politics thread

[skinsdad62]

So again what about Hillary.

1. They are planning to unredact 20 pages out of 412 pages of the FISA warrant. If that aint cherry picking for effect, I dont know what is.

2. You are correct FISA warrants did not exist before 9/11. But since they have existed, they have never even partially been released to the public. And the reason for that is to protect procedure as well as assets. But now that Donny is in the crosshairs, we need limited transparency.

3. He has constantly been bemoaning how the DOJ should really be investigating Hillary and not any possible wrong doing he or his camp has done.

4. Muellers probe has leaked exactly ZERO. Which is what pisses Trump off the most. Because until Mueller does what he does, Trump has no idea its coming.

5. Trump vilifying Jeff Sessions for recusing himself is a direct request for Sessions to end the Russia Probe. And again he is more pissed that he cant fire Sessions or Mueller because either move WOULD bring about impeachment.


Trump also ordered the Justice Department to release text messages from a number of the key players in the Russia investigation "without redaction" -- including Ohr, Strzok, Lisa Page, former FBI Director James Comey and former FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe.

The 21 pages only make up a small part of the 412 pages of FISA applications and warrants related to Page released by the FBI earlier this year in heavily redacted format. The June 2017 application was the last of four filed by the Justice Department in support of FISA court orders allowing the monitoring of Page for nearly a year.

Trump orders feds to declassify key FISA documents, text messages in FBI Russia probe

The others have been released

 

[Sharkinva]

They committed huge crimes dude , sorry but you can’t do that

And we spent years, and MILLIONS of Dollars investigating those crimes. And I feel safe in saying you were cheering them on.

But now that they are looking into Trump, nothing to see here, dont even look. Right??

 

[Sharkinva]

The others have been released

412 pages have NOT been declassified. They are cherry picking 20-21 pages and the text messages that help the Presidents case. If they want REAL transparency, release them all, release the Cohen tapes. And then look into who committed crimes or not.

 

[skinsdad62]

412 pages have NOT been declassified. They are cherry picking 20-21 pages and the text messages that help the Presidents case. If they want REAL transparency, release them all, release the Cohen tapes. And then look into who committed crimes or not.

The initial wave has already been declassified

 

[Sharkinva]

The initial wave has already been declassified

Bullshit... None of it has been declassified. The full 412 pages was released in redacted form.

 

[skinsdad62]

We shall see I guess

 

[gkekoa]

I dont have a strong affirmative action opinion. That said, it is an attempted solution to a very real problem.

White privilege is not a myth. And the fact you realize that one race is benefitting more than another from schooling culture and respect from the law kind of proves that.

It is an attempted solution to a perceived problem today.

It is an absolute myth. How is it a privilege for whites to value education more than blacks? Blacks are more than capable of valuing education, and when they do, they are extremely successful. Blacks are more than capable of valuing family, whites are not too much better, but they choose not to. When they do, success. Blacks are more than capable of valuing the law, but don’t to a much greater degree. When they do though, success. If you want to be successful, value education, value family, follow the law, and don’t have children until you are in your mid 20s.

 

[Sharkinva]

It is an attempted solution to a perceived problem today.

It is an absolute myth. How is it a privilege for whites to value education more than blacks? Blacks are more than capable of valuing education, and when they do, they are extremely successful. Blacks are more than capable of valuing family, whites are not too much better, but they choose not to. When they do, success. Blacks are more than capable of valuing the law, but don’t to a much greater degree. When they do though, success. If you want to be successful, value education, value family, follow the law, and don’t have children until you are in your mid 20s.

Dude.. on the one hand you pound the table that we are a nation of laws that we should all believe in and obey.

On the other hand you rail against Affirmative action which is actually a law.

You also point out how blacks have less respect for the law than whites. But riddle me this....

If you knew, the most sacred laws of the land (the constitution) considered you not even human when they were written, at some point made you 3/5s of a man and then at some point actually granted you full human status... and even then took another damn near 100 years to grant you even remotely equal protection under the law....

How much respect, trust and reverence would you have for those laws??

 

[gkekoa]

Dude.. on the one hand you pound the table that we are a nation of laws that we should all believe in and obey.

On the other hand you rail against Affirmative action which is actually a law.

You also point out how blacks have less respect for the law than whites. But riddle me this....

If you knew, the most sacred laws of the land (the constitution) considered you not even human when they were written, at some point made you 3/5s of a man and then at some point actually granted you full human status... and even then took another damn near 100 years to grant you even remotely equal protection under the law....

How much respect, trust and reverence would you have for those laws??

Yes it is a law. It is an unConstitutional law. We are a nation of laws and the head of that is the fourteenth Amendment combined with the Civil Rights Act would and should prevent laws that favor one race over another.

I suggest you read what Frederick Douglas thought of the 3/5. Also, slaves were counted as 3/5...not black people. There is a difference.

Now, the laws we are really referencing such as theft, murder, r*pe, and drug charges have nothing to do with inequality.

 

[Sharkinva]

Yes it is a law. It is an unConstitutional law. We are a nation of laws and the head of that is the fourteenth Amendment combined with the Civil Rights Act would and should prevent laws that favor one race over another.

I suggest you read what Frederick Douglas thought of the 3/5. Also, slaves were counted as 3/5...not black people. There is a difference.

Now, the laws we are really referencing such as theft, murder, r*pe, and drug charges have nothing to do with inequality.

Actually the laws and how they are applied TODAY have everything to do with inequality. I know you are loath to admit it, but non whites are treated differently in our legal system than whites are. Why should I have ultimate faith in a legal system that more often than not decides my guilt on sight? For years republicans have been afraid the 2nd amendment would be some how changed or limited. I feel the same way about the 14th.. especially with a "conservative" supreme court.

 

[Stymietee]

So you are suggesting that because 5 people were unanimously convicted by a jury of 12peers for a crime that warrants the death penalty and a person with only the conviction wanted them executed, it is racist? What if the five people were white and he still wanted the death penalty, is he still racist?

Why would he apologize for something he had nothing to do with?

Are you familiar with the story? I'll assume so and move on.

1. I question the use of "his peers" in this country, I'll also question the system of juris prudence in this country when the "defendant" is not of a certain demographic. You can determine what that happens to be.

2. Trump is a known racist, but, to give him the benefit of doubt, a racist sympathizer at minimum. That's what makes him what he is. ANY fair minded person would not have jumped to the conclusion that he did and reinforced his determination with full page newspaper declarations of the same. Even after their complete exoneration he fell silent.

3. They weren't what you refer to as "white." BTW: there's no evidence that Trump has ever gone after someone who fit your alternative description. He should apologize because he inflamed potential jurors with his full page declarations, potentially poisoned minds and affirmed like minds with his BS. Now I suspect that your retort will be that there's no evidence that minds were or had been affected, but C'mon man, you know better.

 

[gkekoa]

Actually the laws and how they are applied TODAY have everything to do with inequality. I know you are loath to admit it, but non whites are treated differently in our legal system than whites are. Why should I have ultimate faith in a legal system that more often than not decides my guilt on sight? For years republicans have been afraid the 2nd amendment would be some how changed or limited. I feel the same way about the 14th.. especially with a "conservative" supreme court.

Are non-whites treated differently or does it have to do with green?

More often than not? Really?

In what way do you fear it will be changed?

 

[Sharkinva]

Are non-whites treated differently or does it have to do with green?

More often than not? Really?

In what way do you fear it will be changed?

I think they will strip things like a woman's right to choose, Affirmative action, rights of gays and a few others. All things I know you are staunchly against, so no big loss in your book.

And yes non whites are treated differently in the legal system.

 

[gkekoa]

Are you familiar with the story? I'll assume so and move on.

1. I question the use of "his peers" in this country, I'll also question the system of juris prudence in this country when the "defendant" is not of a certain demographic. You can determine what that happens to be.

2. Trump is a known racist, but, to give him the benefit of doubt, a racist sympathizer at minimum. That's what makes him what he is. ANY fair minded person would not have jumped to the conclusion that he did and reinforced his determination with full page newspaper declarations of the same. Even after their complete exoneration he fell silent.

3. They weren't what you refer to as "white." BTW: there's no evidence that Trump has ever gone after someone who fit your alternative description. He should apologize because he inflamed potential jurors with his full page declarations, potentially poisoned minds and affirmed like minds with his BS. Now I suspect that your retort will be that there's no evidence that minds were or had been affected, but C'mon man, you know better.

1- Feel free to question it. Just don’t claim things to be fact when they are opinion. I am not saying you do this.

2- Give me a personal definition of a racist. What makes an individual a racist? So after a conviction, you don’t think it is OK to assume guilt? That confuses me. I will make a blanket statement here. I think all people convicted of first degree murder should be executed. If you are later exonerated, I will not apologize.

3- I may be getting my posts confused. I thought we were talking about Trump making a statement after a conviction. Nah...my response would be should Obama have said Trayvon could have been his kid?

 

[gkekoa]

I think they will strip things like a woman's right to choose, Affirmative action, rights of gays and a few others. All things I know you are staunchly against, so no big loss in your book.

And yes non whites are treated differently in the legal system.

A woman’s right to choose...strip away because we are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights and among those are LIFE. Life is an actual right. That being said, I doubt they touch it.

Affirmative action, as I have shown on numerous occasions, is the only law on the books that is discriminatory.

Which rights of gays? I am interested.

How so?

 

[Sharkinva]

A woman’s right to choose...strip away because we are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights and among those are LIFE. Life is an actual right. That being said, I doubt they touch it.

I dont, as Trump promised to appoint SCOTUS who would overturn Roe V Wade.

Affirmative action, as I have shown on numerous occasions, is the only law on the books that is discriminatory.

The only reason you think it is discriminatory is because it does not directly benefit you. And the fact is, it was put in place to make discrimination against non whites illegal. Most Affirmative action cases that come to the courts are in fact cases where some one HAS been discriminated against based on their race, religion or sexual orientation. Sorry if I dont feel sorry for the discriminated against 65% of the population that likely WONT get fired or not hired based on their skin color, religion or sex/sexual preference.

Which rights of gays? I am interested.

The right to marry, the right to adopt children (yes that was illegal a few years back), the right to will their property to said spouse (yes this too was illegal and subject to challenge as few as ten years ago).

How so?

We been over this, but non whites get longer sentences, arrested more, profiled while driving and for fuck sake walking. And your demagogue had the audacity to pardon a racist sheriff allowing this man to run for political office this year.

 

[Stymietee]

1- Feel free to question it. Just don’t claim things to be fact when they are opinion. I am not saying you do this.

2- Give me a personal definition of a racist. What makes an individual a racist? So after a conviction, you don’t think it is OK to assume guilt? That confuses me. I will make a blanket statement here. I think all people convicted of first degree murder should be executed. If you are later exonerated, I will not apologize.

3- I may be getting my posts confused. I thought we were talking about Trump making a statement after a conviction. Nah...my response would be should Obama have said Trayvon could have been his kid?

1. pass

2. A racist is one who subscribes to and supports a system of racism.

2A. He took out those ads prior to trial, once identified, he called them "animals" and "thugs" (sound familiar) he then doubled down on them after the trial. I'm not sure why there's a need to put such a slant as "after conviction" here.

2B. Really?? even as technology is proving that there are plenty of people wrongly convicted of murder? Well, alright then!

3. your word..."confused"

 

[gkekoa]

I dont, as Trump promised to appoint SCOTUS who would overturn Roe V Wade.

The only reason you think it is discriminatory is because it does not directly benefit you. And the fact is, it was put in place to make discrimination against non whites illegal. Most Affirmative action cases that come to the courts are in fact cases where some one HAS been discriminated against based on their race, religion or sexual orientation. Sorry if I dont feel sorry for the discriminated against 65% of the population that likely WONT get fired or not hired based on their skin color, religion or sex/sexual preference.

The right to marry, the right to adopt children (yes that was illegal a few years back), the right to will their property to said spouse (yes this too was illegal and subject to challenge as few as ten years ago).

We been over this, but non whites get longer sentences, arrested more, profiled while driving and for fuck sake walking. And your demagogue had the audacity to pardon a racist sheriff allowing this man to run for political office this year.

Before it can be overturned, they have to put it on the docket. And like I said, even if they did, they would finally get it right.

No, it is discriminatory because it literally discriminates based on race and sex. It is right there in the wording. It discriminates against men and whites.

These won’t be touched.

Yes we have. What did Arapaio do to be in jail? He never should have been. Why didn’t Obama push for reform and try to take care of the perceived injustices? Could they simply be perceived?

 

[ehb5]

It is an attempted solution to a perceived problem today.

It is an absolute myth. How is it a privilege for whites to value education more than blacks? Blacks are more than capable of valuing education, and when they do, they are extremely successful. Blacks are more than capable of valuing family, whites are not too much better, but they choose not to. When they do, success. Blacks are more than capable of valuing the law, but don’t to a much greater degree. When they do though, success. If you want to be successful, value education, value family, follow the law, and don’t have children until you are in your mid 20s.

So ignoring the fact we have evidence that theres more to it than "they just don't care enough and value the right things"...

Why do YOU think they don't value education and that their culture is not as good? What is the cause of that?

 

[gkekoa]

1. pass

2. A racist is one who subscribes to and supports a system of racism.

2A. He took out those ads prior to trial, once identified, he called them "animals" and "thugs" (sound familiar) he then doubled down on them after the trial. I'm not sure why there's a need to put such a slant as "after conviction" here.

2B. Really?? even as technology is proving that there are plenty of people wrongly convicted of murder? Well, alright then!

3. your word..."confused"

2- come on Sty. You can do better. What does one have to do to be racist? What ads? I do not know this case apparently. I have no problem with calling people animals or thugs. After conviction is rather big.

People can be wrongly convicted. It is a rarity.