial? He has "protection" now in the lineup. Last year Cano struck out 68 times and walked 61 times. This year, he is on pace to strike out 116 times, and walk only 37 times.

Perhaps someone can shed some light on this. Throughout his career, Cano has been a very consistent hitter and I'm unaware of any 35 game stretch in his career in which he hit this poorly.

Should this be something to worry about?

 

[blstoker]

I've been quite busy lately so I haven't had time to be on the forum as frequently, but scrolling through the threads I don't see any mention of this.

I feel like Robbie is given a lot of slack because of his ridiculously impressive credentials, but let's be honest here, he is struggling.

Last year, he had an impressive year at the plate by most standards, but we saw a serious regression in his home run totals. USSMariner did a piece that showed his average fly ball was significantly shorter than it was the year previously, the decline in HR totals was not a huge deal due to his offsetting BA/OBP numbers and his solid defense.

But this year, the drop in HRs has continued, and now his BA/OBP is significantly lower and his strikeout rate has increased as well. Shouldn't having Cruz behind him be beneficial? He has "protection" now in the lineup. Last year Cano struck out 68 times and walked 61 times. This year, he is on pace to strike out 116 times, and walk only 37 times.

Perhaps someone can shed some light on this. Throughout his career, Cano has been a very consistent hitter and I'm unaware of any 35 game stretch in his career in which he hit this poorly.

Should this be something to worry about?

I wouldn't be too concerned about it yet, his numbers last year weren't exactly huge either after 35 games.

2014 35-G 139-AB 16-R 40-H 6-2B 1-3B 1-HR 19-RBI 2-SB 12-BB 6-IBB 20-K .289-BA .342-OBP .367-SLG .709-OPS
2015 35-G 142-AB 18-R 38-H 12-2B 0-3B 1-HR 11-RBI 1-SB 8-BB 1-IBB 25-K .268-BA .309-OBP .373-SLG .682-OPS

The numbers are similar, but he is hitting more doubles and actually is walking more (had 6 non intentional walks last year and 7 this year), Cruz is just keeping people from intentionally walking him. We'll see if he rebounds like he did last year as the season goes on.

 

[NWinAZ]

Problem for me with his stats over the last 2 years at this point in the season is you are paying $240M for him producing 4 out of 6 months even if/when he does turn it around. And we still have 8.5 years left and he won't be getting better long term.

I still would have wanted an all-in attempt to get Altuve who I thought was a better fit for this team. I just really liked his game even before his breakout year last year. That would have also saved about $200M that could have replaced whatever it would have taken to get him (Walker and Ackley?). Oh well, Jack knows what he is doing.

 

[SeattleCoug]

I've noticed it for sure. Not sure why he is expanding the zone as much as he is. I think the main reason it hasn't been brought is because there are so many other offensive issues with Zunino, Ackley, Jackson and Taylor. The thing is he is performing at a an average players level. This team just can't afford him to be average to succeed. He needs to great. The same goes for Seagar.

 

[unlvmariners]

I've noticed it for sure. Not sure why he is expanding the zone as much as he is. I think the main reason it hasn't been brought is because there are so many other offensive issues with Zunino, Ackley, Jackson and Taylor. The thing is he is performing at a an average players level. This team just can't afford him to be average to succeed. He needs to great. The same goes for Seagar.

Agree.

I know Cano's power number were brought up earlier. My only comment on that is I think Cano will be a 20 homer guy at best for the Mariners and will likely be more of a 10-15 home run guy. That said I would rather him be hitting for a huge avg. and high obp. Just get on base and move runners around for Cruz and Seager to drive them in.

The Mariners seem to hit a ton of solo home runs. Home runs are nice but they are nicer when guys are on base.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Stats report: What's wrong with Seattle Mariners' Robinson Cano? - SweetSpot - ESPN

Cano vs. offspeed pitches:

2011: .294/.301/.560

2012: .333/.377/.598

2013: .316/.358/.608

2014: .279/.298/.466

2015: .194/.206/.323

But is it just struggles against offspeed stuff? Not necessarily. In looking through his numbers, Cano has never been a great fastball hitter. From 2011-2013, he ranked 96th in the majors in wOBA against fastballs, sandwiched between Nate Schierholtz and Desmond Jennings. In 2014, he ranked 44th, with a .377 woBA against fastball. So far in 2015, he ranks 112th with a .338 wOBA. His strikeout rate against fastballs is 15.8 percent, up from 6.9 percent a year ago.

Speculating here: Is he cheating against the fastball, either trying to jack one out or -- scary thought for Mariners fans -- because the bat speed is slowing down? And is cheating against the fastball leaving him vulnerable to the breaking ball?

 

[NWinAZ]

Another article on Cano and his struggles from Lookout Landing. Long winded, but worth a look.

The one big red flag with Robinson Cano's slow start - Lookout Landing

 

[WizardHawk]

Cano is in a slump, this is true. We have half the damned team in a slump and none of them are hitting anywhere near .250. I'll take Cano's slump over any one else's on the team every day of the week.

Didn't he have a bad May and June in '13? and still ended up over .300 for the season I believe.

If anyone expect him to all of a sudden get the power numbers he had back several years ago they are in for a disappointment. I don't see that happening. But I really doubt he ends up lower than .295 by seasons end.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Cano is in a slump, this is true. We have half the damned team in a slump and none of them are hitting anywhere near .250. I'll take Cano's slump over any one else's on the team every day of the week.

Didn't he have a bad May and June in '13? and still ended up over .300 for the season I believe.

If anyone expect him to all of a sudden get the power numbers he had back several years ago they are in for a disappointment. I don't see that happening. But I really doubt he ends up lower than .295 by seasons end.

I don't care about the power.

I just want him to hit above .300, continue playing good defense, hit around 10-20 HRs and drive in 80-100 guys. Are we massively overpaying for that? Sure, but he was still arguably the best 2B in baseball last year (Yes, AZ I know you love Altuve).

Here are Cano's stats for May 1st 2013 through June 30th 2013.

55 G 10 HR 31 RBI 27 BB 32 Ks .265/.356/.450

 

[seahawksfan234]

Through this date last year, Robbie was hitting .318/.366/.406 with 1 HR and 24 RBIs, 21 Ks, 14 walks. That was through 43 games.

Through 37 this year he has 1 HR 11 RBIs, .253/.294/.353 with 27 Ks and 8 walks

As the lookout landing article suggests, Robbie needs to adjust and stop swinging at pitches outside the zone because it's not going as well for him this year. He has the ability to do so.

 

[redseat]

he may be in a slump but lets not forget the pressure he is on.... he was brought in to "save" the Mariners and is the face of the team, no? I don't care who you are thats a huge role to fill. Also isnt Seattle a bigger park than Yankee stadium?

 

[NWinAZ]

As the lookout landing article suggests, Robbie needs to adjust and stop swinging at pitches outside the zone because it's not going as well for him this year. He has the ability to do so.

Which he did again in his first AB tonight.

 

[wazzu31]

he may be in a slump but lets not forget the pressure he is on.... he was brought in to "save" the Mariners and is the face of the team, no? I don't care who you are thats a huge role to fill. Also isnt Seattle a bigger park than Yankee stadium?

Felix is the face of the team.

And Safeco Field should be a better average park for Cano, Yankee Stadium help elevate his homerun totals but the huge RC gap are suppose to be ideal for a guy with his approach.

 

[cezero]

No, Cano is not the face of the franchise, and yes, Cano showed last year that he can hit just fine at Safeco.

He isn't hitting well anywhere right now, hence the discussion the team's fans are having.

 

[redseat]

Yeah I know Felix is but isn't Cano as well? I figured he would be going to Seattle. But you guys see him everyday so you know a lot better than I

 

[seahawksfan234]

he may be in a slump but lets not forget the pressure he is on.... he was brought in to "save" the Mariners and is the face of the team, no? I don't care who you are thats a huge role to fill. Also isnt Seattle a bigger park than Yankee stadium?

He didn't give in to that pressure last year.

Also, I'd imagine the pressures of playing in New York for the Yankees would be 500x greater than playing in Seattle.

 

[seahawksfan234]

Yeah I know Felix is but isn't Cano as well? I figured he would be going to Seattle. But you guys see him everyday so you know a lot better than I

Felix would be the face of the franchise, primarily due to the fact that he has been around longer and has been the best pitcher in the American league since 2009. In addition, we love him for the fact that he is ridiculously competitive, loves this city and this franchise and wants to stay here. He signed a big contract, but he arguably could've got a lot more if he hit free agency. He has stuck it through with this team through so much shit and his loyalty resonates with the fans.

As far as the argument about Cano going to Safeco being the reason for his decrease in home runs, he hit 9 HRs at Safeco last year, in comparison to 5 on the road.

In 2013, he hit 16 HRs on the road, 11 in Yankee stadium.

His power totals are not just decreased because of the stadium he plays in, they're decreased across the board. His average fly ball doesn't carry as much as it used to, and now he's not hitting pitches outside of the zone as well as he used to. He used to be able to get away with swinging at pitches outside the zone, now he's not having much success at that anymore, and as a result he needs to adjust.

 

[NWinAZ]

Just thinking about this, but didn't Cano come into camp 20 lbs lighter because he said in NY he would add weight before start of season because he would lose 20 the first month because of the heat and that didn't happen last year for him in Seattle.

He looks weak with his swing. Just no pop.

 

[SeattleCoug]

He is looking to challenge Ackley for most rollovers to 2nd base.

 

[NWinAZ]

...But true.