Retire, Kelce

[Clayton]

I had similar thoughts. Remember a game against Bengals, which the Bengals won by keeping Mahomes inside the hash marks. He got sacked several times and was rattled all game long.

There have been a lot of games since the Bengals gave him trouble. The Bengals did a spy and dropped everyone into zone IIRC. The spy and the Bengals DT gave just enough issues as Mahomes scrambled.

I think the big issue was the Eagles just simply beat the Chiefs LT and RT on a consistent basis. Mahomes HAD to scramble. Joe Thuney is a guard. He was faking it at LT and the Eagles had 2 weeks to prep on that. Eagles had 2 early plays where they blew up the Chiefs off the right edge IIRC.

KC noticed that the Eagles defenses was faking coverage and used it to win the SB 2 years ago. Eagles almost certainly noticed KCs oline tendencies had major issues.

I haven't looked over the SB yet but what Im hearing is that Kelce cant beat man coverage anymore and is just good against zone. Not a deal breaker but it also means that he shouldn't be a focus of the offense if he doesnt retire.

 

[Cincyfan78]

There have been a lot of games since the Bengals gave him trouble. The Bengals did a spy and dropped everyone into zone IIRC. The spy and the Bengals DT gave just enough issues as Mahomes scrambled.

I think the big issue was the Eagles just simply beat the Chiefs LT and RT on a consistent basis. Mahomes HAD to scramble. Joe Thuney is a guard. He was faking it at LT and the Eagles had 2 weeks to prep on that. Eagles had 2 early plays where they blew up the Chiefs off the right edge IIRC.

KC noticed that the Eagles defenses was faking coverage and used it to win the SB 2 years ago. Eagles almost certainly noticed KCs oline tendencies had major issues.

I haven't looked over the SB yet but what Im hearing is that Kelce cant beat man coverage anymore and is just good against zone. Not a deal breaker but it also means that he shouldn't be a focus of the offense if he doesnt retire.

Yep - Lou is big on the rush 4, drop 7 scheme. It works if you can do 2 things:

1 - Edge control. Must keep them inside the pocket.
2 - At least some pressure from the DT's to help collapse the pocket some.

 

[Cincyfan78]

To add - when you can get both of those things from your DL - you really limit the need for additional players to add pressure to the QB's. Forcing them to step up already makes most QB's uncomfortable as they don't know where the defenders are once they are to the side, and behind. Unlike when they are able to roll out, see where defenders typically are chasing them and then have options to run, pass, or throw it away. Most QB's don't prefer to run right up the gut on those kinds of things.

One of the reasons the Bengals D has struggled is that Hubbard got hurt opposite of Trey and has fallen off. That has hurt the ability of the DE's to maintain a solid edge/pressure. Then the loss of Reader to injury and then F/A - the Bengals haven't been able to replace that pressure up the middle that he was able to bring. When those guys were healthy, and prime - the defense was in the middle of the pack, and that was good enough for Burrow. Without those things, the defense faltered and Lou was unable to adapt over the past 1 1/2 years...so while I do think Lou is a fine DC, he has some shortcomings and I'm curious to see what the new DC is able to bring.

 

[Clayton]

Yep - Lou is big on the rush 4, drop 7 scheme. It works if you can do 2 things:

1 - Edge control. Must keep them inside the pocket.
2 - At least some pressure from the DT's to help collapse the pocket some.

And it is effective. Its just that the issue with the SB was different. The Eagles demolished the pocket and Mahomes had to run for his life. Basically the opposite.

 

[Cincyfan78]

And it is effective. Its just that the issue with the SB was different. The Eagles demolished the pocket and Mahomes had to run for his life. Basically the opposite.

They took that approach to the extreme. It's happened under Lou before - back when Hubbard was better and they had a healthy Reader...but, yeah - the Eagles took that game plan and executed it to near perfection with the amount of pressure they were able to generate.

Sometimes, all you can do is tip your cap to the other team.

 

[Clayton]

They took that approach to the extreme. It's happened under Lou before - back when Hubbard was better and they had a healthy Reader...but, yeah - the Eagles took that game plan and executed it to near perfection with the amount of pressure they were able to generate.

Sometimes, all you can do is tip your cap to the other team.

Honestly, I think they played relatively vanilla. Just tackles getting eaten alive

Although im looking at the PFF grades and they are giving the IDL the credit

 

[fightinfunbags]

They took that approach to the extreme. It's happened under Lou before - back when Hubbard was better and they had a healthy Reader...but, yeah - the Eagles took that game plan and executed it to near perfection with the amount of pressure they were able to generate.

Sometimes, all you can do is tip your cap to the other team.

I kind of likened it more to Burrow’s situation a couple years ago where the OL was just a sieve. The Eagles were relentless and credit due but there was a ton of Chiefs deficiency as well. They couldn’t protect him.

 

[Clayton]

The Eagles were relentless and credit due but there was a ton of Chiefs deficiency as well. They couldn’t protect him.

Which begs the question: why didnt the Texans or Bills figure that out?

Both have defensive head coaches

 

[fightinfunbags]

Which begs the question: why didnt the Texans or Bills figure that out?

Both have defensive head coaches

Correct. I don’t know that the Bills have the personnel but I thought the Texans pass rush was supposed to be a plus unit. I think Will Johnson had a good game but I don’t remember anyone else on their DL flashing.

 

[Clayton]

Correct. I don’t know that the Bills have the personnel but I thought the Texans pass rush was supposed to be a plus unit. I think Will Johnson had a good game but I don’t remember anyone else on their DL flashing.

Ed Oliver, the rusher formally known as Von Miller, Roussau, Milano.

But yes, the Texans should have been able to do what the Eagles did. Texans secondary is great. Texans got scorched by Kelce. Its baffling.